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Thread: Coyotes at Hill top

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    Member garnede's Avatar
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    Default Coyotes at Hill top

    http://www.adn.com/news/alaska/wildl...ry/626826.html

    I saw these guys last night at the hillside cross country trails. We were finishing a nice long ski and about two hundered yards before the parking lot we ran into one of these guys sitting in the middle of the trail. I wached it for a while at about 25 yards. Then my buddy clicked his poles together and the coyote came towards us. At about 10 yards he vered into the woods and sat down just off of the trail. I moved on and around the next bend there was another one. He moved off on his own after a minute or so. I was not suprised to see them but I was very suprised that they semed to have no fear of man. They were very vocal for the 15-20 minutes I was within ear shot.
    It ain't about the # of pounds of meat we bring back, nor about how much we spent to go do it. Its about seeing what no one else sees.

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    Moderator hunt_ak's Avatar
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    Default

    Hope you don't mind that I moved this here.....felt it fit better. Maybe a few guys can try their e-callers on these buggers

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    Default Chugach state park recently closed

    The fact that they closed hunting for coyotes in Chugach State Park mgmt. area may make them a little bolder. Currently you are still able to take them with a rifle and trapping license in open areas. Sheep numbers in the Park are way down and we are protecting coyotes it blows me away. They are definitely hunting sheep, just climb up around falls creek and see how many coyote tracks you see way up there with the sheep. Even the trapping season closes Feb 28 before they really start to travel to breed and within 1/4 mile of Seward highway between mile 90 and 115. I believe these restrictions are now in place to further protect them.
    8) Trapping restrictions. (11 AAC 20.011) This new section is added to prohibit the use of traps and snares within certain areas of Chugach State Park that are open to trapping, including mile radius zones around developed facilities or trailheads and along portions of the Seward Highway, within 200 yard-wide corridors along designated trails, and within the Bird Creek Regional Park. These restrictions are necessary to provide for public safety in areas of greatest public use, by prohibiting the use of traps or snares in areas where persons with or without pets might be recreating, while still allowing for lawful trapping outside the most heavily used public use areas.

    It is insane to protect coyotes anywhere, they weren't even indigenous to south central or the interior Alaska, we brought them with the construction of the ALCAN highway. I can only say WOW on this whole thing.
    Contact ADF&G, I have but it doesn't hurt for them to here it often.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post
    .....It is insane to protect coyotes anywhere, they weren't even indigenous to south central or the interior Alaska, we brought them with the construction of the ALCAN highway. I can only say WOW on this whole thing.......
    Amen.

    With the admission of appropriate hunting/trapping restrictions within populated city limits in the interest of public safety, it should be no limit, no closed season on coyotes statewide.

    Why should it be anything else?

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    From the ADN article

    "We've got to catch them quick and teach them what they're learning about people being approachable is a bad thing," said Sinnott

    prompted the Alaska Department of Fish and Game to go after them this week with rubber slugs and cracker shells.



    What in the world are we doing. Are we an entire civilization of pansies or what. A bunch of non-native wild dogs running loose and we are shooting fireworks at them. This is a recreation area for humans, not the wilderness. Is it going to take a child getting attacked before we take action. They are just varmints, shoot to kill.

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    Member Skookumchuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akjeff View Post
    From the ADN article

    "We've got to catch them quick and teach them what they're learning about people being approachable is a bad thing," said Sinnott

    prompted the Alaska Department of Fish and Game to go after them this week with rubber slugs and cracker shells.


    What in the world are we doing. Are we an entire civilization of pansies or what. A bunch of non-native wild dogs running loose and we are shooting fireworks at them. This is a recreation area for humans, not the wilderness. Is it going to take a child getting attacked before we take action. They are just varmints, shoot to kill.
    Tell that to some of the wackos in Juneau....they take their dogs out to play with a local retarded wolf....morons!
    Nice Marmot.

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    Member garnede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunt_ak View Post
    Hope you don't mind that I moved this here.....felt it fit better. Maybe a few guys can try their e-callers on these buggers
    No problen, I might head back there tonight with my mouth call for practice, at least I should know what works if they show up.
    It ain't about the # of pounds of meat we bring back, nor about how much we spent to go do it. Its about seeing what no one else sees.

    http://wouldieatitagainfoodblog.blogspot.com/

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Excellent points guys.
    I will be contacting F&G and have already talked to some BOG members about moving toward reclassifying Coyotes as an invasive species. If we can drum up support for that and get them reclassified it will be a huge step forward in my opinion. Hopefully it can be brought to the people attention that it is their fault that the native sheep populations are being wiped out.
    This is working in the battle against invasive plant species they are certainly wiping them out as best they can and with full support of the Anti hunting league. If we can back it up with solid science and get the support of F&G then expound it by placing the blame on the population (for some reason modern Americans seem to love feeling guilty) then it shouldn't be impossible to garner widespread support. Certainly beats sitting around trying to figure out how many more years of doing nothing it is going to take before we lose these animals all together.

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    Member Matt's Avatar
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    Maybe somebody needs to get chewed on for something to happen, but even then I doubt anything will be done. Too many idiots living in Anchorage.

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    Member Phish Finder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post


    8) Trapping restrictions. (11 AAC 20.011) This new section is added to prohibit the use of traps and snares within certain areas of Chugach State Park that are open to trapping, including mile radius zones around developed facilities or trailheads and along portions of the Seward Highway, within 200 yard-wide corridors along designated trails, and within the Bird Creek Regional Park. These restrictions are necessary to provide for public safety in areas of greatest public use, by prohibiting the use of traps or snares in areas where persons with or without pets might be recreating, while still allowing for lawful trapping outside the most heavily used public use areas.

    It is insane to protect coyotes anywhere
    As I read this, it isn't about protecting coyotes. It's about keeping traps off of popular trails. One of my friends dogs was caught in a trap in Bird. This is one of the most used trails in the area. I'm all for keeping trappers off of these trails. The area isn't there just for trappers. Trappers make up a small percentage of users in this area.

    I don't have anything against trapping. I do not, however, think that highly popular trails are the spots to trap. If you are too lazy or too selfish to get off the main trails, you shouldn't be trapping in the first place IMHO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuJon View Post
    Excellent points guys.
    I will be contacting F&G and have already talked to some BOG members about moving toward reclassifying Coyotes as an invasive species. If we can drum up support for that and get them reclassified it will be a huge step forward in my opinion. Hopefully it can be brought to the people attention that it is their fault that the native sheep populations are being wiped out.
    .
    Biologist have already done years of studing . One year they claimed coyotes were a major predator of dall sheep lambs . Then two further studies proved eagles were major predators . LuJon : Whats it going to take to get solid science ?

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    Default Imho

    If you don't trap and have no experience in this activity you don't need to make posts to this particular forum. There is plenty of places for you to do that elsewhere. I have trapped in and around Bird for years and have never had any conflict with other users. Trapping can be conducted with out problems if you set gear appropriately. I believe you will find very few lazy trappers, I believe Phish is a long way from reality on what is involved in transporting bait, gear and catch through vast areas without the aid of motorized vehicles. Motorized restrictions and others have made huge acerage completely inaccessable to a trapper to access so maybe the people taking a PBJ for the day might consider getting off more of the more popular trails.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ultra mag View Post
    Biologist have already done years of studing . One year they claimed coyotes were a major predator of dall sheep lambs . Then two further studies proved eagles were major predators . LuJon : Whats it going to take to get solid science ?
    Honestly I am not worried about which predator is the most successful at taking Sheep. The studies I have read show that both Eagles and Coyotes vie for the top spot on any given sheep population each year. I think that some efforts could be mad to remove some of the nests closer to the lambing grounds to see if that has a positive effect. Ultimately though the eagles are a natural predator and the coyotes are not. I don't understand the focus on the #1 impact all the time. In the US Cardiovascular Disease is the number one killer (29%) Cancer is number 4 (12.5%). Is it not worth trying to cure cancer since it is not #1? I feel that there is enough evidence in currently to justify a focused predator management program designed to reduce coyote number in prime lambing regions where it will have the most positive impact.

  14. #14
    Member Phish Finder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post
    If you don't trap and have no experience in this activity you don't need to make posts to this particular forum.

    I believe Phish is a long way from reality...


    ...maybe the people taking a PBJ for the day might consider getting off more of the more popular trails.
    This post was in General Discussion. I can post wherever I want unless I am banned, so your attempt to persuade me to move along has failed. I am learning more about trapping every day. I'm also getting a glimpse of what makes up trappers so I'm more educated on the subject.

    I have nothing to lose if trapping is banned in the entire CSP. As a photographer, I would gain a lot more photo ops if trapping were outlawed. You have something to lose, which makes my opinion and the opinion of others like me very important and relevant on this issue.

    Frequent use is what makes a trail popular.

    The reality is that trapping is becoming less necessary in the urban areas. When traps injure dogs because they are so close to major popular trails, the popular opinion will attempt to run the trapper off. I'm not an anti but I don't think trapping in high use areas is the best face for trappers statewide.

    Since I'm so uninformed, please take the time to show me the error in my logic. As I'm undecided at this point, a logical argument would help me understand why trapping shouldn't be banned in the whole park.

    Good luck on your trap line.
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    I wish you the best of luck drumming up support . Im trying to catch them . If there;s anything else i can offer or do im here .

  16. #16

    Default Trying to remember the topic of the thread

    Oh, yeah, it was about the yotes running around Hilltop!
    So stopping trapping in the Park is going to solve that problem?
    Trapping is the only control on the coyotes in the bowl now, when someone's little Fido gets attacked by the yotes (while illegally running free of course), thinking people will clamor for more trapping. Of course, the unthinking people will continue to clamor for less trapping so their Fido's can run l;oose (illegally) in the park instead of the "Doggy Parks" in town they clamored for and got last year.
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    There is a faster way off the mountain, might hurt a little though.

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    I could only breifly read some of this thread as it made me want to puke! I wouldn't worry about those worthless yotes as a trapper, In my opinion let ADFG haze them and cater to the uneducated. Sooner or later some-one will be bit or a dog will be killed or even bred and we'll see what happens from there.

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    Default I welcome you to go

    Phish
    I would be glad to take you for a drive and some walks first to show where I used to be able to trap, second to show you how lazy I am, and third to introduce you to what is involved in trapping an animal, and turning out a good fur. This is an honest offer, but you sound very anti-trapping.

  19. #19

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    Phish if you would like to educate yourself and see the trapping world from the inside out I would seriously consider Bob's offer. I never realized how involved trapping would be until I actually set out to take up this new hobby. I thought, it would be as simple as setting up a bunch of snares and various other traps to see a road towards success. Boy was I wrong, completely wrong.

    Just imagine how difficult it is to start trapping from scratch. No traps or snares, no trapping area, nadda. Equipment needs to be gathered, an area that has no other trappers and good sign needs to be found, every aspect of the trapping process needs to be researched, and the toughest part when someone starts trapping is deciding where to hang the snares and place the traps. Then, chances are, there will be others looking to trap in the same area, people messing with the traps, with success the animal needs to be properly taken care of, etc etc etc. I've never taken up a hobby that is anywhere near as difficult as trapping. Skiing does not even compare. I can head down to the local sporting goods store, buy an entire setup and drive down to Alyeska or Hill Top to buy a lift pass. Same goes with many other outdoor activies, but that doesn't give us trappers exclusive rights to the outdoors, we can find common ground and share these more commonly used areas together.

    I have the utmost respect for the trapping community. I would bet a good wager most non-trappers have no idea how much time, dedication, and energy is consumed running a line. I would have never imagined it unless I experienced it for myself.

  20. #20
    Member Phish Finder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post
    Phish
    I would be glad to take you for a drive and some walks first to show where I used to be able to trap, second to show you how lazy I am, and third to introduce you to what is involved in trapping an animal, and turning out a good fur. This is an honest offer, but you sound very anti-trapping.
    I would enjoy taking you up on your offer. I'm not anti-trapping, I'm undecided. Seeing the process would be great.

    Simply because I personally don't go around killing stuff that I don't eat doesn't make me anti-trapping. I'll PM you my info.
    ><((((>.`..`.. ><((((>`..`.><((((>

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