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Thread: 30-06

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    Default 30-06

    What is the big game kill range ?

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    That would depend on the critter (brownie or whitetail?), the bullet chosen, the gun, & most of all the shooter.
    USMC snipers have recorded kills with the '06 at over 1500 yds I believe.
    Some folks couldn't kill a deer at 100 yds with the same gun....
    Vance in AK.

    Matthew 6:33
    "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you."

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    There used to be a warning on Super X 22 boxes that said they had a range of something like a mile and a half. I don't know if they still put that on there or not. Anyway, the point is that the bullet will travel a lot further than you can actually hit anything with it, and probably still have enough energy to do some damage. In a real world situation, who cares how far the cartridge is capable of shooting? You have no business shooting farther than you are capable of making a clean kill.

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    Say at 600 with the right load...what can it bring down?
    BTW Thanks to ALL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cabin View Post
    Say at 600 with the right load...what can it bring down?
    BTW Thanks to ALL.
    You're missing the point. Only a handful of people have any business taking shots at anything but paper at 600 yards. Hunting isn't like going to the range. Regardless of whether the '06 is capable of delivering the necessary energy at that range or not, its not a shot 99% of hunters should take. I've been hunting with the same 30-06 rifle and load for 21 years now. I am absolutely confident about the rifle, load, and my ability to shoot it. I still wouldn't even consider a shot at that range.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by cabin View Post
    Say at 600 with the right load...what can it bring down?
    BTW Thanks to ALL.
    That is a very open question that will have a lot of subjective answers. At 600 yds out of a 30.06 your bullet will likely be traveling at less than 1800 fps which is the minimum terminal ballistic performance velocity of many bullets, meaning it will not open on impact and put a pencil hole in the animal. Will that kill it? Most likely if in the right spot. Will you be able to find the animal? Who knows, maybe and maybe not. Do you want to take the chance? With antelope in open country I would. They are easy to kill and easy to find. But I wouldn;t with other animals.

    Next question...do you have a range finder? How do you know how far the animal is at those ranges. If you can guess 600 yds plus or minus 50 yds, you are one good estimator. If you make a perfect shot with a .5 MOA rifle at that range on a calm day and mis judge the distance by 25 yds you will likely miss. The bullet drop in 25 yds at that range for an .06 is about 10 inches and at 600 yds with a really good rifle of .5 MOA your degree of accuracy is another 3 inches.

    Long range shooting and hunting can be very rewarding but requires more than the standard equipment and preparation and you will almost never see a long range hunter using a 30.06.

    Good hunting

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by walk-in View Post
    You're missing the point. Only a handful of people have any business taking shots at anything but paper at 600 yards. Hunting isn't like going to the range. Regardless of whether the '06 is capable of delivering the necessary energy at that range or not, its not a shot 99% of hunters should take. I've been hunting with the same 30-06 rifle and load for 21 years now. I am absolutely confident about the rifle, load, and my ability to shoot it. I still wouldn't even consider a shot at that range.

    Very well stated!!

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaRifleman View Post
    That is a very open question that will have a lot of subjective answers. At 600 yds out of a 30.06 your bullet will likely be traveling at less than 1800 fps which is the minimum terminal ballistic performance velocity of many bullets, meaning it will not open on impact and put a pencil hole in the animal. Will that kill it? Most likely if in the right spot. Will you be able to find the animal? Who knows, maybe and maybe not. Do you want to take the chance? With antelope in open country I would. They are easy to kill and easy to find. But I wouldn;t with other animals.

    Next question...do you have a range finder? How do you know how far the animal is at those ranges. If you can guess 600 yds plus or minus 50 yds, you are one good estimator. If you make a perfect shot with a .5 MOA rifle at that range on a calm day and mis judge the distance by 25 yds you will likely miss. The bullet drop in 25 yds at that range for an .06 is about 10 inches and at 600 yds with a really good rifle of .5 MOA your degree of accuracy is another 3 inches.

    Long range shooting and hunting can be very rewarding but requires more than the standard equipment and preparation and you will almost never see a long range hunter using a 30.06.

    Good hunting

    Read some of your posts from back in the spring, seems that there has been a change in your line of thinking. Glad to see that, Congrats!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Storm56 View Post
    Read some of your posts from back in the spring, seems that there has been a change in your line of thinking. Glad to see that, Congrats!
    You're right, I have changed my thinking a little about it, but at the same time, I think those posts back then were also mis interpreted. I was just getting interested in long range shooting then and didn't have much knowledge about it, but I always said I would never make a shot on game that I wasn't reasonably confident about. Since then, I've done a good bit of research and also got a lot of good information out of the Long Range Shooting and Hunting Forum.

