Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 42

Thread: Bullet-Proof Canoe Underbelly Coating

  1. #1
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default Bullet-Proof Canoe Underbelly Coating

    Hello my canoe people. We recently covered the topic of coating keels, and underbellys with truck bed liner and i got to thinking about it again. Us freighter guys need to set this trend and make it happen. My only problem with truck bedliner is that most of it isnt smooth, it has rough, non-slip grannules in the mix. It just doesnt make good sense for hydrodynamic efficiency (it that's a politically correct phrase). So i remember back a few years ago when i was studying truckbed linings i actually found a truck bed liner that was SMOOTH! But becuase ive probably bit one too many lead sinkers onto fishing line as a kid i didnt put two and two together and share the info with all of you bad ***** son of a guns. So here it is: http://www.durabakcompany.com/bodypaint.htm So, there you have it, a freaking polyurethane based coating that comes in many different colors and is smooth. Im going to buy about 5 gallons of the forest green, i already have tape and a spray gun because i recently coated the floors pieces of my home made portable insulated ice house with the rough mix. Any of you guys on this web page feel free to come over for a few beers and i will spray it on the bottom of your freighters. It should only cost about 50-100 bucks. It's not like its work to fire up a the compressor and spray gun to help out a fellow freighter canoeist. I may even spray it for the double ender crowd too if you have a motor side mount on ur canoe (joke). So.....what do you guys think? oh yeah, one more thing, here is a canoe company from back home that makes freighters: http://www.islandfallscanoe.com/our-canoes.asp?cat=1088

  2. #2
    Member tzieli22's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Eagle River AK
    Posts
    589

    Default good info

    I was looking for something like this a few weeks ago i.e. the add for coating or fixing an old town. At 10lbs per gal. not too bad if your needing to coat your canoe.

    Question for you though, have you had this shipped here yet? Just wondering if there are any issues with shipping to AK.

    Thanks again.

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default tough? durable?

    OK, so it paints on and is smooth. Does anyone have any experience painting it on the bottom of a canoe and bouncing off of rocks/riffles/gravel bars? Interesting, if it works well and does not pop off with temperature differentials (hot sun inside, cold water outside).

  4. #4
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default

    The stuff I used on my ice house floor has held up well, I wouldnt worry too much about how permanently it would stay adhered due to abrasion and temp changes because you could always repair it.....that's the whole point. I'd rather repair the lining than the canoe itself. It's really nothing to patch a spot if it was necessary.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default haz mat

    It's haz mat. UPS will take it as far as Seattle.

  6. #6
    Member GreginAlaska's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    240

    Default

    I had War Bonnet Construction put polyurea on the inside of a hydroseeder I used to own, polyurea is is also used for truck bedliners, all my trucks have it too. They were able to put it on smooth in the hydroseeder and rough in the trucks. A hydroseedr has a big agitator in it and the fertilizer causes a lot of erosion, it looked brand new when I sold it 4 seasons later. I managed to drop a 400 pound rototiller, from about two foot height, into the back of one of the trucks, it didn't cut the polyurea. It's tough stuff.
    “When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.” attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default good

    thanks. good info. i may just try the stuff out and see. can't decide to go fiberglass or rubber right now. hmm.

  8. #8
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Sterling
    Posts
    1,450

    Default Spray liner

    Greg, you are dead on .. the material will go on pretty darn smooth if you maintain a fairly close attitude when spraying the heated two part material thru the gun.
    the way they make truck liners rough, is to get back away with the gun. When the material is sprayed on, it is heated to around 180 or more degrees. The two part materials are mixed in the gun right as it exits the nozzel it almost immediately begins to set up. So the further from the object you are spraying the rougher the surface as it forms little balls instead of a totally atomized finer spray.
    I have this done on the keels of my canoes, and it looks as smooth as glass when sprayed up close. It is shinny and very smooth.
    Greg,.... I one time had War Bonnet spray an entire Zodiak boat. We did it up close so it was smooth.,, that Zodiak was truly a very tough boat after that application.. while we sprayed the Zodiak I had to man the inflation valves and release air as the super heated poly material was applied. the heat made the air in the boat expand rapidly and it was a trick to have the boat hold its shape, and yet not over inflate as it was sprayed..
    Raymond Ansel was the guy that was doing it back then.
    I don't see any activity around there anymore, and I heard he had started something in the lower 48..
    Tony Bosela is the guy I use for my spraying needs now. He lives a few hundred yards behind me that makes it handy and he does a great job..
    anyone want to see how this product holds up on boats, come by my place and check out the keel protectors he sprayed on my rental canoes..
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  9. #9
    Member GreginAlaska's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    240

