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Thread: KATMAI ~ ethically bankrupt hunting on Preserve

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    Thumbs down KATMAI ~ ethically bankrupt hunting on Preserve

    KATMAI BEAR KILLINGS ~ ethically bankrupt hunting on Preserve

    For anyone who followed this in 2007, this is back and alarming.
    The location of the hunt is ethically bankrupt!
    The hunting is in an area where bears are habituated
    to humans. Support hunting that is not ethically bankrupt.
    ~ Vicky Frangos

    Please feel free to call or write the Alaska Board of Fish & Game.

    Alaska Department
    of Fish & Game
    P.O. Box 115526
    1255 W. 8th Street
    Juneau, AK 99811-5526
    Phone: 907-465-4100
    Fax: 907-465-2332

    WATCH THIS VIDEO - WARNING BEAR IS KILLED
    http://stream.qtv.apple.com/qtv/SeeM...videos_ref.mov

    Now read the news below! ~ Vicky

    The bears of Katmai
    By Bill Sherwonit
    Anchorage Press
    Published/Last Modified on Wednesday, February 18, 2009

    Nearly seventeen months have passed since October 2007, when a local TV crew set up camp on Kukaklek Lake, in the upper Alaska Peninsula, to report on a legal but controversial brown bear hunt in Katmai National Preserve. The video and story the team brought back startled and repulsed many Alaskans, hunters and non-hunters alike.

    Though the story has mostly been forgotten—or set aside in the public’s consciousness— it will no doubt be resurrected next week, when the Alaska Board of Game meets in Anchorage. Among the 246 proposed regulation changes they’ll consider are four that would change how the Katmai Preserve hunt is managed.

    One thing that almost certainly won’t change, however, is the hunt’s basic nature. Sport hunters will still be allowed to approach within a few dozen feet of brown bears and kill animals that have grown habituated to people after spending weeks in the close company of nonthreatening wildlife watchers and anglers.

    That’s exactly what made the reporting by KTUU’s Megan Baldino and images by freelance videographer Dan Zatz of Homer so disconcerting, and such a YouTube sensation.

    If anything, the video didn’t fully capture what Brad Josephs calls the “nightmarish” nature of the experience. Josephs, a Homer bear-viewing guide who accompanied Baldino and Zatz, recalls “It was brutal, a massacre, a crushing thing to see if you care about bears. [The day before the hunt] we had gotten some rapport with the female bear that eventually got killed; we got to know her a little bit. That’s what made it the worst. She and other bears were grazing right next to the guide’s camp. The hunters were inside their electric fences, watching like the rest of us.

    more
    http://www.anchoragepress.com/articl...2117797003.txt

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    Default habituated

    You want to outlaw hunting animals that are habituated to humans? As urban sprawl continues, more and more animals are "habituated". Sounds like an easy way to outlaw hunting, just start habituating animals.

    Don't worry tho, after a couple animals are killed, they will start being habituated to hunters and realize they need to go into survival mode when they are around.

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    Member upinak's Avatar
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    Default

    I smell spamming.... and it is turning green.
    No amount of education can help those who want to remain permanently ignorant of facts, which includes those whom have been educated.

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    Just another anti, nothing to see here

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    Member stevelyn's Avatar
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    Bunny hugger troll.
    Now what ?

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    Default

    Long live Treadwell!!
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

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    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
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    i just wish more greenies would listen as much as they talk....then we'd all learn a little.
    Www.blackriverhunting.com
    Master guide 212

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    Member alaskachuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BRWNBR View Post
    i just wish more greenies would listen as much as they talk....then we'd all learn a little.

    I was wondering when you were gonna respond to this Jake. You hit the nail on the head buddy. Great point
    Grandkids, Making big tough guys hearts melt at first sight

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    Dangit, where'd I put my granola and hummus......

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    Default confused

    I wonder if YNP is still looking for sympathizing responses? I think she must have this forum confused with another.

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    Default Grizzly video

    Pretty sad days in Paradice.I honestly couldnt watch the entire video.Very sad situation...
    In my opinion only....I did not like what I seen.Personaly I would never take part in a hunt such as that.If I paid to go on a bear hunt and I found the hunting to be as such I would not elect to shot.
    However If the state says this is a leagle hunt then I would be the last one to vote this right to hunt away.REMEMBER "Vote this hunt away" ,,then there wil be another and another and another until all hunting, sport hunting or not,will be considered barberic.,as hunters we need stand up for the hunt weather we hunt by the method or not.
    As for the Greenie coments,that are posted all over this site.Well Ive been in many states and hunted every thing from MT.Goat to Elk,from Alaska to Texas.I met folks in every state that didnt hunt,some looked down at it, some did not.Some were trying it for the first time.!
    Remember its those new hunters those so called Greenies that we need to help keep up the votes against the antis...We as sportsman should try to help and encourage not discourage.
    Like I said just my opinion,nothing more nothing less.

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    Quote Originally Posted by QDM4SURE View Post
    We as sportsman should try to help and encourage not discourage.
    Sorry but last time I checked ethical hunter's don't resort to the extreme measures to KEEP their right to hunt as the greenies do to ban one's right to hunt.

    Rioting, arson, assault...give me a break.

    http://www.nraila.org/Hunting/Read/F...ts.aspx?ID=165

    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/g...asp?grpid=7215

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/20...edicalresearch

    http://articles.latimes.com/2008/nov...animal-arson29

    Here's a good viewpoint from animals rights.

    http://www.animalrightsafrica.org/Hunting.php

    Between 1997 and 2003, ALF reportedly caused, in conjunction with the radical Earth Liberation Front, approximately $43 million in property damage.