    I'm just gettting my 300 WSM up to speed, and developng some loads for it now. Ballistically it *should* be capable of 800-900 yd killing shots, but whether or not the rifle as well as me are capable remains to be seen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cabin View Post
    What is the big game kill range ?
    The .30-06 with the right bullet can do "most" anything. But............question is how many shooters are "ethically" concerned with what they shoot and with what bullet at any given range?

    The 220 Partitions will I believe penetrate the biggest of animals in "close", 200 Partitions all of N.A. animals and the 180's up the velocities abit from the heavier will take Ak. Moose for example out to 200 yds cleanly. I tend to think that the lighter bullets than the 180 should stay in the realm of the "thin" skin animals of any make out to 400yds, this being 165 and 168 grn.

    I am getting out on a limb here but....this is my experience and opinion although I have never been to the Dark side of the world the 220 grn. Partitions are an optimum bullet in close if full penetration is needed, I have used them and have never retrieved one from a grizzly or a moose. The last month I have begun loading the 200 Partitions and have not shot anything with them yet but alot of bears and moose have fallen to the 180's-though this seems like the "practical" bullet I've had to shoot both animals more than once to drop them even with **** good hits.(this is where my 9,3x62 is favored)

    I have a couple of boxes of Woodleighs 240grn. PP for both my .06 and .30-338 but....never to date killed anything with them. My suspected ranges using this bullet with the impact velocities that surround the design of this bullet won't exceed 150 yds.

    I highly favor my pre-64 .06 but I will be as ethical as I know how to be, now Carlos Hatchcock made some superb shots using his pre-64 well over a 1000yds. but I suppose them were with full metal jackets-could be tailor made custom rounds from Lake City for all I know. His skills were acquired from youth and into the military spectrum where training got him to understand many variables that long range shooting requires.

    You have to ask yourself "how good are you" really? Is your gear up to the task? Hunters that are seriously concerned about "ethical" standards as a "shooter" need to be aware of there own potentials and downfalls-keep your ideas in perspective.

    Based on what I have experience on I think the aught six is quite capable of shooting far better than you can throw a rock and with greater success with the right bullet and skill.

    Can you "aim small and hit small"?

    regards,

  11. #11

    Talking 600 yards???

    Quote Originally Posted by cabin View Post
    Say at 600 with the right load...what can it bring down?
    BTW Thanks to ALL.
    Hell, at 600 yards, why not just go to the store and buy some meat?

    A bowhunter sends...

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    Member hodgeman's Avatar
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    Default 600yds!

    Given reasonable stalking/ hunting tehnique you should be able to half that distance. With practice 1/3. Bowhunters routinely get within 25 yards.

    There is no genuine need to attempt a shot that far IMHO.

    Most hunters will shoot 200 to 300 yards only with a lot of practice.

    Don't let internet braggadcio fool you- 300 yds is a darn long shot under field conditions using anything. I've often thought there was another "yard" measurement used by Internet chat rooms and professional gun writers- its only about 14 inches long...

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by hodgeman View Post
    Given reasonable stalking/ hunting tehnique you should be able to half that distance. With practice 1/3. Bowhunters routinely get within 25 yards.

    There is no genuine need to attempt a shot that far IMHO.

    Most hunters will shoot 200 to 300 yards only with a lot of practice.

    Don't let internet braggadcio fool you- 300 yds is a darn long shot under field conditions using anything. I've often thought there was another "yard" measurement used by Internet chat rooms and professional gun writers- its only about 14 inches long...
    Hodgeman, with all due respect, a 300 - 400 yd shot is routine for me and a lot of other hunters I know. Anything inside of 300 yds with a 7mm or 300 mag zeroed at 250 yds is a no brainer if you have done some practicing. The biggest challange at 400 yds is judging the distance and if you have practice at it you should be able to do it within 50 yds and at that range your bullet is dropping just over an inch per 10 yds with those cartridges. And if you know anything about mil dots and some other reticles they can be very useful range finding aids. I have plinked at prarie dogs at 300 yds with an SKS and can hit a 12 inch disk offhand at 300. Not bragging, just a fact and there are a lot of better shooters than me. It just takes some good technique and practice.

