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Thread: Carrying with no holster. Is this safe?

  1. #1
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    Default Carrying with no holster. Is this safe?

    I recently found out that a guy that I work with carries an XD.45 cocked and locked tucked in the front waistband of his pants with not holster. I was shocked, but he acted like it was nothing. Am I wrong in thinking that this is just too dangerous?

    Also, I recently bought a S&W Airweight 442 in .38 DAO. Can I safely carry this in my coat pocket without a holster, as has been suggested to me? For anyone that has one, what is your preferred method of carry?

    Thanks for your time!

  2. #2

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    !

    Front of his pants! Baaaaad idea!

    Get a pocket holster for that 642. I have a Desantis Nemesis. It holds the gun ready is a pants pocket or a coat pocket. It keeps the trigger covered and also helps keep the gun clean.

    Your friend needs to rethink his carry method or he may blow off a favorite piece of his anatomy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jguy.357 View Post
    I recently found out that a guy that I work with carries an XD.45 cocked and locked tucked in the front waistband of his pants with not holster. I was shocked, but he acted like it was nothing. Am I wrong in thinking that this is just too dangerous?

    Also, I recently bought a S&W Airweight 442 in .38 DAO. Can I safely carry this in my coat pocket without a holster, as has been suggested to me? For anyone that has one, what is your preferred method of carry?

    Thanks for your time!
    Sticking a gun in your pants looks good in the movies, but in my experience it isn't worth a hoot if you are at all active. Aint going to be any bending over or squatting with it in the front of your pants. When forced to do it, it's a real short term thing for me, and the small of the back is the best place I've found while still leaving me a little freedom to move.

    Lots depends on the physique, the clothes, the belt, the gun and your activity. Small of the back is handy for getting an unholstered gun from my truck to the house when I have a bunch of stuff in my hands. But it's sure not the way I'll carry all day long. Front of the pants? He's saying "Hey look at my gun!!!"

    As for pocket carry, try it. Most models are going to hang in your pocket. The only guns I've found reasonable for that are hammerless revolvers or those retroed with a hammer shroud. By the time autos get small enough and round enough for me to retrieve easily from a pocket, they're also probably not as potent as my revolvers. I've got a shrouded Bulldog 44 that's just right, and no slouch at all for power. Just my pockets and my choices. Others will most certainly be happy with something else.

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    I think that street carry (the front waistband) made popular by the movies is the carry used for what the police in Houston refer to as the 'castration shot'. I would think the hip pocket of your Levis would be a much better place to carry. I have carried (CCW) a shortened 1911 that way many times. If the gun should discharge a round, there isn't much there to injure except a burn and a new crease in your posterior.

  5. #5
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    I prefer carrying without a holster, but won't carry a single-action handgun "cocked and locked" unless I'm knowingly going into a trouble situation, and since I won't do that, either, it's a mute point.

    I carry small, light double action handguns. The SP101 I've carried for years has a "clip" that I made and installed that keeps it from falling down my pants, like the Barami Hip Grip, but so that I can use the more comfortable Hogue rubber grips for that sharp 357 mag recoil. I can run, walk, sit, dance, get in and out of a vehicle, sit in chairs, it doesn't snag on anything, and I do just about everything but cartwheels without it going anywhere. I can carry it on the strong side, crossdraw, pocket, anywhere. It is so comfortable that I don't even notice it's there.

    I just bought a Para PDA in 9mm DAO, and I'm going to be putting a similar clip on it as well.
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    I'll carry my .45 Commander in condition 1 stuck in the back of my pants when crossing the parking lot at night or over to the credit union, but no way would I stick it in the front
    Bunny Boots and Bearcats: Utility Sled Mayhem

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    The Springer has several safeties. One you have to have the trigger pressed, You also have to hold the grip tightly for it to fire. It think it may be safe but a stupid place to carry.

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    Default Old idea, new name

    Tucked in the waistband used to be known as the "Mexican Carry", but has since been recently re-popularized as the "Plaxico Carry".

    The only safe way to carry a semi-auto in your waistband without a holster to keep it secured is with an empty chamber. (Also known as the "Israeli Carry" because of the IDF)

    While SA Autos are generally VERY safe, with the grip safety and (on some models) the firing pin block, John Browning never intended it for waistband carry, and there are just too many things that can happen when a gun can move around randomly.

