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Thread: Tainted meat and Rumen spill

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    Default Tainted meat and Rumen spill

    I've got two questions, one that I've always wondered about, and the other slightly less hypothetical.

    First, let's say you're dressing a Caribou, or whatever, and you damage the bladder or intestines. What are your options for dealing with the tainted meat? What, exactly, becomes `wrong` with it? I've been very fastidious in avoiding taint, but I'm not exactly sure what I'm avoiding.

    Second, less hypothetically: your bullet goes in at bad angle, and punctures the stomach. Rumen get blown back into the chest cavity, and coats the inside of the ribs. (I'm not sure how, because it was only a 180 grain bullet). What're the options for dealing with this? Buddy of mine suggested soaking in salt water, and scrubbing it off with a wire brush.

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    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    I quarter my animals from the top side. Every once in a while I will nick the urethra where it runs right next to the pelvis when I am cutting loose the rear quarter. It will get urine on the meat, but I have never had a single issue with it. If I have water nearby I will wash it off the best I can, but on a couple critters I have just let it be and noticed no problems on the meat.

    As for gut shots..I've never had to deal with it, but I guess I would just wash it off the best I can and if the ribs are too tainted I would ditch them when I got home. The law says bring out all the meat and that is what I do. Even bloodshot meat I will bring home and dispose of at home. Keeps "the man" off my back that way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKDoug View Post
    I quarter my animals from the top side. Every once in a while I will nick the urethra where it runs right next to the pelvis when I am cutting loose the rear quarter. It will get urine on the meat, but I have never had a single issue with it. If I have water nearby I will wash it off the best I can, but on a couple critters I have just let it be and noticed no problems on the meat.

    As for gut shots..I've never had to deal with it, but I guess I would just wash it off the best I can and if the ribs are too tainted I would ditch them when I got home. The law says bring out all the meat and that is what I do. Even bloodshot meat I will bring home and dispose of at home. Keeps "the man" off my back that way.
    If your animal is too bloodshot, what you can do is soak the meat in salt saturated cold water. It'll draw the blood out, and make it pretty okay.

  4. #4

    Default works well with ducks as well

    My wife doesn't care to much for duck meat except for when I soke them in salt water for a few days in the fridge. change the water once a day and the meat ends up looking almost like chicken.

    I would say wipe down the inside of the ribs with vinager untill they are clean.

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    The stomach fluids will deteriate the meat fairly rapidly. Clean it as fast as possible. When I used to do road kills this was fairly common. If you don't get it off the meat promptly your meat will turn green.

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    Quote Originally Posted by big_dog60 View Post
    The stomach fluids will deteriate the meat fairly rapidly. Clean it as fast as possible. When I used to do road kills this was fairly common. If you don't get it off the meat promptly your meat will turn green.
    How do you get it off, though?

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    Member big_dog60's Avatar
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    That depends on what you have avalable. When I was doing road kills we usually had to take the meat some place it could be washed off.(like the garage) If that is not avalible then you may have to trim it off.

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    If there is no water, I do the best I can with a rag or papertowels. IF ther eis water available, I wet the rag and clean it off the best I can. You, or the processor will have to trim the meat but you can get most off with a rag and water. ITs importatnt that you do it as quick as you can. Usually when I hang it at the meat pole, I'll take the bag off and clean or trim what I can.

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    ~LOL!!!!~

    None of it is anybig deal at all.

    First off, urine is sterial, and with no salty taste or odor.

    Second, the animal is eatin moss and sedges, another "no biggie".

    Neither is getting "Into the meat" only on its surfaces....

    In the Fall time, we actually take a part of the rumenents home and make them in a dish called Amalik. An organ we call "The Bible" is our favorite, chopped up with its moss'es and sedges,, boiled and with Hearts and tounges added, it is always eaten till its gone!

    If the meat turns green its from being warm too long and thats how old hot meat (even a few hours old) looks, and I imagine that salvaged Moose is both smashed up inside AND a few hours old by the time its "Salvaged"
    Make sure you split the meat inbetween the rear legs to the bone, and spred them to cool. Thats the first place that will turn "green" on meat.

    Heres the fixx, and I know this one well;

    If the bladder pops, ignore it and carry on. When your done, wipe it with snow, or towel it off. It dosent get "Into" the meat, its on its surface.
    Same with the gutshot.
    I start but cutting out the "Baby Chute", "taint"~LOL!, "Butthole" and all first. I cut around hem and loosen them. Then I cut up to the chin, and cut the throat. Then I open the brisket from the side, grab the trachia, and pull them down and out. I stop at the diaphram and cut it, and proceed with removing the stomach, intestines, cutting while lifting. I finnish by pulling gently but firmly out the butthole combo and the bladder comes along with it, every time.

    If I have a busted up gut on a Caribou, and it happens, I will gut as normal, wipe up as much as possible, and leave the liver for last.
    I have the animal on its back, I cut the liver, and let it gush blood into the body cavity. I splash the blood around the cavity and get all the moss into it.
    Then I drink Tea, roll one and smoke it, sharpen my knife, gas up my rig, whatever passes about 10 minutes.
    Then I tip the carcass and a big congeeled mass of blood clot slides out, taking all moss, food, whatever with it. I wipe up any bloody streak , and put the carcass in the sled or boat.

