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Thread: Coat Colors of Labs good or bad.

  1. #1
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    Default Coat Colors of Labs good or bad.

    Why are people interested in Silver labs or any non-akc recognized color? The few Silvers I've seen seemed like ok dogs but their coats were odd. All undercoat no guard hair. They honestly look like Weimeraner (sp) even in their build. I'm trying to equate this with the popularity of chocolates and that I believe that color doesn't matter but I just cringe when I see Lab puppies advertised as white, fox red, silver with no regard for talent.

    I thought the poster on the "chocolate pup" tread that mentioned doing research into his dog for no other reason than to see if there were any negative traits with silver was interesting and good that someone is researching.

    It may be what I'm used to and these colors preferences are the same as me prefering Yellow Labs (carmel with black noses and eyeliner, brown eyes) because of one I had for 14 years.
    Can anyone explain why someone would breed these unrecognized colors on purpose? Wetlands Retrievers, do you see any difference in temperment when training them?

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  2. #2

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    Linda, today's society wants the latest "fad" and there are breeders that capitalize on this. Why would people want a mutt when they can have a purebred dog for a cheaper price? Because some breeders labeled them "designer dogs" (Labradoodles, puggles etc.) and spread the word that they were the latest thing.)
    If people see the word Rare describing a dog, then they think they're buying something more valuable...most folks just don't do enough research to find out that rare can also mean "falling outside of the standard".
    "It's the journey that's important, with experience and knowledge to be gained along the way, in the company of our faithful dogs and our good friends."
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    Silver is a genetic trait that shows up just like albinoism. It is very rare because it is not a normal gene that most labs carry. Then you have a person out there shopping for all the labs they can find that have been known to have pups with this trait. Then they start mating silver carrier to silver carrier to produce a litter with most all silver pups. They basically keep breeding into that same line that produces the silver gene.
    AKC doesn't register them as silver, but they are registered as a chocolate. Chocolate lines are where the silver trait comes from.

    From my experience with them they act like and train like regular labs. I ran one for a client several years ago in hunt test and put several titles on her.

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    Default Corrected by a labradoodle owner.

    I'm just putting something together about Labradoodles and Port. Water Dogs for Alaska Dog News since one is going to end up in the White House.

    Cathy Moore is writing an article about her parents Labradoodle for me. Last summer, in one "foot in mouth" moment at an Alaska DockDogs event, I asked out loud, "whats the point of those things". It was her parents Labradoodle going off the dock. (People should wear name tags!) Cathy explained the hypoallergnenic quality of the poodle and the malibitly of the lab make good service dogs to people who need them. Same thing with Schnooldles, Goldendoodles.

    I stood corrected. When it gets down to it all our dogs are mixes. I had a female Lab with top FC/AFC on both sides going back past Snakeeyes. I was always asked if she was a whippet mix. (maybe)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Why are people interested in Silver labs or any non-akc recognized color? The few Silvers I've seen seemed like ok dogs but their coats were odd. All undercoat no guard hair. They honestly look like Weimeraner (sp) even in their build. I'm trying to equate this with the popularity of chocolates and that I believe that color doesn't matter but I just cringe when I see Lab puppies advertised as white, fox red, silver with no regard for talent.

    I thought the poster on the "chocolate pup" tread that mentioned doing research into his dog for no other reason than to see if there were any negative traits with silver was interesting and good that someone is researching.

    It may be what I'm used to and these colors preferences are the same as me prefering Yellow Labs (carmel with black noses and eyeliner, brown eyes) because of one I had for 14 years.
    Can anyone explain why someone would breed these unrecognized colors on purpose? Wetlands Retrievers, do you see any difference in temperment when training them?

    www.alaskadognews.com
    I assume you know the dogs being called white and fox red are light and dark color phases of the yellow labs and registered as yellow. They are both recognized by both AKC and UKC as yellow labs. For some folks it is a preference just like the color of your car. I am sure some folks are breeding them because they are sound working dogs, with good temperaments, easy trainability, and the ability to be hunting machines, rescue dogs, seeing eye dogs, the family pet or just about anything else you have the time and energy to make out of them. I am also sure some people are breeding them to make a buck at any cost.

    I believe this dog is a yellow lab and have never called it anything else.


  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Cathy explained the hypoallergnenic quality of the poodle and the malibitly of the lab make good service dogs
    www.alaskadognews.com
    Not so fast... There are a number of labradoodles that wind up in shelters each year because they turned out NOT to be hypoallergenic. As is the case with all mixed breed dogs, some wind up with more of one parent than the other...in this case, more of the lab fur than the poodle fur.
    "It's the journey that's important, with experience and knowledge to be gained along the way, in the company of our faithful dogs and our good friends."
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

  7. #7

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    June 2006 AKC Gazette - page 67, by Anne Rogers Editor’s note: This is an interesting look at labradoodles, written from the other side of the cross ~ the Poodle side. Did you know this unfortunate “crossbreed fad” was initiated by the needs of just ONE
    person? This article is from the Poodle breed column, in the June 2006 AKC Gazette - page 67, by Anne Rogers Clark. ~Julie
    *****
    “The following is offered to clear up any misunderstanding concerning the breeding of labradoodles by
    The Royal Guide Dogs of Australia. [Poodles breed column, June 2005] This is reprinted with the
    permission of the Guide Dog Association of Victoria.
    INFORMATION SHEET - LABRADOODLES
    Labradoodles are a cross between a Labrador Retriever and a standard Poodle.
    Royal Guide Dogs Association of Australia bred its first litter of labradoodles in late 1989, in an effort
    to produce a dog that would be more suitable for people with allergies.
    The coat of the Poodle is generally recognized as being more suitable for people with allergies, because
    it does not shed as much as coats of other dogs. The Association aimed to produce a dog the would
    combine the temperament of the Labrador (which is suitable for Guide Dog training) with the coat of a
    Poodle.
    The Association does not claim that labradoodles are allergy-free, or non-allergenic, as has been often
    written about these dogs.