    The co-worker carrying in condition one, naked, is endangering not only himself, but bystanders, too. Too many out of control, variable and random movements for MY peace of mind.

    Check out this thread...

    http://forums.accuratereloading.com/...0418#911100418

    The events discussed occurred September 13, 2000 in Brighton, NY. A Colt 1991 Model (1911 pattern, with the firing pin block) cocked and locked had an accidental discharge. The incident was investigated for the Rochester Police Dept. by Officer William Benwitz. If anyone wants to contact him, please call me first.

    You are carrying an explosive device (albeit a small one) on your person. Let's be careful out there. You spent $300 to $3000 on a gun. You spend an open-ended amount on practice ammunition. Spend another $15 to $150 on a decent holster. It keeps you safe from AD and keeps you safer from attackers by making your draw more reliable.

    The declarative statements at the beginning of this post not demonstrable universal truths, but are my very strongly held opinions. Treat them as such.

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    Default I like it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    I prefer carrying without a holster, but won't carry a single-action handgun "cocked and locked" unless I'm knowingly going into a trouble situation, and since I won't do that, either, it's a mute point.

    I carry small, light double action handguns. The SP101 I've carried for years has a "clip" that I made and installed that keeps it from falling down my pants, like the Barami Hip Grip, but so that I can use the more comfortable Hogue rubber grips for that sharp 357 mag recoil. I can run, walk, sit, dance, get in and out of a vehicle, sit in chairs, it doesn't snag on anything, and I do just about everything but cartwheels without it going anywhere. I can carry it on the strong side, crossdraw, pocket, anywhere. It is so comfortable that I don't even notice it's there.

    I just bought a Para PDA in 9mm DAO, and I'm going to be putting a similar clip on it as well.
    OH YEAH,
    What about when you hafta go potty?

    You've mentioned that gun (and Clip) before.
    Thanks for the picture.

    The Grips I like, but too bad the SP101 doesn't have longer barrel.

    How does the Clip fasten to your gun?

    Was it easy to make? Outta what?

    Smitty of the North
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBear View Post
    Sticking a gun in your pants looks good in the movies, but in my experience it isn't worth a hoot if you are at all active. Aint going to be any bending over or squatting with it in the front of your pants. When forced to do it, it's a real short term thing for me, and the small of the back is the best place I've found while still leaving me a little freedom to move.

    Lots depends on the physique, the clothes, the belt, the gun and your activity. Small of the back is handy for getting an unholstered gun from my truck to the house when I have a bunch of stuff in my hands. But it's sure not the way I'll carry all day long. Front of the pants? He's saying "Hey look at my gun!!!"

    As for pocket carry, try it. Most models are going to hang in your pocket. The only guns I've found reasonable for that are hammerless revolvers or those retroed with a hammer shroud. By the time autos get small enough and round enough for me to retrieve easily from a pocket, they're also probably not as potent as my revolvers. I've got a shrouded Bulldog 44 that's just right, and no slouch at all for power. Just my pockets and my choices. Others will most certainly be happy with something else.
    The trouble I'm had with CC in my pocket, is the weight. A heavy gun will weigh down my coat pocket, or bulge it out, and make it rather obvious. IMO, only a lighter weight handgun is appropriate to carry in my pocket.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
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    I recently found out that a guy that I work with carries an XD.45 cocked and locked tucked in the front waistband of his pants with not holster. I was shocked, but he acted like it was nothing. Am I wrong in thinking that this is just too dangerous?

    He may be comfortable with it. I don't think it's very practical or secure and the front of your waistband is a dumb place to shove a gun.

    I carry everyday in a strongside IWB holster. Most times I never notice it and neither does anyone else.
    Now what ?

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    Default what?

    It is only a matter of time before your co-worker shoots himself in the jewels, steer way clear of geniuses like him. Mexican-carry was intended for single-action revolvers, and most people don't even know the correct technique for doing so. Glocks and XDs have very high rates of unintended discharges. All your co-worker has to do is neglect to clear his finger from the trigger-guard while he is shoving it in his pants, and bang! Same with a holster, but I'd rather graze my butt than sever my femoral artery.

