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Thread: Metalbestos SS Questions

  1. #1
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    Default Metalbestos SS Questions

    Hope this is an OK place to post this, got to the forum by a search that came here with a similar topic.

    I am renovating our '78 vintage log home, constructed as it has come to pass with little regard for conventions like building, electrical, fire codes. (I am liscensed electrician in the 48, and was a mechanical engineer, though I do somehting else these days.)

    Anyway time had come to investigate the chase of the lower level Vermont Castings woodburner (installed in mid-late 80's.) As par for the house there had been no fireblocking between levels, most concerningly and left by me till now directly above the suspended ceiline in the basement level where it resides where a big ole hole was hogged out of the floor and left open into the chase. In the process of doing something about this I got to looking at the pipe itself. It is original Metalbestos SS, labelled Wallace Murray Corp, which places it manufactured before the got bought in '81 I figure but perhaps sold new much later of course up here. Amazingly extensively searching the net, including but not limited to Selkirk's site, yields no where to find installation manuals for this or even for the SS2 that superceded it.

    (Which is incredible to me, I mean I've never not found at least someone SELLING a copy of a manual for anything, even for my 1952 Walker-Turner table saw.)

    Anyway my question involves the joints, the very top most of which before it leaves the roof has a stainless band clamp around the joint that clamps around the rolled edges of the joining sections. The rest of the sections (in the chase) do not have clamps. The current CF series manual (am I guessing this is the current residential product?) shows clamps at all joints.

    So question is for this old SS series pipe, should there be clamps or not, was only the roof one clamped to forestall a lift off in wind or the like at the time? If they should be can I use a current series clamp on it now, should I? Past owners records do show regular service and inspection, so I feel the chimney is probably good, I have not used the stove yet, won't use it too much, but want it right.

    Thoughts or opinions most appreciated.

    Thanks.
    John

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    Hi John
    I can walk you threw this, i was in the business for some 15yrs+ of installing stoves. PM me and i will get you on the phone to explain everything that you need to look for. T

    Sweepint
    Wasilla, (when not overseas)
    '' Livn' The Dream ''
    26' Hewescraft Cuddy, twin 115 Yam

  3. #3
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    Default Definately use the locking bands

    The old style Metalbestos that you have is the product before the UL "HT103' rating came into effect. ( "HT" meaning " high-temp )
    Prior to this, all-fuel chimneys had to pass a 1400deg. fire test to get their UL listing. During the woodstove craze of the late '70's, early 80's, it became apparant after many chimney fires ( most due to creosote build-up caused by trying to get excessively long burn times on a load of fuel-- choking the air down way too low, lowering the stack temps and producing too much creosote) that a higher temp standard was needed. The HT103 rating tests to a 2100 deg threshhold for a given period of time.

    Many manufacturers at the time simply submitted thier existing product to see if it would pass the new HT103 guidelines. Many did, some didn't, and improvements were made.
    Metalbestos SS chimney product failed the 1st test by falling apart at the chimney twist-lock connections during the 2100 deg burn. The product was sound, the connection was weak. So to pass the test MBS simply put locking bands at each connection. After passing, they were therefor required to include locking bands with each and every piece of pipe sold, since this is what they brought to UL and setup for the test.

    The MBS product is a quality product, always has been- even the old stuff.
    Their twist-lock connection has always been wobbly, and the locking bands really firm everything up.

    The new version locking bands will still work with your older SS product, and would be recommended to the very highest degree.

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    Default Thanks.

    Thanks all, I'm going to go down to valley today and try to hit a fireplace store and look for the locking bands to install as an upgrade.

    John

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    If you can't find Metalbestos clamps you can go to a plumbing supply store and buy sewer clamps. They're stainless steel bands about 6" wide with several worm clamps attached and there's a rubber liner. Remove the rubber and use the stainless part. Much stronger and more supportive than the original clamps.

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    Default Alaska Fireplace, thumbs up.

    Went to the mile 50.2 location, got 4 of the clamps for $13.50 each which is right on list without any markup (though is ridiculous for what these are.) Exactly as stated here they do "firm things up" at least a bit, certainly nothing to write home about though. Makes me feel a bit better anyway. Lady at the store was VERY helpful however, would probably go there to replace the stove if I ever get the urge simply because of the vibe I got, though no idea if their prices on real things are competitive or not.

    John

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    A safety note from my experience....

    When snow slides off a steep metal roof check your inside uppermost pipe joint. Even with my roof pipe reinforced with stand-offs and a snow cricket a slide popped my top inside joint loose, even with the Metalbestos clamp installed. In fact it destroyed the Metalbestos clamp. That's how I came upon the sewer clamp idea. Necessity is the mother of invention. After your roof slides take a moment to check your pipe!

    Merry Christmas

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    Great info here! I have a new question:

    Are the old and new Metalbestos Chimneys interlock connections compatible? I need to extend an older Metalbestos SS chimney, and am hoping I can do so using available (as in new) chimney parts & adding locking clamps to the older sections.

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    They are. Our business has been selling Selkirk Metalbestos for 30 years and have had no issues with new and old going together.

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    I'd note that scouring craigslist may well land you a lot of newer pipe on the cheap, and as has been mentioned it will join up fine. Mine happened to be 7" which was a bit of an oddball size, and harder to find (though there is some on there right now.) As it ended up, I actually sold all of mine, and the Vermont Castings stove, and replaced it with a gasburner, not because I was worried with the pipe but because the wife didn't want it as a woodburner. Anyway, even pretty new stuff (5-10 years old) floats around on craigslist all the time, so have a look if you aren't in a rush.

    For new price, I do feel that the box stores beat AK fireplace on Selkirk by a fair margin, but I have bought a lot of stuff from AK fireplace (again the mile 50 store) and they are always super helpful, first rate service, and reasonably priced.

    John

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    I have been researching the Wallace & Murray Metalbestos 8S-30 and it seems it is possibly wool insulation?

    I ask because I have cut into mine and am hoping and praying it doesn't contain asbestos.

    Any reassurance would make me and the family sleep better at night.

    Thank you.

  12. #12
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    One exposure to asbestos is not going to end your life. That old pipe is long past the time it should be replaced. Why are you cutting into it?
    Bunny Boots and Bearcats: Utility Sled Mayhem

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    I must admit I'm an idiot, I was wanting to cut the collar away that stuck below the ceiling so I could sheetrock a room that we are remodeling. I got into the pipe and then kept cutting without thinking it was anything except fiberglass until after I had a pile on the floor and dust everywhere. I now realize that it would have twisted and came down. I'm concerned about the contamination that blew around now.

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