    I cut out and give the dogs my bloodshot meat. Theres no cure for that, or the bullet/bone fragments that are in it too.

    Theres nothing wrong with a gutshot animal, or a burst bladder. Both will easily get solved as they were made, in the routine of making Meat.
    If its not an hours long ordel, then nothing will be spoiled, except where the bullet passed through.

    Good luck!!
    If you can't Kill it with a 30-06, you should Hide.

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    Supporting Member AFHunter's Avatar
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    Default legally salvage

    The hunting reg states you do not have to salvage "Meat that has been damaged and made inedible by the bullet or arrow". Does this refer to blood shot meat only or does this apply to gut juices from a gutshot animal? I don't know. If you bullet hits the guts and gut juices get on your meat then the bullet damaged the meat in my opinion.

    First, there is no reason to gut most large game in Alaska. You can quarter the animal without gutting it. I learned this one the hard way. Always quarter, never gut. This leaves less chance of getting gut juices anywhere on your precious meat.

    Normally the gut juices do not go everywhere. They are contained in a small area. Just cut around the contaminated area.

    Most of my hunts are on extended stays and I can not have three inches of tainted meat allowed to taint the rest of my meat.

    I know exactly which quarter had the bladder spilled on it. Take a wiff sometime of your quarters with urine on it if you have this happen while trying to keep the proof of sex on your big game male animal. Your steaks will taste the same. I immediately trim tainted meat away before it is allowed to soak into other precious vittles.

    Fish and game should be fined with wanton waste for making me keep sex organs on precious meat that later smells like urine and tastes like it. Unfortunately I trim the area away and discard where the sex organs are left for identification once I process the meat at my house.

    If you want to clean your meat then I suggest getting it in water as soon as possible. The downside to the water or stream is we all now most water sources have little nasties like girrardiah SP?, you have now just put little organisms all over your meat, that will degrade the quality also.

    If you are at your house then the water hose with safe water is your best bet. If you are beyond a water hose then leave the tainted meat.

    my 2 cents

    Good luck out there and have fun!

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    Hmmmmmmmm.........AFHunter, I'm wondering here.....

    Just how do you come up with "theres no reason to gut big Game in Alaska"??
    I have never figured a way to do that.

    I often skin them, quarter them and THEN gut them, depending on the conditions.
    using blood to wipe off the urine works well.

    Leaving eveidence of it "sex" can be as easy as leaving the "nut sack" on, so you can remove the rest, and not have a problem.

    Aside , I might add, if your animal is in Rut, piss on the meat and wiping the guts over it might IMPROVE the flavor....~LOL!!!~
    Nothing can make Rut meat edible, to my tastes.
    If you can't Kill it with a 30-06, you should Hide.

    "Dam it all", The Beaver told me.....

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    Default Tainted meat

    My mother, who was born in 1906 grew up on a potato farm in Idaho (if you're curious about the math, she gave birth to me in 1947, her first last and only child). Having grown up with no electricity, running water, or central heat, she thought nothing of slicing off thin layers from a piece of meat that smelled bad, and then cooking the rest. I don't know how many times I had the "stomach flue" as a little kid, I know that she kept a bottle of "green medicine" (some narcotic based drug, possibly paregoric) that almost instantly cured the problem. The plus side is that I never get food poisoning, even when others who've eaten what I eat have gotten sick.
    The point I'm trying to make here is maybe we all worry to much in this germ-phobic world we live in, and maybe getting sick now and again, and subsequently strengthening our immune system is ultimately a good thing.
    Steve

  13. #13

    Default Bacteria

    I would have to agree w/ AFHunter. If you suspect the bullet passed below the diaphragm then do not even take the chance. I call it filleting the critter. Work from the outside in quickly.
    If you have one piece of fowl meat you will loose the entire thing to bacteria. It spreads fast in the right conditions. Temps below freezing may be a different story? But if it is warm, rainy, & humid enough you have yourself a petri dish. I learned the hard way as well & will leave all meat with gut juice @ the kill site. Filleting it keeps everything clean. You still can go in & pluck the tenderloins, unless the bullet cause damage in that area. The gut mess is all contained in the peritneum, except for the exit & entrance hole if that is the case. Give the oozing holes some room. Keep the poo goo off the knife, hands & good meat. An oz of prevention is worth a pound of cure! That is my taste buds' worth of two cents.

