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Thread: chamfered charge holes on a j-frame?

  1. #1

    Default chamfered charge holes on a j-frame?

    I'm thinking of picking up a model 60 as a CCW. I've handled one a few times and liked the size, but I've heard that speedloaders can take a little jiggling to get to work. Haven't tried them on that particular gun. I've also heard that pros will use chamfered charge holes to help with reloading. My question is... how much do they help on a j-frame? Lots? Or are they not worth it?

    I know the model 60 Pro already has them installed, but my local shop doesn't carry them, and it's not the same barrel length I'm interested in.

    -Thanks-
    Tsimshian tribe, wolf clan, the house of Walsk.

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfeye View Post
    I'm thinking of picking up a model 60 as a CCW. I've handled one a few times and liked the size, but I've heard that speedloaders can take a little jiggling to get to work. Haven't tried them on that particular gun. I've also heard that pros will use chamfered charge holes to help with reloading. My question is... how much do they help on a j-frame? Lots? Or are they not worth it?

    I know the model 60 Pro already has them installed, but my local shop doesn't carry them, and it's not the same barrel length I'm interested in.

    -Thanks-
    I've got the 38 cal chamfering tool and have done a fair # of revolvers with it. It works "sort of." Yeah you chamfer the cylinder, but you don't chamfer the lips on the ejector star. You end up with kind of a "half-chamfer/half not" situation. There is some benefit with wadcutter loads, but not a lot. For comp shooting with wadcutters I ended up using the plastic Bianchi or Safariland speedloaders that held the rounds really rigid. The Aluminum versions from HKS let the rounds shift around and were WORTHLESS. But I ended up throwing away a lot of the plastic ones as they aged and loosened. Before a match I'd go through the bin and sort for the tightest and use those. That is if I didn't have brand new ones on hand.

    Sharp chamber edges are less of an issue if you use bullets with rounded orgives. Big meplats can cause troubles with the HKS, but they're not an issue with any other brand of speedloader that holds the rounds rigid.

    My experience and recommendation? Save the cost of a chamfer job or chamfer tool and use it to buy really good speeloaders instead. They'll make a bigger difference in the long and short run. I haven't had that chamfer tool in my hand in over 10 years, but I'm sure it's laying around here somewhere. Meanwhile half a dozen or more 38/357 handguns have come into the house, and I've never bothered to chamfer them.

  3. #3
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    Default Surprise

    Wolfeye:
    Thanks for the question. I have a J frame, and a speed loader. BUT, I didn't even know about chamfering for a speed loader.

    BrownBear:
    Thanks for the answer, and great explanation.

    Boy, am I smart now.
    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
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  4. #4
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    Default

    I've got a 640 .357 with Eagle secret-service grips, and I carry a HKS speed-loader. I carry 125g SJHP in the gun, but when reloading with hollow-points the speed-loader can get stuck against the grip.

    I've found that I can carry 140g Hornady LeverEvolutions in my speed-loader and they make for much easier reloading. The pointed polymer-tips make lining-up with the chambers a lot easier, you can release them from the speed-loader a little farther-out, and they don't deform like lead when banging around in my pocket.

    I like that model 60 from the performance-center, It is purdy! Another one for the wish-list. Good shootin'!

    Jay

  5. #5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfeye View Post
    I'm thinking of picking up a model 60 as a CCW. I've handled one a few times and liked the size, but I've heard that speedloaders can take a little jiggling to get to work. Haven't tried them on that particular gun. I've also heard that pros will use chamfered charge holes to help with reloading. My question is... how much do they help on a j-frame? Lots? Or are they not worth it?

    I know the model 60 Pro already has them installed, but my local shop doesn't carry them, and it's not the same barrel length I'm interested in.

    -Thanks-

    Here is the setup I got from Brownell's about 20 years ago. I'm kinda surprised at the price. If I recall, I didn't pay much less than that way back when. It's a hand tool and easy to use. Good to know what the tool costs before you get a quote for having someone else do it. I'm betting it will be tossup between hiring someone, or buying the tool and doing it yourself. Good instructions come with it.

  6. #6

    Default

    Wow, good replies. I've always used HKS loaders, but I'll try other brands if they make it easier. My favorite load is Cor-bon 110 gr DPX +p, and I don't see much need to use wide meplat .357 hardcasts with a speedloader anyway. Sounds like it's best to try different speedloaders & ammo first, then chamfering as a last resort.
    Tsimshian tribe, wolf clan, the house of Walsk.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfeye View Post
    Wow, good replies. I've always used HKS loaders, but I'll try other brands if they make it easier. My favorite load is Cor-bon 110 gr DPX +p, and I don't see much need to use wide meplat .357 hardcasts with a speedloader anyway. Sounds like it's best to try different speedloaders & ammo first, then chamfering as a last resort.
    Where are you located Wolfeye? If you decide you want to chamfer even after trying different speedloaders, I'd be happy to loan you the chamfering tool. It's small, and long as you're comfortable removing and disassembling the crane on a Smith, it's an easy job. I can talk you through that, too.

  8. #8
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    Default

    why not just open the cylinder up for full moon clips. they still let you shoot without the moon clip if you want and full moon clips are alot faster than speed loaders.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thebear_78 View Post
    why not just open the cylinder up for full moon clips. they still let you shoot without the moon clip if you want and full moon clips are alot faster than speed loaders.
    Good thought, but I've never seen it done to a 60. Is there enough meat?