    These groups advocate their extremist views, and they have no qualms showing just how far or what they would do. And they call ethical hunters "monsters". Attacking research vessels with buytric acid? C'mon. Does that mean we, as hunters, now have the right to shoot animal right activists where they stand if they interfere with our hunts?
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

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    Default Challenge? What is the sport?

    What is the challenge of walking up to a habituated bear and shooting it?
    It does not even try to flee from the human until it hears the sound and
    is hit. Can it really be called a hunt... Hmmm... unless the hunter looks
    around at several trying to find the biggest one.... is that the hunting
    part? LOL

    What kind of hunter hunts habituated bears?

    Why not hunt non-habituated bears in the other hunting areas?
    Is it too much of a challenge?

    The Katmai Preserve has 330 brown bears per square kilometer-
    amongst the highest in the world. Pretty hard to find and shoot
    a bear. Seems a bit lazy to me.

    It's an ethics issue for the hunter.

    Are all of you supporting this kind of hunting ethic?

    Why won't you hunt non-habituated bears?

    Do you support any of the proposals before the Alaska
    Board of Fish & Game next week?

    There are 4 proposals before the Alaska Board of Fish
    & Game involving the Katmai Preserve bears in 8 days.

    1) Shorten the Fall hunting season from October 1-21st
    to October 17-21. This option would have less conflict
    between wildlife watchers and bear hunters. Fall hunts
    take place in odd number years, the next Fall Hunting
    season for the Katmai Bear Preserve area is this year,
    October 2009.

    2) Closing the Eastern portion of the Preserve
    to hunting where salmon runs are prevelent.
    Again, how easy to hunt a bear....

    3) Create a draw permit hunt - to regulate the numbers
    of hunters in the Katmai Preserve.

    4) Close the Hunting season in the Fall and only allow
    hunting in the Spring. Spring hunting season in
    Katmai is May 10-25th in even numbered years.
    The next Katmai preserve hunt would be spring 2010.

    At this time, there is no proposal to make it 'hunting only'
    during the hunting season. This allows wildlife watchers
    to be at risk and allows a possible unpleasant wildlife viewing
    experience during a visit to Alaska.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TWB View Post
    Sorry but last time I checked ethical hunter's don't resort to the extreme measures to KEEP their right to hunt as the greenies do to ban one's right to hunt.

    Nobody asked you not to own guns.
    Nobody asked you to not hunt bears.

    It's an ethics issue as to where and which bears you hunt.

    Is hunting a non-habituated bear too difficult?

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    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45 View Post
    Dangit, where'd I put my granola and hummus......
    Gosh, what an intelligent reply.

    Is your position that you are lazy and don't want the sport
    part of hunting? Is it much easier for you to kill a habituated
    bear than a non-habituated bear?

    Do you support canned hunts too? Too difficult
    out in the wild?

    I have no issue with people hunting, for sport with
    their ethics in check. I don't care much for lazy
    people who want no challenge and lack basic ethics.

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    Posting my position and response would be a moot at this point. You win.
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

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    Default

    No
    No
    No
    No

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    Quote Originally Posted by YNP4me View Post
    Gosh, what an intelligent reply.

    Is your position that you are lazy and don't want the sport
    part of hunting? Is it much easier for you to kill a habituated
    bear than a non-habituated bear?

    Do you support canned hunts too? Too difficult
    out in the wild?

    I have no issue with people hunting, for sport with
    their ethics in check. I don't care much for lazy
    people who want no challenge and lack basic ethics.
    I had to chuckle at this posting.
    YNP, you have no clue who AK45 is and how he hunts for that matter.
    I'd stake everything I own on this man's fair-chase ethic and integrity afield.

    Conservation works both ways and can be a dirty business.
    Fortunately we hunters are up to the task. We have long been THE stewards of wildlife consevation in this country. (Long live Teddy)
    As was said earlier, sometimes animals get too numerous and, heaven forbid, sometimes they become somewhat accustomed to man. Regardless of that fact they need to be killed, hunted, culled...call it what you will.

    Have you looked at deer statistics throughout America?
    They are another example of an animal quite habituated to man which requires hunting. Somebody has to do it.
    Maybe you would rather have them eating twinkie wrappers out of the garbage can?

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    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YNP4me View Post

    The Katmai Preserve has 330 brown bears per square kilometer-
    amongst the highest in the world.
    330 per sq. km? Are you sure about that? The preserve has about 1,700 square kilometers. By that measure, the preserve itself (not to mention the park) would have 561,000 bears. I'm guessing it was a typo? 33 per square km, perhaps? Either way, a link to the info might be helpful.

    As for the responses you've gotten, you must understand that many folks here are ardent supporters of hunting in most forms and are still upset that vast sections of Alaska have been locked off to hunting since ANILCA was enacted. Hunters have lost more and more land available to them over the past 20-30 years, so when one area is reopened many hunters are not going to be quick to shed a tear over it. I get your concerns, but I think they're misguided. Hunting is still prohibited in the park, which comprises nine times as much area as the preserve. There are still huge tracts of land where bears can be viewed that are never pressured by hunters. There is no conservation concern here - only a perception as to what is ethical or "challenging".
    Last edited by Brian M; 02-19-2009 at 15:28. Reason: spelling typo

  20. #20

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    If you don't like it, vote it out. Would I hunt there? No. Do I discourage anyone from hunting, shooting, killing or whatever you need to call it overpopulated animals? No. If these were deer, elk or other edibles, I'd be all over that "hunt". Good luck getting support here.

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