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Thread: Scope Advice

  1. #1

    Default Scope Advice

    I'm replacing the scope on my .338 Mag. getting ready for a brown bear hunt in May. I had a Bushnell Elite 3200 for the last two years, but it it wouldn't hold a zero and the 1/4 moa adjustments were inaccurate and inconsistent. Sometimes 8 clicks would move it half an inch and other times it would move it nearly half a foot, and the scope was securely mounted and I was very stable (does anyone else seem to have problems with scopes that are suppose to be 1/4 moa not moving a 1/4" at 100 yards? I have tried both Bushnell Elite 3200's and Leupold VX-II's and both have failed in this regard).
    Anyways, I ordered a Cabela's Alaska Guide Premuim scope but it on backorder for now. I was wondering if I should instead try a Bushnell Elite 4200 model. I like the design and layout of the Bushnell Elites better than the Leupolds, but was wondering how much better the 3-9X40 Elite 4200 model would be compared with the same in a 3200 model (which I've already tried). I don't know anyone who uses a Elite 4200, and it looks real similar to the 3200 models but costs $100 more, so it must be built better. Does anyone know the specifics? Any help in this scope decision would be appreciated. Thanks

  2. #2
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    I would suggest you taking a look at the Burris Signature Series. Get the best rings you can afford and lap them. Never again will you worry about holding zero. Top notch stuff man. Made in the USA and comes with a lifetime "Burris Forever" warranty. Check out Midway USA, Cabelas, and Midsouth Shooters for models/prices.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

  3. #3
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    dan,
    good advice to this gent who is inquiring about a possible scope.

    akhunter,
    cancel your order with cabelas and just go ahead with a burris from one of the online sources. Burris uses 14 psi springs which is about twice as strong as the springs in most scopes. Stay away from the timberline series though, because they have no tube for adjustments of the scope forward or rearward. The tube is just too short. My father used an elite for years and was miserable with it so I'm sure he could relate to your bad experience with your scope. http://www.swfa.com/pc-8158-358-burr...fle-scope.aspx

    That 1.5-6 has a 30 mm tube for a massive field of view on the lower power setting. The field of view is almost twice as wide as your current model. I think the posi-lock device is over kill, but with your old scope not keeping zero.....you prob. wouldnt mind. I mean.....you are hunting brown bear so why not have a fail safe setup? If that one is a little too pricey you could go with the fullfield 30 mm tubed scope. pick up some warne or talley rings and hit the range.

  4. #4
    Member pinehavensredrocket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ak hunter View Post
    I'm replacing the scope on my .338 Mag. getting ready for a brown bear hunt in May. I had a Bushnell Elite 3200 for the last two years, but it it wouldn't hold a zero and the 1/4 moa adjustments were inaccurate and inconsistent. Sometimes 8 clicks would move it half an inch and other times it would move it nearly half a foot, and the scope was securely mounted and I was very stable (does anyone else seem to have problems with scopes that are suppose to be 1/4 moa not moving a 1/4" at 100 yards? I have tried both Bushnell Elite 3200's and Leupold VX-II's and both have failed in this regard).
    Anyways, I ordered a Cabela's Alaska Guide Premuim scope but it on backorder for now. I was wondering if I should instead try a Bushnell Elite 4200 model. I like the design and layout of the Bushnell Elites better than the Leupolds, but was wondering how much better the 3-9X40 Elite 4200 model would be compared with the same in a 3200 model (which I've already tried). I don't know anyone who uses a Elite 4200, and it looks real similar to the 3200 models but costs $100 more, so it must be built better. Does anyone know the specifics? Any help in this scope decision would be appreciated. Thanks
    my advice is to buy yourself a fixed power scope and say goodby to all those adjustment & zero problems. i see you have had probs with leupold but they are the most popular scope extent (and for good reason).

    high power is overrated and unnessary. get the least power you need not the biggest you can afford and you and your rifle will be happy.
    happy trails.
    jh

  5. #5

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    Thanks for the advice. I've been looking at the Burris website and reading what reviews I could find. I don't really want to spend $480 minimum for a 3-12X44 Signature model and I don't need the extra magnification either. I'm interested in purchasing a Fullfield II 3-9X40mm scope (model #: 200161) for my Browning A-Bolt .338 Mag. In reading what reviews I could find on this scope, there were only a few regarding it being mounted on a .338 Mag. and having to deal with the greater recoil while keeping a zero. With a street price of about $200, is this scope designed for a .338 Mags. recoil and will it hold up and stayed zeroed or do I need to purchase a more expensive Burris scope (i.e. Signature Series)? Thank you for telling me about the short tube length on the Tiberline models. I see that the scope is 12.2 inches long, but how long is the actual tube where the rings would be mounted for the Fullfields? Is it long enough to mount on my A-Bolt (long-action) using two piece bases (picatinny style), or would it be to short? Thank you for your time and help with this decision.