    I carry my 640 in a pocket-holster when in my coat pockets, and a Milt Sparks VM2 IWB holster when wearing lighter clothes. My Glock 26 also rides in a VM2, both are virtually undetectable and very safe. Good leather is worth its weight in gold.

    Jay

  13. #13
    Mark
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    Originally Posted by Mark
    ......I carry small, light double action handguns. The SP101 I've carried for years has a "clip" that I made and installed that keeps it from falling down my pants, like the Barami Hip Grip, but so that I can use the more comfortable Hogue rubber grips for that sharp 357 mag recoil. I can run, walk, sit, dance, get in and out of a vehicle, sit in chairs, it doesn't snag on anything, and I do just about everything but cartwheels without it going anywhere. I can carry it on the strong side, crossdraw, pocket, anywhere. It is so comfortable that I don't even notice it's there......
    OH YEAH,
    What about when you hafta go potty?.....
    Then I have to fondle the gun.

    If I'm sitting on a log, I set the piece next to me. If I'm on a toilet, I set it in my briefs around my ankles.

    ....The Grips I like, but too bad the SP101 doesn't have longer barrel.....
    I chose the shortest barrel, and never regretted it.

    My friend liked my piece so much he built one for himself, but he chose the 3" barrel.

    How does the Clip fasten to your gun?

    Was it easy to make? Outta what?
    It is made from a sheet of stainless sheet metal. I cut/filed a piece that fits right along the grip frame with the "tab" extending off of it, and the grips fit right over it, holding it in place.

    It was easy, and cheaper than a holster (I scrounged the piece of stainless sheet metal).

  14. #14
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    Default Pocket carry

    I've carried quite a few revolvers in the pocket of my old trench coat and some jackets with large pockets. The 329 PD is light enough to do that for causal carry.

    Coat pockets are generally dirty places so be carefully of pcking up stray dirt and lint etc. Many years ago when the police still carried revolvers we had one detective that came into the gun store where I worked part time store with his shrouded hammer S&W and ended up showing it to us for some reason I don't recall. When we examimed it we found it had so much lint and crud from carrying it in his picket that the hammer couldn't be brought back to full cock. If he needed the pistol it would not have even fired!
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    Great! Thanks a bunch for the info. I really appreciate it. It's really nice to get some opinions from different points of view and different levels of experience. Again, thanks.

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    Yep, Mexican Carry. As jay51 pointed out. Gets real interesting if you get T-Boned in traffic.
    A judge will have a field day with him if he ever has an accidental discharge and some bystander catches some lead.

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    You either trust the safety(ies) and will carry it in a holster, waistband, pocket, glovebox, etc or not.

    There is no difference between any of these locations; if you trust it cocked and locked in any of these places, then it should be good enough for all of them.

    I personally don't like the waistband though.

    KRS

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    I view this form two simple points only.

    First, safety: Never point the muzzle of the gun at anything you don't want to shoot off. A front of the pants ND could cause a serious injury, in the standing or sitting position. The rear pants pocket will keep the muzzle pointed at a less dangerous place. The worst wound form this position would be the lower legs, serious, but nothing like a round in the crotch or upper thigh.
    Second, presentation: Can you get to it quickly and bring it into the fight without further endangering yourself or others? The most likely time for an ND is during the draw. Whether it be in a jacket pocket, IWB holster or a Sam Browne rig. Loose clothing and hammers don't mix well. The hammer and other knobs and levers can catch on clothing and could actually cause or aid in an ND.

    Of course however it is carried, good technique and proper training with lots of practice will make all presentations smoother and all shot fly straighter.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  19. #19

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    True story:
    This past summer there was a guy who was carrying a revolver in this manner on the Russian River. Yep, he encountered a bear, pulled his revolver, and promptly put a large caliber bullet through his shlong. Yep, we all had a good laugh about "natural selection" and Darwin Awards.

    DON'T FREAKING CARRY LIKE THAT! Use a holster that has some sort of retention. You should at least be able to hold / shake the holster upside down and not have the handgun fall loose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post

    It is made from a sheet of stainless sheet metal. I cut/filed a piece that fits right along the grip frame with the "tab" extending off of it, and the grips fit right over it, holding it in place.
    Can I assume that the "sheet metal", is held in place the same way the grips are, including the grip screw?

    Thanks
    Smitty of the North
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