    They were bred as part of an experimental process aimed at finding a dog that is trainable for GuideDog work, but has a coat more suited to people with allergies. In a litter of 10 labradoodles, a person who
    is allergic to most dogs could find they were allergic to 8 of the 10 labradoodles, or even all of them.

    The project was initially designed to meet the needs of one particular woman from Hawaii, whose
    husband was allergic to most dogs. This woman had requested that the Association try to find a dog that
    could be trained as a Guide Dog and would not produce an allergic reaction in her husband.
    Samples of the coats of all three dogs, from the first litter of labradoodles, were sent to Hawaii. The
    woman’s husband showed some allergic reaction to two of the three coats. The dog which did not produce
    an allergic reaction in the husband went on to be trained and is working most successfully in Hawaii.
    A vision-impaired person, assessed as suitable for a Guide Dog, but who has allergies, is thoroughly
    tested by a qualified allergist for a reaction with the hair, skin scraping and saliva sample of the
    labradoodle, before the dog is allocated to the person as a Guide Dog.
    The last labradoodles to qualify as Guide Dogs were bred in 1996. Guide Dogs Victoria has no plans to
    continue any further development of this particular crossbreed. The success rate of the cross was less then
    35 percent for use as Guide Dogs, with only a small proportion of those being utilized in the allergy
    situations as outlined above. The testing process outlined above found that many Labrador Retrievers
    could also be utilized in these particular circumstances.
    Guide Dogs Victoria is a not-for-profit organization and utilized its own breeding program to provide
    dogs of sound temperament and physical requirements for use as Guide Dogs.
    Our thanks to the Guide Dog Association of Victoria for this information.

    ~Anne Rogers Clark
    "It's the journey that's important, with experience and knowledge to be gained along the way, in the company of our faithful dogs and our good friends."
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Why are people interested in Silver labs or any non-akc recognized color? They honestly look like Weimeraner (sp) even in their build.
    I think you just answered one of your own questions...

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    Silver labs can be regeistered just like someone else mentioned. They are regeistered as a chocolate lab. I have owned black, yellow, and chocolate labs and have loved all of them but my next one will be a silver.

    It all depends own what breeder you get your silver from own what they look like. I have looked/talked to several breeders and most dogs looked different. I did find a place in Texas that sells them and they look as good as any lab out their plus they are not trying to run a puppy mill like most places now days for money. After doing more research on them and getting great response from former customers about them and their puppies I will be purchasing one from them. Its just a simple matter of what color you want.

    You can take a mutt and make a champion out of him if you spend enough time with him!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    Default Labrador Retriever Club of America's position . . .

    Here is the position statement from the Labrador Retriever Club, regarding "silver" Labrador Retrievers:

    "There is no genetic basis for the silver gene in Labradors. The silver color is a disqualification under the Standard for the breed. The LRC does not recognize, accept or condone the sale or advertising of any Labrador as a silver Labrador. The Club opposes the practice of registering silver as chocolate."

    AKC will however register "silvers" as chocolates as noted . . .

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    Why is it that LRC will not recognize the color silver if AKC will? What about the other color phases(white,red fox,etc) and do they recognize them? What if both parents are recognized by LRC and they have pups and one is silver. Does LRC disown that pup even though they recognize both parents? Just asking questions.

  12. #12

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    AKC does NOT recognize silver. As you said, the dog is registered as chocolate. The standard does not recognize silver as a shade of chocolate. It is not mentioned anywhere. The standard clearly states that yellows range in shade from "fox red to light cream".
    Didn't you ever wonder why silvers just appeared?
    Yellow labs have been known to exist since the inception of the breed while silver were not present until the 1950's. This indicates that the silver gene was introduced from outside the breed much later.

    That said, I don't care what color your lab is....just don't be hawking silver as a "rare" colored labrador and trying to sell them for jacked up prices. That's what is messed up!
    "It's the journey that's important, with experience and knowledge to be gained along the way, in the company of our faithful dogs and our good friends."
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    Default LRC a conformation club?

    Isnt the LRC more involved with show and conformation? I know they hold working tests but those are very easy. But it's been a while. I think that is why they would not recognize silver, while the AKC holds a variety of events. When I was in the ring even in 1982-5 I never saw a darker yellow put up, only very white (and fat) yellows.
    My field worked but very well proportioned black got one best of breed under one judge but never again. He was lean and a fair field dog. Not the speed and drive of a FT dog but much more than most show dogs so he was very muscular and thinner than the the other dogs in the ring. Other than his rotten attitude to other males he was great.

    I wonder who is really breeding an all-around lab that truely can walk from the ring to a hunt test. I dont say field trial because so few field trial dogs manage an open anyway. It's crazy.

    www.alaskadognews.com

  14. #14

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    Linda, you might be surprised by the number of folks who are interested in a working dog (lab) with proper conformation. When I first began frequenting the Retriever Training Forum, I don't think there was anyone who posted who was interested in conformation. However, with more and more labs showing up without otter tails and a good natured disposition and bearing funky ear sets, folks started to recognize that the hallmarks of the breed were disappearing. The majority of trial folks still could give a rat's behind what their lab looks like as long as it picks up the birds, but there is a very strong resurgence of folks who are paying attention to conformation too.
    "It's the journey that's important, with experience and knowledge to be gained along the way, in the company of our faithful dogs and our good friends."
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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