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Thread: Good gunsmith for ring lapping in ANCH???

  1. #1

    Default Good gunsmith for ring lapping in ANCH???

    Looking for a reasonabally priced place to get some 30mm rings lapped. I would like to possibally buy the rings there if possible also.

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    why do you want the rings lapped?

  3. #3

    Default Isnt it recomended?

    My rifle has the 1/2 inch at 100 guarantee so isnt it recomended to get the 30mm rings lapped to maximize accuracy.

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    Dunno, my two precision rifles put 5 shots all touching at 100 yards without ring lapping.

  5. #5

    Default I want to try out to 800 yards

    Its a 300 Ultra Mag that feels like a 243 on the shoulder.

  6. #6

    Default Ring lapping...

    Last year I spoke w/ Stan Jackson in Anchorage. I asked him about ring lapping, and he told me it was basically a waste of time and money.

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Get an alignment and lapping kit set from Midway USA and do it yourself. Most don't need it with the top notch CNC machining we have now days but it will never harm anything to do it. I have lapped all mine for years, I learned about it from a scope that would not hold zero a. Since I started lapping the rings in I have not had a single scope problem, even with very cheap scopes.


    http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=879712

    Andy

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    Quote Originally Posted by alaskan907 View Post
    My rifle has the 1/2 inch at 100 guarantee so isnt it recomended to get the 30mm rings lapped to maximize accuracy.

    Mule Muffins!!
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    Mule Muffins!!
    (LOL) Is that anything like BS?

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alaskan907 View Post
    My rifle has the 1/2 inch at 100 guarantee so isnt it recomended to get the 30mm rings lapped to maximize accuracy.
    " @ 100 yards, or 1" @ 200 yards = MOA
    Your half MOA guarantee is what the gun will do and has nothing to do with your sighting device. The guarantee is that if you put the gun in a vice and shoot down a wind free tunnel the rounds will hit within of the same spot, but says nothing about where that spot will be in relation to the gun or scope. Bolting a scope on top will have no effect on how the gun hits, groups hits, or on your guarantee.

    However there is the exception of any pressure added to the barrel and action from the mounting system. Something like a scope rail attached to the action as well as the barrel can act like poor stock bedding giving a wandering point of impact.

    Today machine work can be done to levels of accuracy that were very difficult or even imposable to measure fifty years ago. Most parts are very consistent now and this means that when you put your new rings on the gun they were made for they are very likely to line up just fine. This should also overcome the exception by not adding any pressure to the gun since everything will line up true and flat.

    None of this is worth messing with for the normal hunting rifle when most guys want a shot 200 yards or well under if they can get it. To hit what you want at 800 yards is no easy task and you will need all the help you can get. Lapping the rings is like an insurance policy you take out to prevent very minor shifts in the scopes aim point due to twisting pressures from the rings. I view it to be cheap insurance when I do it myself, $25 I paid and lapped about 50 sets.

    To do an 800 yard shot you will need to be reloading and using all the bench rest tricks. You will need to have a very good range finder and wind meter to use your drop charts and turtles correctly. Then you need to practice all you can and then practice even more. There is a long range shooting web-sites that you should go spend time at to learn what other stuff you need and how to do it.
    Here is a good one. http://longrangehunting.com/

    Andy

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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall View Post
    (LOL) Is that anything like BS?
    or Horse Hockey, Donkey Droppings, Burro Bisquits,Trail Markers....

    I'm waiting for someone to explain to me how lapped rings makes any rig shoot better. It may make a better fit more inline than mis matched rings or if the two piece base or the receiver was not aligned correctly, the scope will bind, but still shoot to point of aim when adjusted to do so.

    I've lapped rings and have the equipment to do so, but rarely ever is it needed and this is usually to make alignment front to rear and to gain full contact between ring and scope tube. Never seen improvement in a rifles ability to shoot. Certainly any new modern rifle with good mounts should align easily without lapping. Often lapping will allow a scope to slip after we smooth up the rings and that would be bad.