  6. #6
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    I would prefer the Signature but understand how price effects decisions like these. I would compare the warranty. If the Fullfield has the lifetime warranty, I say go for it. I have not had one in years, but I had the Fullfield on my Weatherby 300 with no problems at all. Perfect operation for a few years before getting the Signature Series. I would suggest getting the best rings you can find. I have had great luck with the Burris Signature Rings. Likely a different name by now, this was a few years back. But awesome rings. And consider lapping them as well. The kit from Midway is about $30 and takes less than an hour to do. Very simple process. Torque the screws to the recommended in/lbs and you would be set in my opinion.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

  7. #7
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    I tend to lean towards Pinehavens logic of variables. I've experienced 5 Leupolds that needed warranty work.......not neglect mind you. In my 52 short yrs. on planet Earth this is enough, I am going to send 3 of 4 back to them and of course there no BS warranty is good. I now have a Leupold M8 3x fixed and trust I'll favor it down the road on my 9.3x64. I have done well with low power magnification on variables on my medium magnums and don't see the need of higher magnification....enough doubt on variables going to crap.

    Schmidt&Bender make a nice 4x fixed, Leupold does the 4x fixed etc.......

    oh well...just my .02

    best regards

  8. #8

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    According to the Burris website, the Fullfield II line has the same "Forever Warranty" as all there scopes. It also has the same waterproof/fogproof/shockproof treatment and testing procedure. And it uses the same glass and aluminum as the Signature series (just thinner lenes and 1" tubes instead of 30mm). The Fullfield II's also have the double internal springs, but doesn't offer the posi-lock option (I would have to pay a lot more and get a Signature Series scope for that).
    It seems like a Fullfield II model in 3-9X40mm would be a good choice, and would hopefully hold a zero. I believe I will cancel the Cabelas AK Guide Premium scope that is on back order with Cabelas and replace it with the Fullfield model. Unless I hear of the Fullfields not being able to handle magnum recoil, which seems to have been the problem with the last two scopes I've tried.
    Does anyone know if the Fullfield tubes are long enough to mount on a Browning A-bolt using two piece bases? Thanks for the help everyone.

  9. #9
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    Default Burris Sigature Series

    If you have read some of my other post about my hunt for BB on Kodiak
    next fall and my Kimber Talkeetna my first choice is a 1.5X-6x40
    Burris w/ electro dot. I will also probably purchase a Leopould
    VX-III (1.5x 5) both w/ Talley QD ring and bases for my Marlin 1895 XLR 45-70 also, for brush in the bottem 48 (Idaho,MT, OR and WA). I will take both scopes to Kodiak after sighting in.
    Comments are welcomed...

  10. #10

    Default Burris Fullfield

    Get the burris. I have the Fullfield II 3x9x50 on my Ruger 338, no problems. I even dropped it off the shooting bench on a concrete pad (ouch!). Other than scratched paint on the objective bell, it is still GTG.

    Oh, and they really are water/fog proof. I haven't needed the warranty yet.

  11. #11
    Member marshall's Avatar
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    I've been looking real hard at the Nikon Monarch line with BDC for my 308. I like the idea of hold points at 100 - 500 yard ranges. There is a video link below.

    http://www.nikonhunting.com/riflesco...c-reticle.html


    Nikon offers a large range of power options to may work out for your application.

    http://www.nikonhunting.com/riflescopes-monarch.html


    Optics planet has some pretty good prices on this line.

    http://www.opticsplanet.net/nikon-mo...flescopes.html


    I personally don't have any experience with these scopes but they seem like a good bang for the buck.

    I also like the Burris scopes except the eye piece on the models I've actually held rotate as you change power settings. If you have a flip up lens cap this causes it to either be in front of your weak eye or hit the bolt. That was a bummer since the optic had a real bright and clear picture.

  12. #12

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    I was also looking at some of the Nikon Monarch models. After having both a brand new Bushnell Elite 3200 and Leupold VX-II fail me, I began looking at Burris and Nikon, which are two other popular name brands that I have never tried before. From what I'm hearing though, the Burris Fullfield II line sounds hard to beat, especially for the price when compared to the other options (i.e. Nikon Monarch).

