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Thread: Scout gear on 7gcbc

  1. #1
    Member Terry's Avatar
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    Default Scout gear on 7gcbc

    Does anyone know of a PMI that will approve scout gear on the 7gcbc. Northland Aviation out of Fairbanks use to have a mutliple field approval, but the feds did away with them. I would have the service kit put on it to resupport the gear box. Thanks.

    Terry

  2. #2
    Member AK-HUNT's Avatar
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    Default Not anymore

    I would say your chances are VERY slim on that one. Northland is kinda the Scout authority up here and does a bunch of them. It was kind of a stretch when it was allowed.

  3. #3
    Member Terry's Avatar
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    Default Why was it a strecth

    I had the engineer for American Champion Aircraft send me prints and with the Service kit there is only one additional piece of tubing that makes up the scout gear box.

    Terry

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    Default Field approval

    You can't hardly get a field approval for anything now adays. It has to be ridiculously well justified if you do. You are basically talking about re-engineering a gear. The loads change with the longer arm. Are you reinforcing the gearbox or just putting on a bigger leg? Doesn't matter really.
    Planning to drop test the thing? What loads are changed on the mount points? How will it comply with original (CAR 3) design?
    Its not as easy as looking at it and it making sense. I would be real surprised if you can get an approval. I wouldn't even ask my PMI but some IA's have access to PMI's who are still willing to "play ball".
    You gain prop clearance. The 7 gearbox's are still weaker. I would just fly the 7 till you're tired of it and buy a scout if you want or a cub. Converting airplanes usually ends up in a money losing proposition. Trade the 7 and use the money you would have used converting stuff to the upgraded bird. Just depends on how much money, time, and headache you want to deal with. My .02.
    Northland is your best bet to have it done right, in my honest opinion. (I think you said he already said nope.)

    PM me if you want and I'll pass my cel #. Easier to describe talking, not typing and I just typed WAY too much.

  5. #5
    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    Default

    Why do you want a PMI? Are you using the plane commercially?
    Contrary to Hunt's statement, there are plenty of field approovals done every year. there is just alot more paperwork loopholes to jump thru.
    Find an IA you find reliable and get to work on the paperwork end first. There are plenty of 7gcbc's on Scout gear. Shouldn't be that hard to get a field approval. I think there's a place in Wash. state called Rainbo Flying Service that sorta specializes in Citabria's. Get a hold of them. Also Steve Conaster in Fbks has had some approved in the last couple years.
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
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  6. #6
    Member AK-HUNT's Avatar
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    Default A little clarification MT

    "Why do you want a PMI? Are you using the plane commercially?"
    --One has nothing to do with the other. You are wrong. Every IA has a PMI and the PMI has to sign block three of the 337 for a field approval, hence Terry's question. (All PMI's are not the same.)

    "Contrary to Hunt's statement, there are plenty of field approovals done every year. there is just alot more paperwork loopholes to jump thru."
    --There are plenty, you are right. I don't believe I said there weren't. Just that they are hard to get and ones requiring engineering are next to impossible. You can jump through all the loopholes you want but some stuff done in the past will never be approved again. That is my point. I have a fairly decent idea. I'm an IA and I do field approvals from time to time. About a dozen last year. I'm not the expert by ANY means but I do know how the system works and you are a little (lot) off base.

    "There are plenty of 7gcbc's on Scout gear."
    --I don't know of any done after FAA's "change 13" but there may be (probably are). That changed the field approval world.

    "Shouldn't be that hard to get a field approval."
    --Every one is hard now. The paperwork has tripled or quadrupled. Let alone one with engineering. They suck. Nowhere am I saying "impossible" by the way...



    Terry, Did you ever find the right IA and PMI and got the gear approved, by the way? Northland IS the Citabria expert up here for the most part, but hoped you found an "in" somewhere to do it? Give a status report when you get a minute. I noticed the plane is out. You are down in front of Mark's right?

  7. #7

    Default

    There is a 7gcbc w/ scout gear for sale- or was for sale for a while, anyway, at Lake Hood. I've run it around a little- pretty solid little plane with the metal spar upgrade. Might be a way to go. PM me if you want the guys number.

    Doug

  8. #8
    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    Default

    Got your dander up, eh Hunt?
    I'm not alot or a little off base. I'm aware of change 13 and how it changed the field approval process. It did make commen approvals harder, but not impossible, to get. I'm aware of at least one scout gear approval since change 13, thus the mention of Steve Conaster in Fbks. I don't know if Steve has a business name.
    I'm used to "PMI" meaning principal maintenance inspector and being used in the 121, 135 biz. I deal with several PMI's, POI's and PAI's at work, or at least when they show up this far away from urbana. I've never had any FAA guy tell me he was my "PMI". Least not in the 17 yrs I've held the rating. Maybe you guys in the population centers get "assigned" to particular FAA PMI's. Us out in the bush deal with whoever is here at the time, or whoever answers the phone when we call, or just whoever is the most helpful. So far my experience has been that most of them are helpful.
    Terry, if you have a kit from ACA, I just can't imagine that you won't get a field approval.
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
    I have less friends now!!

  9. #9
    Member Terry's Avatar
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    Default Update

    Almost through engineering, but allot harder than it use to be, got some assistance from Peter Pupator and drawings from ACAC. Yes, I had the service kit installed and 8 additional frame/support/gussets pieces installed (should be near indestructible). Paper work will end up costing probably as much as install. Its ashame cause the gear is so much sturdier and safer. To date, the plane has had 4 bent legs in its 35 years, lucky the frame was still straight. It should be much sturdier and provide needed ground clearance for my long prop. Itís currently still in shop, and should be completed soon. I saw another GCBC with cub style landing gear the other day at Birchwood and 31" bush tires and it looked like a real nice setup. Currently modifying my battery box to switch to a dry cell battery to help compensate for the weight gain of the gear.

    Terry

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    Default I'm also interested in adding Scout gear

    Terry, can you PM me with what your going through? I would like to do the same thing for my plane. danpresley@horizonsatellite.com

  11. #11
    Member Terry's Avatar
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    Default Update

    Since Im still getting interest on getting the gear installed, basically upgraded the gear box with gussets, and I got mine drilled and straightened and fluxed at rainbow avaition. Mark at John Mark Air out of birchwood knocked it out and got the field approval done in no time(he has all the paperwork invovled). Was one of the best things I ever did, the hard part is finding good gear. [

    Terry

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    Default

    How much is all this costing you? I am having a hard time locating gear. Wagero has a left hand gear for 750 and a right hand gear for 1000. Dan

  13. #13
    Member Terry's Avatar
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    Default Gear

    1st, That is a great price on the gear, I got mine used and yellow tagged with trade in of my standard gear for about $1000(I have extra set). You need to buy the $250 kit from ACA for resupport. Added I think 8 gussests, and just cut and replaced some of the fabric. Bolts will run you another $250 and you will need new brake lines, The gear will also need to drilled for the different pattern. I think my installation cost about $2000 with me doing some of the work cleaning metal, cutting and repairing fabric, ect. Gear from ACA is 1550 per side, so if Wag aero has them, I cant see them lasting that long, because so many people have contacted me trying to locate some. Before you buy them make sure they still can get them approved. They make the airplane 500% more usefull for sure, Angle of Attact helps alot, keeps your prop of the rocks, and honestly every Citabria I've seen has had a least on side of there gear bent(seems normaly to be left side). I getting ready to go adjust the tire pressure in my new 31" ABW's and go out Kink and play(i mean practice).

    Terry

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