    But any smith worth his salt would be able to lap rings. You really need a 30 mm lapping rod and valve lapping compound.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Quote Originally Posted by ADfields View Post
    Get an alignment and lapping kit set from Midway USA and do it yourself. Most don't need it with the top notch CNC machining we have now days but it will never harm anything to do it. I have lapped all mine for years, I learned about it from a scope that would not hold zero a. Since I started lapping the rings in I have not had a single scope problem, even with very cheap scopes.


    http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=879712

    Andy
    OK, I can buy that the scope was in a bind and you relieved the tension and allowed the scope to settle to the same point after each shot. But that didn't improve the way the rifle shoots, just keeps the scope still. Rarely ever do modern mount systems bind a scope up so but it does happen. Good point. And yeah the lap kits are cheap enough to do any we need to do. I would think a Smith might charge an hours work for such a job.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Thumbs up Good Insurance is all, IMHO

    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    OK, I can buy that the scope was in a bind and you relieved the tension and allowed the scope to settle to the same point after each shot. But that didn't improve the way the rifle shoots, just keeps the scope still. Rarely ever do modern mount systems bind a scope up so but it does happen. Good point. And yeah the lap kits are cheap enough to do any we need to do. I would think a Smith might charge an hours work for such a job.
    Agreed, it has nothing to do with improving the way it shoots. It just helps the scope stay at the same aim point and eliminate any twist that may bind up the redial mechanism. I have never heard of a scope changing accuracy for better or worse, but I do think of it as cheap insurance. Also should not be over done or the scope can get too loose like you said, but I have only had this happen when using used rings that I have lapped a couple times before.

    A scope rail is another story and I have seen them change accuracy due to poor fit to the action and barrel, which adds stress that can differ with temperature. Lapping the rings will have no effect on this condition though some people I have met seem to think otherwise.


    Andy

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    Quote Originally Posted by ADfields View Post



    Get an alignment and lapping kit set from Midway USA and do it yourself.

    I have lapped all mine for years, I learned about it from a scope that would not hold zero

    Since I started lapping the rings in I have not had a single scope problem, even with very cheap scopes

    .



    http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=879712

    Andy

    I agree 100%. I lap all my rings now. Started with a 300 Weatherby I was having trouble with. Made a believer out of me. Did the same to my 50 bmg with excellent results.

    People that say not to lap rings are likely being lazy and telling you not to do it because they did not do it. That is harsh, but I just don't know how else to say it.

    Get the kit from Midway and do it yourself. One thing though, don't over do it. There is a right way and wrong way to do it. PM me if you want more info, happy to help. It is very easy to do yourself.

    Be sure to buy the best rings you can afford or don't bother with the lapping. High quality rings are more important than lapping. Get the best.

    Lots of info online about how to properly lap rings. Read up on it good before you do it and you will be fine.

    I went back and found a recent thread on this for you. Read below...

    http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...t=lapping+ring






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    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    For anyone wanting to know why you should consider lapping your rings, it is to eliminate any misalignment between the rings. With misaligned rings the scope tube will bend to match the misalignment of the scope rings upon being torqued down. Seen this on used scopes with deep grooves from the old rings. The end result is less consistent accuracy. Likely this is how all these used scopes found their way into the gun shop in the first place. The owner thought they had a bad scope. When in all reality, they had a fine scope that was poorly mounted as evidenced by the indentions in the side of the tubes.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Lazy? Maybe not. Excellent article in a recent american rifleman on this. Lapping rings is completely unnecessary from what they said.....and it made sense. Most of the time, the rings will be overtightened causing misalignment. Use a torque wrench or just go easy and you likely wont have an issue...

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunt_ak View Post

    Most of the time, the rings will be overtightened causing misalignment.
    This would not happen if the rings were 100% concentric which is all you are doing when you lap them.


    I do agree that equal and appropriate torqueing is required. I just prefer to torque down a ring that is also concentric.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Default Precision Arms- 279-5755

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskan907 View Post
    Looking for a reasonabally priced place to get some 30mm rings lapped. I would like to possibally buy the rings there if possible also.
    Vince has lapped a couple sets of rings for me now, as well as done several other projects. He's conscientious, honest, and fair. I cant imagine he'd charge you an hour for the job, it's not a very lengthy procedure.

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    Be sure to buy the best rings you can afford or don't bother with the lapping. High quality rings are more important than lapping. Get the best.
    Guess thats why the Blaser rings dont need lapping

  20. #20
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Could be the case. All lapping does is correct minor flaws in the rings manufacturing process. I did notice when using Burris signature rings a few years back, very little material had to be removed in the lapping process. A credit to the concentricity of their rings for sure. I am sure this is true with other manufacturers as well.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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