    I guess the fact that the Burris models have the entire eye piece rotate when you change the power would be a downside for some, but I don't use flip open lens caps, so it wouldn't be an issue for me. I'm going to stop by one of the sporting good stores this weekend and look and a Fullfield II model. I really like the fact that they use dual internal springs, and 'am hoping that this will solve my problem of prior scopes not holding a zero.

  13. #13

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    TN Hillbilly,

    After droping your rifle/scope, was the zero still the same or did that drop on the concrete cause a shift?

  14. #14
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    Ak hunter,
    Don't forget the 30mm tubed fullfields like i mentioned too. They are reasonably priced and provide a massive field of view. I have an older 1.75-5 burris fullfield on my blr. I shot a moose with it this past season and have been shooting 200-250 grain bullets through the rifle with no change of zero. I also have the 3-12 XTR. It was pricey but it's my "precision" scope for accuracy testing of handloads and also my long range scope. Your 338 is not going to knock a burris out of alignment.......but you better have some good rings that are lapped and use blue locktite on the screws.

  15. #15

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    mainer in ak,

    I have a set of Leupold PRW 1" rings and QRW bases (picatinny style), that I'm going to use. I usually use Warne but thought I'd try these as they have a horizontal split in the rings for mounting and should make it a little easier, especially if I use rubber cement and have to move the scope around for positioning some.
    I was wondering if I should use locktite on all the screws (bases and rings). I have a red bottle of locktite, what is the difference between the red and blue? Also, I have heard others recommend not putting locktite on base and ring screws, not sure why not though. Thanks.

  16. #16
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    Ak Hunter,
    The red locktite has a higher temp, it does the same thing. You only need a dab on each screw. lap the rings and clean the scope tube and inside surface of rings with alchohol to remove any trace of oil. Some scope rings on the market actually recommend lock tight on the screws. Also make sure that there is no oil on the screws either. Good luck on that bear hunt.

  17. #17

    Smile eye relief = Leupold.....

    Most of those Leupolds have good eye relief. A good feature on a brown bear hunt in my opinion. I have a 1/2 dozen or so of them. One that is neat is a 1.75x6 by 32 mm VXIII that I had the Leupold Custom Shop put the post/duplex reticle in. I also have the 1.5x5 by 20 mm VXIII and had the German #4 reticle put in it. My personal .338 wears an old 2.5x8 by 36 mm Vari X III with the standard duplex reticle. On their low setting they are all what I consider fast and easy to use. The first 2 would be top choices for any dedicated brown bear hunt. The 2.5x8 is my favorite "all around scope". It has been in use for at least 15 years or more. Most of the shots taken with it were on 2.5 power. They all set in Warne quick detach rings. The screws for the bases have a dab of blue Lock Tite on them and the ring screws don't. The red Lock Tite sets up to hard for gun screw use. All of them were tightened down with a Warne torque wrench. Any one of the 3 will serve you well. Buy one of each.

  18. #18
    Member marshall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ak hunter View Post
    I guess the fact that the Burris models have the entire eye piece rotate when you change the power would be a downside for some, but I don't use flip open lens caps, so it wouldn't be an issue for me.

    Last September out west of the Mulchatna river on a small lake my brother and I were in 6 straight days of rain during our moose hunt. I was glad to have pop up covers on my leupold VX-7 1.5-6X24. It has preformed very well under 250 plus shots from my .375 Ruger with no problems holding zero. The covers kept the lens dry and clear of fog.

    The Nikon scope that I'm considering for my .308 is planned for a fall elk hunt down here in Arizona. I haven't narrowed it down yet but one thing for sure I don't want to buy anything until I touch, smell, and feel it.

    The lens caps probably wont be an issue down here since rain is a novilty in AZ, Alaska is an other story.

    As far as Burris goes, I like the XTR 312 in olive drab.

  19. #19
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ak hunter View Post

    I believe I will cancel the Cabelas AK Guide Premium scope that is on back order with Cabelas and replace it with the Fullfield model.

    .

    This sounds like a great decision to me
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

  20. #20

    Default No prob

    Quote Originally Posted by ak hunter View Post
    TN Hillbilly,

    After droping your rifle/scope, was the zero still the same or did that drop on the concrete cause a shift?
    I was in the process of zeroing it when I dropped it, but I didn't notice any shift. The Ruger rings probably helped!

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