    Default

    Hi Max, Ray is down in the states building monolithic domes now, he's working on one in Vegas at the moment. He has a business called R&S Lifeline domes (something like that) and has quite the backlog now. Last summer his son was still in Soldotna doing coatings, I think he is the one who sprayed my hydroseeder, at least he is the one I dropped off with. My wife tried to get him to build the monolithic dome roof on the ICF house we are planning, he said he was too busy with industrial coatings. Of course a lot could have changed in the last year.

    If you see Tony, ask him if he has ever done the urethane on a monolithic dome.
    Thanks
    Greg
    “When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.” attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  10. #10
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Sterling
    Posts
    1,450

    Default First time

    I met Ray Ansel, I stopped in to check out the igloo's he was making .. oh about 20 years ago or so..
    Anyway,,, he was showing me around and he would say..
    " this urethane material is totally amazing stuff.."
    and then he took me over to a igloo that he had sprayed the truck bed liner on the inside and outside.. and he said... " this is totally amazing stuff"
    and then he was working on that big dome church he built, and took me over to show me that..
    and he was pointing out all the Harps he had built in the church, and he said " these Harps are "..
    totally Amazing"
    Well,, you get the drift,, He said Totally Amazing about 15 times that day... and as usual for me, welll, I forgot his name.....
    so one day I was talking to a guy about getting his truck bed liner put in.. and I told him he needed to go so Old Totally Amazing..
    He said,, who?
    I said,,well I don't remember his name, but I call him Totally Amazing, because that is something he says in about every sentance..
    So ,, for years,, I just called Ray,, Totally Amazing...
    One time I had a fellow frim Wyoming decide to stay in my campground over winter.. He was looking at staying in his camp trailer and I told him that it was going to be tough..
    He said that he had seen those igloos over on spur highway,, and what did I think of them...
    Well I said,, " Old totally amazing makes um and I think they are really good and it would work well for you for winter living for one"
    So this guy goes over to War bonnet and asks to see a guy named TOTALLY AMAZING...
    and the crew working there bust out in laughter,,,,,, they all knew who Don was talking about.....lol
    His Son Bo' is still around and is a Kenai river guide and also sells realestate around here. he also has that coffee espressor shop in the parking lot of the Baily's furniture store in Slowdotna..
    ..
    I will check with Tony about his dome work...
    Max
    pretty Totally Amazing story huh?
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  11. #11
    Member GreginAlaska's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    240

    Default

    That's hilarious Max!

    Here is a link to his business down in the states

    http://www.lifelinedomes.com/

    It's totally amazing!

    Sounds like his son is doing a little bit of everything?
    “When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.” attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Knik-Fairview, Alaska
    Posts
    927

    Default

    I'm sure the coating would be fine. I've got 12 year old Arma Coat in my truck bed and it's held up fine so far. But I have 2 cautions, especially for boats left outside. First is that you definitely want to use the UV-protective additive (or additional clear coat) when you have it applied because the urethane type coatings will definitely fade with sun exposure. The second is that I notice there's a spot or two in the bed of the truck that feels like a shallow bubble. Not sure what's going on there ...could be moisture trapped between the coating and the bed of the truck, say if long term moisture exposure results in moisture absorbing through the coating, or maybe it means the coating's bond to the truck bed failed here and there even though they did a great job of roughing up the surface first. Can't tell without slicing through the coating, but there's no sign of rust underneath the truck...

    Brian

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default good

    bri: good to know. i hear the liner material is great on truck beds, but am wondering how it will stick if the fiberglass gets wet from the inside. that would happen when it gets dinged enough to puncture the liner material. i will call auto trim and ask their opinion on this. they were pretty sure the stuff would not work on alum, because of the differing expansion rates of alum against cold water, but heated by the sun. i think one of the guys there has it on his fiberglass boat, come to think of it. will post what i learn. j

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Knik-Fairview, Alaska
    Posts
    927

    Default

    I lived in Oregon before here, and there were several people down there putting the stuff on the bottom of driftboats and a I only heard good news. I also heard that if it was textured, that it did not slow the boat down at all. That seems counter-intuitive, but that's what I heard.