  10. #10
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    Tk custom shows moon clips for the model 60 on thier website so I imagine it wouldn't be a problem. I know steve at Alaska custom firearms can do a moon clip conversion right here in town.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBear View Post
    Where are you located Wolfeye? If you decide you want to chamfer even after trying different speedloaders, I'd be happy to loan you the chamfering tool. It's small, and long as you're comfortable removing and disassembling the crane on a Smith, it's an easy job. I can talk you through that, too.
    Thanks for the offer, Brownbear. I currently live in WA, but I show my face back up there in my home state every summer for vacation, usually in the Ketchikan area.

    Moonclips... I hadn't thought of those. I'd have to try them out first. All very good ideas.
    Tsimshian tribe, wolf clan, the house of Walsk.

  12. #12
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    Default Is it worth the bother?

    What are the odds of having to reload in a CCW self defense situation? Must be very very close to zero.

    Carrying the gun is bother enough; if you have to carry extra ammo the odds are even less that you aren't going to carry the gun and have it when you need it.

    I read some time back that virtually all gun fights were one shot a seven feet or less. I suspect things haven't changed much.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak View Post
    What are the odds of having to reload in a CCW self defense situation? Must be very very close to zero.

    Carrying the gun is bother enough; if you have to carry extra ammo the odds are even less that you aren't going to carry the gun and have it when you need it.

    I read some time back that virtually all gun fights were one shot a seven feet or less. I suspect things haven't changed much.
    I think it depends a lot on what you read. There are also stats out there that shots fired in police shootings range somewhere between 9 and 13, if I recall correctly. A 5-shot revolver with limited accuracy makes me twitchy about reloads. High capacity autos lend themselves to frequent trigger pulls I guess. And carrying a speedloader in your pocket is easy.

    In all my training the reloading was part of an overall strategy: Engage, cover, reload. You did your best to hit the guy right off while also buying time to get behind cover. Once you attained the cover, you reloaded even if you weren't empty, so you were fully loaded for what came next.

    I view defensive shooting like the old saw telling helicopter pilots how to survive a crash: "Keep flying the bird till the last part stops moving." I'm going to keep on shooting till the sucker isn't moving any more.

  14. #14
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    Default Police or citizen?

    The situation for the police is certainly different from that for a citizen carrying for personal protection. The police have a duty to engage the perp and capture or neutralize him; my primary duty is to protect myself and my family. I can only guess what I would do in a shootout; I hope I never find out.

    In most cases the very sight of a gun is enough to resolve the situation; firing more than one shot must be quite rare. I have read of situations where several shots were needed by the police to bring down a large doped up man but in all cases it was with a 9mm class handgun. I'll take my chances with a large caliber handgun - I like the 329 and 6 shots over a Mdl 60 and reloading. The five shot .44 Spcl. titanium S&W would be even better but I don't own one.



    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBear View Post
    I think it depends a lot on what you read. There are also stats out there that shots fired in police shootings range somewhere between 9 and 13, if I recall correctly. A 5-shot revolver with limited accuracy makes me twitchy about reloads. High capacity autos lend themselves to frequent trigger pulls I guess. And carrying a speedloader in your pocket is easy.

    In all my training the reloading was part of an overall strategy: Engage, cover, reload. You did your best to hit the guy right off while also buying time to get behind cover. Once you attained the cover, you reloaded even if you weren't empty, so you were fully loaded for what came next.

    I view defensive shooting like the old saw telling helicopter pilots how to survive a crash: "Keep flying the bird till the last part stops moving." I'm going to keep on shooting till the sucker isn't moving any more.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak View Post
    The situation for the police is certainly different from that for a citizen carrying for personal protection. The police have a duty to engage the perp and capture or neutralize him; my primary duty is to protect myself and my family. I can only guess what I would do in a shootout; I hope I never find out.

    In most cases the very sight of a gun is enough to resolve the situation; firing more than one shot must be quite rare. I have read of situations where several shots were needed by the police to bring down a large doped up man but in all cases it was with a 9mm class handgun. I'll take my chances with a large caliber handgun - I like the 329 and 6 shots over a Mdl 60 and reloading. The five shot .44 Spcl. titanium S&W would be even better but I don't own one.
    I learned a rule. If my gun comes out, it comes out to shoot. No threats and no showing it off. If I shoot, I'm going to keep shooting till the last part stops moving.

    Nuff theory. Carry your own gun and wear your own theories.

    I'm outa here.

  16. #16
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    Default Can't shoot someone in the back

    While hesitating to shoot can certainly get you killed you also can't shoot somebody in the back after they dropped the knife and are running away.

    I've had to pick up my shotgun on two occasions when I was threaten but it didn't justify killing the attackers. In both cases I won't have gotten killed but beat up pretty badly as the other guys were unarmed; having the gun resolved the situation quickly without anyone getting hurt. They swallowed their macho pride; I didn't get beat up - a pretty good outcome.


    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBear View Post
    I learned a rule. If my gun comes out, it comes out to shoot. No threats and no showing it off. If I shoot, I'm going to keep shooting till the last part stops moving.

    Nuff theory. Carry your own gun and wear your own theories.

    I'm outa here.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  17. #17
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    I like speed loaders. I carry one for my CC revolver, and an extry clip for my CC Auto.

    I even have a Speed Loader for my 44 Mag. I carry it in my mouth, for ready access, when I see a bar.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
    Has it ever occurred to you, that Nothing ever occurs to God? Adrien Rodgers.
    You can't out-give God.

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