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    Problems of urine on the meat can either be eliminated or greatly reduced if the penis is cut free but let attached at the base and placed so any urine that is passed will go on the round and not on the hindquarters or into the abdominal cavity once the opening cut for gutting is made. Once the opening cut is made the bladder can be compressed from the front of the pelvic bone forcing most of the urine on to the ground.
    The hams can then either be "boned" off the pelvic bone; boned down 4 or 5 inches on each side of the pelvic ridge then that section of exposed bone removed - the penis and bladder can be removed intact; or after layed back the penis can be freed to the bladder which will also allow the penis and bladder to be removed from the carcass as "one".
    Any stomach or intestinal "stuff" in the abdominal or chest cavity is cleaned and "rinsed" with whatever blood is present. Wiped with moss or grass if available.
    Have eaten A LOT of moose over the years that were well into the rut, and with just a couple of exceptions they were good provided they were handled properly - especially keeping the hair away from the meat especially when still warm just after the kill.
    Joe (Ak)

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    Member Phil's Avatar
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    Default Blood

    I second the motion for using blood as a cleaning agent. With today's bullets, there is usually lots of blood withing the body cavity of a big game animal. If an accident occurs, the blood can usually be "washed" around to help cleanse the inside of the body cavity. Then use a paper towel to wipe off the blood.

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    I am going to agree with stranger, i have never had any issues up here with lil pieces of twigs and moss out of an animal gut. wipe it off if a mistake is made and all is good. never had meat taint from it. not to mention that once the meat is aged the out side film is always trimmed off any way.

    I would sure hope nobody uses gut tainting as an excuse to NOT carry out any ribs or other meat that got splashed by gut juice.

    as for blood shot... except for the immediate in out hole that is full of bone chips, the meat with a lil blood in it can be soaked in salt water and ground up into sausage or burger. Roc doc has a good point that people worry way to much about a germ or two...
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    [QUOTE=strangerinastrangeland;442999]Hmmmmmmmm.........AFHunter, I'm wondering here.....

    Just how do you come up with "theres no reason to gut big Game in Alaska"??
    I have never figured a way to do that.QUOTE]


    Someone mentioned the filleting method. I guess you could call the method I use filleting.

    I skin one side at a time. I only use a knife to butcher a moose or any other big game animal in Alaska. A saw or hatchet is not needed. I make one cut from the base of the antlers all the way to the tail in the skin. I then take off both legs on that side at the knee, using only a knife. Then make your cape cut if desired. If not make a cut down the middle of both legs on that side with your knife from the backbone to the knee. Now pull the skin down and most of the time the skin will peel right off. Then remove both quarters on that side, whole. No matter what size animal. I then take that whole sides worth of brisket, neck and backstrap off. Then the precious inner loin from that side. Lastly I fillet the meat off the ribs. The ribs stay on the carcus. The slab of rib meat is one whole side of meat, with a hole cut out where the bullet went in.

    Flip the animal over and repeat all steps for the other side. One trick I have learned is to carry a piece of clear 5 mil plastic in my pack. I always place this plastic under the animal as best as possible. If you drop a quarter or a piece of meat it falls on a clean sheet of plastic and not on the gravel bar or tundra.

    I also immediately bag every piece of meat in TAG bags as soon as the meat is off the animal. No flies or contamination has a chance to get on my meat.

    The head of your harvest is still attached. Now take your finger and find the base of the skull where it meets the first vertabret in the neck. Cut all of the remaining tissue off around that and tilt the animals head up while slowly cutting the membrane around the vertabrate and the head pops off. You do not even need to cut if all of the remaining tissue is gone. Just twist the neck and the head pops off.

    The guts still remain inside the animals cavity and I never have to get a knife near them, except when popping the hind quarter ball and socket off.

    That's how I do it.

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    Interesting.......Sounds OK to me, AFHunter.

    I take the oragn meats as well, so I "have" to gut them...~LOL!!~ or I get questioned like the BATF did David Koresh...

    Hearts, Tounge, fresh Liver, Kidneys, internal gobs of fat, and the rumenents sack we call "Bible" are all in my gunnysack when Im done. We use the bones in soup and as "kipchuk" which is "meat on Bones" as the sweetest meat is next to the bone.

    We all have our methods, and a good explanation gos a long way in understanding each other.
    Thanks for the description!
    If you can't Kill it with a 30-06, you should Hide.

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  19. #19
    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    Stranger- AFHunter's description is how I do all my animals from deer to moose. I actually learned how to do it from a guy that was taught by an Athabascan. It's the same method outlined in a F&G video on butchering moose.

    I have never aquired a taste for any of the internal organs other than the heart. Once I am done it's no big thing to push aside the guts and cut it out.

    I think a big reason on the difference in the way we do things is that most of us have to hunt in the fall and often haul our animals quite a ways to our vehicles. If I could snowmobile or boat near to my kills I would definately change my methods and go to the gut method you use. Unfortunately that method isn't usually available to me. In fact, the only winter killed caribou I have butchered was gutted and towed home to butcher in the warmth
    Bunny Boots and Bearcats: Utility Sled Mayhem

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    i do it same way to except i leave rib meat on the bones... only thing left behind is the boned out spine unless i want to make chops with the B/S.

    easy enough to pull heart and liver and such when you roll it and pick up the other side... thats all thats left.... is the gut pile. i skin all mine from belly side though. that way when i roll it the hide is laid out to catch it all. 1.5-2 hours per moose on my own.



    BTW... know how to cook kidney?



    put them in a pot and boil pissouta them......
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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