    Brian

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default interesting

    Alum or 'glass drift boats? A gent at Auto Trim has their bed liner material on his 'glass boat and it wears extremely well. However, he cautioned about putting it on a canoe, as the canoe would flex a lot more than his sandwich-hulled boat. I am leaning toward the Durabak, as one can re-coat it himself. Now, to get it to AK.... Still, the answer may be what 7mm does; run it as is, and re-glass it as needed. Works for him.

  16. #16
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Sterling
    Posts
    1,450

    Default one more time

    This spray on two part bed liner coating like the name brand ( Rhino Hide ) will adhere and stay put on canoes, not only on fiberglass material, but on Royalex, and Polyethyene.
    My rental boats probably get way more use than any personel canoe, and I have yet to have any problems.
    We made sure that we prep the canoe bottom area that is getting coated by sanding and also wiping down with MEK. This has worked on all surfaces,, no matter the flexing or difference in temperature, this stuff so far does not come off..
    I will again this spring be having about 12 canoes done with the keel protection, A few of you have asked if they could have there boats done at the same time, as the fellow that sprays it needs to make it worth his time to set up the machine and the price goes down the more boats sprayed due to the time it takes to set up, clean up and take down..
    let me know if you want in,,
    will be doing it in early to mid May..

    cost last year was about $140 per boat,,

    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  17. #17
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default

    When I coated the floor pieces of my ice house I didnt heat up nothing and It's adhered well. There is a place that sells the Duraback stuff on the old seward. I cant remember the name of the place but you can get it in AK. I have a cheap compressor and gun, heck you could even roll the stuff on if your prep work was clean. Polyethlene is a flexible material and has alot of give.

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default Dig deep, pls

    Maine: Pls dig deep into your memory banks, as I would like to try this Durabak. Two big reasons I like it over the spray-on are: I can touch it up as needed, and it will cost way less than the spray-on. Dura is haz mat, so if someone in AK has it, that beats the crap out of Seattle. I have no idea if it will be as good as the spray-on, however, and neither does Durabak. They just have no experience putting it on the outside of a canoe. I've got some sample chips coming from Dura, and will contact them for their AK dealer. If you think of the place in Anch, let us know if you will. I can get to Anch easy enough. Thanks. j

  19. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    554

    Default current info

    Auto Trim, Frb, can spray my canoe, but the guy I talked w/ said, when I asked how to get it off if it fails, that if I could get an edge up I could peel the whole sheet off. Hmm. Interesting. I guess, then, that it does not adhere real well, at least on a truck. He also said that the water-based stuff CAN NOT be removed (they use petrol based), and when people who have water-based in their trucks come in and want to replace it w/ their petrol product, he can't help them because the water-based won't come off. Now I am really confused. I got a couple of chips of the Durabak, sprayed onto a thin aluminum sheet. I can't scrape it much w/ a knife, and I have wrinkled the heck out of the alum sheet and can't get the Dura to pop. Not a great test, but it does not appear to be junk, at least. Their smooth stuff is like paint; thin, and can't be coated too many times. The textured stuff is about 1/32" thick, and can be layered to any thickness. Buy special rollers from them to apply it, or spray. I have not heard back from Rhino Hide, but one gent there advised me to look at two of their products on their web site, and said one has been used on canoes successfully, but w/ minimal abuse. I emailed back and will try to get chips of their stuff, and more details. In the meantime, I am going to put a Kevlar keel guard on my keel, because they apparently have a good track record (they work). Any experience w/ them? I figured that is any gunk I put on goes belly up, at least the most abused part will be protected. Wish I knew more. j

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Sandpoint, ID
    Posts
    1,974

    Default

    Hi Folks,

    1st post here. We lived in Homer back in the late '80's but had to move outside because of work...moving to ID when wife retires in 18 months. Anyway, I have a 17' Grumman square butt and I'm doing a rehab on it this winter. I found this old post about Durabak and wanted to know how things have worked out for you folks who used the product on the bottom of your freighter. Did you use the smooth or the textured finish and how well did it hold up for those of you who used it? It looks like a good way to go, but I would like to hear from some of you who put it to the test.

    Thanks and this is a very informative site!!

    Joe

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •