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Thread: self defense ammo for alaska

  1. #1

    Default self defense ammo for alaska

    i know that the guys up there wear a lot of layed clothing for work and play out in ak weather ..i have a cal model for self defense its loaded with speer . 124.grain gold dots hollow points ..
    it get cold here in the northern panhandle part of texas with snow and ice and rains like heck somedays here ..we have our own heavy jackets for work and play in the cold ..but you guys seam wear just a little bit more cloths it seams up there i was thinking about changeing the ammo out to a hot load like corbon 90.grain hollow points or 100.grain hollow points
    for the cold weather to get though all the layers of clothing or stay with my old self defense
    and again thanks for all your help here

  2. #2


    I wouldn't go to a lighter bullet...a hollow point, even at a higher velocity, may fill with clothing material going in and not open up completely, thus becoming a solid. I'd stick with a heavier bullet for a bigger hole and better penetration through layered clothing. I think the load you're using is OK for a 9mm...115gr would be the minimum IMO.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008


    shoot a .40 180hp or a .45 230jhp and you wont have to worry. Personaly i never carry my 9mm for CCW. i just plain feel better with a bigger round.

  4. #4

    Default i did a test today

    i went out with some of my friends out and we did a test of duty and self defense ammo ..i was not likeing the way the my personal defense ammo handle the test here
    we started with a bruch of pig and cow bones mixed into meat that gone bad and some other odds and end things like modeling clay and rubber compound mix plus some other things in the mix into a mixed set of things into the ballistic gelitin jello stuff that we got a hold of ..
    we put the stuff into a one of dummies with cloths on it with starting with -t-shirt -long johns and and fannel shirt with a heavy coat ..all form the second hand cloths store
    we start with our duty pistol first pistol round
    -x-5-rounds - the first shot saw movement
    second dummy test cal self defense round fired out of a glock 17.9mm cal -x-5-rounds .it would be hard to say first round when it hit the dummy the thing did not move any like with the duty pistol round
    thrid dummy self defense round fired out of a glock -x-5.round .the first shot you saw a movement when it was hit
    four dummy test-x-45.acp self defense round fired out of a colt gov model-x-45.acp-x-5.round .first shot there was movement when hit
    we fired single shots one at a time when it came to pistol cal for we loaded one round at a time to see the inpact
    then repaired the dummy with new meat and bone mix with more rubber typle compond to fill in the holes in the dummy form the shooting
    the m.a. training dummy is the typle the moves when hit so it moved when it with the bigger pistol rounds
    the thing that i did not like the most of the 9mm cal self defense ammo was the lack of movement when hit it dummy
    we had been planing the test now for about two months now .. i realy have to rethink takeing a 9mm cal pistol into a place where heavy clothing is worn about 9.months out of the year ..when the pistol round where dug out the dummy..all had gone to full expanded sized hollow pionts round ..
    the ammo used on the pistol is as follows 230.grain hollows point -speer gold dots 124.grain hollow points winchester ranger 165 grain hollow points
    -x-45.acp-rem-goldern sabres -x-230.grain hollow points
    the 9mm cal hollow points did expanded but they where so filled with clothing it would be some idea how they would act on a real person

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Eagle River, AK


    wow, great test. similar to what this guy does:

    a bunch of different home-done ballistics tests

    other then the dummy not "moving" as much when hit with a 9 mm round, what else makes you doubt it? That the hollow point was filled with clothing? I imagine that even with the clothing there, it still can impart its tearing effect on tissues. how about corbon powerball ammo? has a ball that helps penetrate ahead of the round, so you don't have the round splaying out prematurely secondary to clothing

  6. #6

    Default how do i say this

    it moved but not the way the other bigger pistol cal rounds hit the dummy did move a little ..but not the way when the 45.acp round inpacted onto the target area..
    that has got me to thinks about do some horse tradeing down here before i leave the area ..
    my father in law on the day that i was married in 1982..i was given a takedown rifle case ..inside the case a match set of 1911.45.acp pistols
    his and hers typles that came with -x-per-pistol-x-12-mags and holster and mag pouchs and leather belts for carrying with -x-6-mtm-ammo boxs
    at the time filled with rem.230.grain hardball ammo
    my pistol was a full sized gov model with all trimming at the time and hers was a commander sized model with all the trimming at the time on both pistols
    he told me later on that was into the was into the survival movement at the time and thought i will need those later on ..
    my oldest girl has her mom pistol and my pistol sits in the case with all the extras in it maybe have to get reworked for a more up todate with new sights and some other things done to it ..maybe a s&w.model thunder ranch revolver to the other side for keeping things updated for a women that cal handle the 45.acp round...
    my oldest girl tells me that i need to go back to a bigger gun if going to move up there ..she says there things that can eat you instead of you being first on the food chain

  7. #7


    if you look on the web site he does not layer the cloths the way we did ..we layed the cloths to make it like full grown adult male would have on in winter time not summer time wear cloths do make diffence in the way a round will expand in the body the say way a hunting round does in the game ..the body is super tough and can take a lot of pounding and keep on going if need be ..
    if look at the web site pictures he has the clothsin front of the items not on the dummy like we there is a lot of diff typle of ammo being fired into the testing items
    that was the thing got me to thinking about the 45.acp round for carry for personal defense in alaska ..the 45.acp round did fine on the test dummy and reading about the goldern sabre round it seams to have a lot of one shot stops under it belt
    the last test we did was take the all the cloths off the dummy and just leave a t-shirt on the body and there was a big diffence in the way the round hitting the body .and the round expanded in the test stuff was mixed to make more like the body inside with diff bones and other things that are inside a body

  8. #8


    I carry a 9mm most of the time, loaded with quality 124 gr. JHP ammo. I favor the Federal HSTs, but I can't find them all the time, so I can settle for Golden Sabers or Gold Dots. I enjoy shooting .45, but I need more practice with it before I can consider it for carry.

  9. #9
    Member akhunter3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Eagle River

    Default Thread jack:)

    Wow....I think this thread is filled with public school graduates

    Yes, I think 9mm is a little light for up here. .40 or .45 ACP is good. 10mm is better

    Nurse by night, Alaska adventurer by day!

  10. #10

    Smile good load....

    The 124 grain load you shoot is a good one for a 9mm. Self defense shooting is kind of like stopping a big bear. They will probably require more then one.

  11. #11


    a good friend of mine say the following saying about the 9mm cal when carrying a 1911 pistol ..
    because a 9mm might expend but a 45. will never shrink
    when we where doing the test of the diff rounds ..most of the round testing that the one round that some had was the federal expanding full metal jacket ammo that one was the only one that seam not to become a oversized hardball round ...when it hit the cloths and dummy it did the job when started to expand when hiting the body and cloths
    that was a round i would likely to carry up there when i get there

  12. #12


    The 124 grain 9mm is a fine load. It will penetrate any reasonable amount of clothing, even in Alaska. I think there is a bit of urban legend going on about 9mm not penetrating heavy clothing. A FMJ 9mm will easily out penetrate a FMJ 45 so it stands to reason that a 9mm with it's hollow point plugged with clothing will penetrate more like a FMJ. Take some old clothing out to the range sometime and line it up, see for yourself.

  13. #13


    there is a speer came out a new law enforcement grade 9mm cal round .a. law enforcement grade 124.grain hollow point that has a bonded core typle bullet ..the round i was shooting a older model of the 124.grain hollow point this weekend i going to retry the test with the new 124.grain round to see what it will do..there was a shooting in a couple towns over ..when the county narcs raided a person house and had the shoot the dog was hit with a new speer gold dot and it went down like it was hit by lighting..killed it with one shot into the upper body as it was chargeing the team leader ...www.ammo to go .com.has a 500.rd half case lot for $.249.00 dollars for half a case so we will try the test again to see how the new ammo works

  14. #14


    the local law enforcement ammo dealer was there to see the second round of test of ammo ...and he too was not inpressed with some of the
    ammo that was beening used..about five year ago i was involed in a shooting with a two people that was wanted for murder. in another state .they had been pulled over on a broken taillight and was about to be let go when reach down a pulled a handgun started shooting at the me and jeff .c.the other deputie in the car that night ...the dash broad camera caught all on tape that night and it was not a petty sight after it was all over the time we where allowed to carry the winchester black talon round as the duty ammo .. shot stops ..both guys hit in the diff parts of the chest and throat area with the round ..stop the fight right there..both guys had heavy winter time jackets on at the time..what i remember of that night it was bitter cold and wet with the wind .

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    porcupine creek

    Default ????

    If you're really in the Country here a people gun is as useful as a second " Johnson " . I hate to think that there's any need to talk about people guns and 9 mm parkee penetrators , absolute nonsense and belongs 2,00o miles south of here . There are occasional crazies everywhere sooner or later like the Manley business but I'm pretty sure they would repond to a Nosler . Lets clean it up and get our heads on straight .

  16. #16


    Hey logman when was the last time you read a news paper...? People are getting shot all over the State..

  17. #17
    Member RMiller's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006


    I think it matters more how you use it than what caliber you have.

    I carry a 25 auto baby browning or non carry 45 auto or 41 mag.

    I have used the 9mm on deer here and seen the 147 grain Rem Golden Saber and Black Talons exit on double lung shots under 25 yards.
    One shot each deer.

    Also saw a buck finished off with a quartering shot that went through the last ribs and stopped in the lungs. Penetration was about 18". The pics are of this bullet.

    I like the sig line here about 95% of self defense is not being in stupid places or around stupid poeple.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    "You have given out too much reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later".

  18. #18
    Member Bear Buster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007


    For Home defense...12 Guage Pump 000 Buck shot...Slug...000 Buck shot..Slug...000 Buck shot

    Outside the home... S&W 4" 500 Magnum with 400 gr jacketed flat tips.

    "Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan

  19. #19


    come may of this year i will in alaska full time after pulling the pin ..i started this thread to see what typle of ammo that will work in a cold weather..i comeing late february..had plan to ccw when up there with my duty pistol with my badge ..went to some of the police forums and got the same answer that i got here about self defense ammo for carry up there in alaska ..we had did some cold weather testing of the ammo that we had on had to see what the round would do the with clothing on a body some of the snow suits that you guys wear doing snowmoblieing is thick as heck ..most of the guys have given me some good answers with some i think was given in fun .....but when i move up there in may it will be a long time before i go back to the lower see anyone that the case where the troopers chased him all over the back county and he shot a trooper


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