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Thread: 14' Roundboat Outboard Questions

  1. #1

    Default 14' Roundboat Outboard Questions

    I have recently decided on purchasing a 14' self-bailing roundboat (Alaskan Outfitters/6th Ave. Outfiiters Series) and have my eye on a 6hp Suzuki outboard with the "long" 20" shaft. With this I hope to be able to put around lakes and in the protected waters of PWS, up frog water rivers, down slow rivers, and a multitude of other possibilites.

    The raft has 2 eyelets on the stern that allow for an AK Outfitters outboard mount to be installed.

    My question is, can a 20" shaft on this type of mount sufficiently submerge the prop to allow me to do what I would like? Any experience or insight would be greatly appreciated so as I do not make the wrong investment. I was told by the company that this would work without a problem; however, I just would like some field verification.

    Thanks in advance!

    -HT

  2. #2
    Member BlueMoose's Avatar
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    Default Pm sent

    Hunter Tom check your inbox eh.

  3. #3
    webmaster Michael Strahan's Avatar
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    Default Hmmm...

    HT,

    I would not recommend the practice of using a six-horse on a self bailer. The hull is not designed for that, and as you push the boat through the water you will force water up through the bailer holes in the aft 1/3 of the boat, and fill the back end full of water. Either choose a non-bailer, a cataraft, or a traditional Zodiac-stlye sportboat.

    -Mike

    Quote Originally Posted by HunterTom View Post
    I have recently decided on purchasing a 14' self-bailing roundboat (Alaskan Outfitters/6th Ave. Outfiiters Series) and have my eye on a 6hp Suzuki outboard with the "long" 20" shaft. With this I hope to be able to put around lakes and in the protected waters of PWS, up frog water rivers, down slow rivers, and a multitude of other possibilites.

    The raft has 2 eyelets on the stern that allow for an AK Outfitters outboard mount to be installed.

    My question is, can a 20" shaft on this type of mount sufficiently submerge the prop to allow me to do what I would like? Any experience or insight would be greatly appreciated so as I do not make the wrong investment. I was told by the company that this would work without a problem; however, I just would like some field verification.

    Thanks in advance!

    -HT
    LOST CREEK COMPANY: Specializing in Alaska hunt consultation and planning for do-it-yourself hunts, fully outfitted hunts, and guided hunts.
    CLICK HERE to send me a private message.
    Web Address: http://alaskaoutdoorssupersite.com/hunt-planner/
    Mob: 1 (907) 229-4501
    "Dream big, and dare to fail." -Norman Vaughan
    "I have climbed my mountain, but I must still live my life." - Tenzig Norgay

  4. #4

    Default Mike & Blue Moose

    Hey Mike & Blue Moose, thanks for the input.

    I spent quite some time reading your book and the breakdowns of the different styles of raft. For myself, it came down to choosing a raft that could handle heavy loads, Class V's, and extremely narrow wooded rivers.

    I like the versatility of the roundboat and am willing to accept the fact that on extended trips it might be less comfortable than a cat and transporting it can be more difficult since it can not be broken down as well. However, the benefits of being able to run any size and type of river with the roundboat while saving money and still being able to handle a very heavy load are very important.

    I suppose if I really wanted to go with a 6hp outboard I would have to modify the aft section of the raft to handle it, which may or may not work or be worth it. Have you ever tried using a 3.5 to 4 hp outboard on a self-bailer? What are other possible complications from this? Or is it that no matter what you are using, there is always the risk of flooding the stern third of the raft? I have spent a lot of time rafting but have never used an outboard on a raft.

    I just want a little something to get me around the lakes, down slow rivers, and around the protected coves of PWS.


    Thanks in advance!

    -HT

  5. #5
    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    Default PWS?

    6HP, 3HP, 9.9HP....same/dif
    Any will push enough to put some water in the boat, which does not bother me much, except .....1) by hanging a motor off the back of the raft you are shifting the center of gravity backwards, and 2) then by adding water in the back of the boat the COG shifts even further backward. Then while out in PWS you hit a tiny swell and WHOOOOPS. Flips happen.
    You can, of course counter balance the COG issue by putting weight forward in the boat, but still, you are beginning to stretch the SAFE usefullness of your watercraft. A WHOOOOPS starts off as fun but they never end up fun.

    I believe whatever style raft you get you will love. It will do most everything great.
    'Cept them self-bailers begin to have center of gravity issues if the water is not very calm and if you are not traveling very slow.

    There have been several threads related to your thoughts-concerns-questions in the last year alone. If you have not already studied them, it would be a great idea.

    Your gonna love your raft. Your gonna have a blast!!

    Dennis
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  6. #6
    webmaster Michael Strahan's Avatar
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    Default Smaller outboards

    Hunter,

    The smaller motors should be fine. I would have no hesitation putting a 3-4 horse on a self bailer. But a six is getting up to where you actually start generating a wake . If your main purpose is simply to increase your downstream travel speed on slow Class I-II rivers, you should be fine. But don't plan on water skiing, or getting up on step with that boat!

    Take care,

    -Mike

    Quote Originally Posted by HunterTom View Post
    Hey Mike & Blue Moose, thanks for the input.

    I spent quite some time reading your book and the breakdowns of the different styles of raft. For myself, it came down to choosing a raft that could handle heavy loads, Class V's, and extremely narrow wooded rivers.

    I like the versatility of the roundboat and am willing to accept the fact that on extended trips it might be less comfortable than a cat and transporting it can be more difficult since it can not be broken down as well. However, the benefits of being able to run any size and type of river with the roundboat while saving money and still being able to handle a very heavy load are very important.

    I suppose if I really wanted to go with a 6hp outboard I would have to modify the aft section of the raft to handle it, which may or may not work or be worth it. Have you ever tried using a 3.5 to 4 hp outboard on a self-bailer? What are other possible complications from this? Or is it that no matter what you are using, there is always the risk of flooding the stern third of the raft? I have spent a lot of time rafting but have never used an outboard on a raft.

    I just want a little something to get me around the lakes, down slow rivers, and around the protected coves of PWS.


    Thanks in advance!

    -HT
    LOST CREEK COMPANY: Specializing in Alaska hunt consultation and planning for do-it-yourself hunts, fully outfitted hunts, and guided hunts.
    CLICK HERE to send me a private message.
    Web Address: http://alaskaoutdoorssupersite.com/hunt-planner/
    Mob: 1 (907) 229-4501
    "Dream big, and dare to fail." -Norman Vaughan
    "I have climbed my mountain, but I must still live my life." - Tenzig Norgay

  7. #7
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
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    Default self bailers

    when you put power on the back of these, the water coming in will tell you how fast you can go.
    Sometimes I go across Skilak lake using a small outboard motor. there are ways to make it so you can go faster without bringing water into the boat.
    I take a 20'X10" tarp and slide the tarp under the raft. You need to make sure the tarp does not extend near the prop, but far enough back so water does not get pushed thru the self bailer holes. pull the tarp sides and front into the boat and tie off so it is tight. then away you go.the raft slides on the tarp surface and pushes against the bottom of the raft and bailer holes, to keep that water from coming in.
    you can move along a bit faster this way and not have that water boiling up all the time in the bottom..
    One other thing you are going to need to remember is that your raft design has many inches of Kick on each end. you will need to keep that water inlet for the motor cooling pump in the water at all times. This often times requires that you position people and gear so the boat will travel in a constant attitude as to provide enough water for that pump to do its cooling job.
    Its a juggling act to use self Bailers as motor boats..
    Once I made a mount that positioned the motor off the right side of the raft. I just made a removable extension that slid into the aluminum pipe frame. This way the motor was positioned on the back 2/3 of the raft rather than the end. The motor pushed from the flatter portion of the tubes, so the boat did not attempt to rocker up on its end when I gave it the throttle.
    It actually worked well, other than that you are moving the boat in a more crab like attitude .. it was just a different way, but it worked ok to..
    but for me, I will not be motoring around in PWS or any place like that in my self bailer.. I just use a motor on these craft to get across a few miles of lake etc..
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  8. #8
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
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    Default Anouther Idea

    Using an extended prop mud motor is also a great alternative for moving self bailers.
    These are very light also, and do not require water for cooling, as they are air cooled engines.
    I think the 6.5 hp model weighs around 72 lbs or so.
    so very light..
    http://www.mudbuddy.com/Mini%20Longtails.htm

    With the mud motor, you don't need to be concerned with transom height etc. you have like 50 inches to find the water with your prop..
    The cost of these units are under or around $2,000 bucks, and sometimes you can find them used for alot less..
    I think there are some dealers here in Alaska. I saw some at the outdoor show a few years ago, and also a fellow in Fairbanks is the dealer for anouther brand..
    anyway..
    just some ideas
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  9. #9
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    Default 6 hp vs. 9.8 hp

    Thought I'd drop a question under this thread. I have a 4 hp 2 stroke Johnson that I am phasing out. In the market for a 6 hp or 9.8 hp 4 stroke Tohatsu for my 16' jag. The 6 is around 55lbs and 9.8 is 82lbs. Any suggestions about which size motor to go with? I was pretty happy with the 4 hp (super light), but it would be nice to get a little more speed/ power. Sounds like without mods, 10-12 mph is about the best to expect. Don't know if that is attainable will either motor from above. I guess I need help deciding if the 6 hp is good enough (close enough to the 9.8) without sacrificing the extra weight of the 9.8. Any Insight??
    Thanks

  10. #10
    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    Default 12mph

    Cataraft1,
    I run a 9.9 Honda on my 18 foot AIRE Leopard. At about 3/4 throttle I can attain 12 MPH. But if I add more throttle my speed stays the same and wake-water quadruples.

    Although I have not run the 6HP motor, at full throttle it will probably push your 16 foot cataraft as fast as the boat will go, as fast as you need to go, as fast as possible without a monsoon of wake-water.

    (And there is several archived threads in the past three years on this exact topic if you have the time. Specifically, Mike S. has contributed to this topic many times. Good reading prior to your motor purchase.)

    Dennis
    AK TAGS

  11. #11
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    Default

    I use to use a 30hp on a Aire Cougar (17.5' quad tube). It'd get up & scoot, but you want a drysuit and wiper blades for your goggles.

    I'm planning to use a 2.5 hp this year for my 14' self bailer. I used it the last couple years on the Cougar, and it worked just fine. All I want is to cross lakes and speed up the slow sections. More hp just creates issues on self bailers.

  12. #12
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    Default AlaskaTrueAdventure

    Thanks for the input. Sounds like the 6 will work just fine... I'll dig up some more info in the archives. Fun just to see and read about the different setups people use.... Thanks Again

  13. #13
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    Default AK Numbers

    Just remember. As soon as you put a motor on it you will need to register it as a motor boat.

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