    As far as bowhunting goes, that's another sport, and we're not talking about that here. I too am a bowhunter and have stalked and called game in very close and personal and it's very cool. I called in a big 6 point bull to 15 yds and shot him with my 7mm mag. It was a thrill. I have stalked deer to within touching distance and had a herd of antelope surrounding me once with the buck standing right on top of me. But I also like the challange and thrill of making the long shot, because it takes skill also. A different kind of skill, but never the less skill.

    If you're not into the long shot, fine. But be slow to critque those who are. It's a sport just like bowhunting is a sport and believe me, I could give out a lot of critique on bowhunting. The main point as grizz106 was making is being ethical in your approach, by developing the skills and not exceeding your limitations and having respect for the game you are hunting.

    Cheers, and good hunting

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    "internet braggadcio"? what do you know of me? for a fella that has hardly any posts I would suspect something more liken to regard but............you must be abit green.

    200-300yds? done all the time! I zero in @ 2.5" high at a hundred on the norm, you on the other hand "must" be zeroing at 100yds, might want to change that to about an inch and half more. May want to consider a better scope or change from "irons" to a good scope as well. Study the ballistic charts per bullet/velocity, most reloading manuals do have in the back-the "chart".

    All this is speculative based on your past post. I could be wrong.

    MontanaRifleman, I too enjoy getting in as close as possible, have resorted to moose skin slippers or just going down to my heavy wool socks for stalking as well. It is "something" to do and achieve.

    Long range shots in my interpretation is out past 400 yds-something I would like to get into. Am considering and have lately been dwelling on long range shooting and have gone to a few webs site and have strongly considered a pushfeed-possibly a ........ In any case what ever I choose it will be built for the task of personal pleasure, doubtful for hunting though.

    regards,

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    Quote Originally Posted by cabin View Post
    What is the big game kill range ?
    I would guess this post is merely to incite debate and for that, bravo. It has and it is enjoyable. To answer you question would be simple, at any distance where you can hit the animal in the heart. My guess is, that would be much closer than you think. In any case I can assure you that it is likely at a greater distance than you can hit with consistancy from field positions.

    For an accomplished riflemen it is certainly a 300 yard gun. Some animals, though they are on the list of prey for the ought six, should never be attempted at anywhere near that distance. If you can hit prairie dogs routinely with it from improvised field positions (not a bench or shooting rest) then you can hunt heavy game at that range, giving consideration to the power and game size.

    I have known shooters who could hit 9 of 10 dogs at 300 from standing position, using the iron chicken rifle. Don't recall seeing any of them with the '06 but they could do it. I've made a lot of good shots beyond 300 yards but can say none of them were easy. Prone on the matt at known ranges is different than field shooting where range estimation is critical.

    I will say the 30-06 has rarely ever failed to deliver the killing shot when the rifleman did his part.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    I would guess this post is merely to incite debate and for that, bravo. It has and it is enjoyable.

    I will say the 30-06 has rarely ever failed to deliver the killing shot when the rifleman did his part.
    It's all good Murph, the aught six is one fine caliber ---I always have fell for a debate-bush life does that I guess.

    cheers,

    I just seen my post # is 338 mmmmmmh how quaint-have 4 33 calibers in the home now maybe it just got me thinking about a new real long ranger. A Lapua - oh well.

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    200 Partitions actually penetrate more than 220's from what I have read.

    I have never shot anything with a 30-06 and now own 3. I have used the 308 win (one of my favorites) and 300 win mag but not an 06.
    "You have given out too much reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later".

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    I really think most people have no idea how far longer ranges actually are and tend to over estimate shorter ranges. I know I do and that anything outside of 100 yrds, I'm lost (too many years of bowhunting).

    I also know that it's one of my limitations that necessitates using a rangefinder. Actually rangefinder use has improved my estimation skills, but I'm certainly not as good as others.

    Four years ago I attended a police firearms instructor class in Kenai and using the Snowshoe Shooting Range for our range work, I remember looking down range at the 400 yard targets and thinking to myself "Holy $^!t that's a long ways to take a whack at anything."

    I have my '06 zeroed 2.5" @ 100 which still allows me to hold dead on and still hit the kill zone out to 300. I've practiced at 200 and I'm pretty pleased with the results. I can also keep most of my shots on a sheet of paper at 300 with a 4x scope, but I've only shot that distance a few times and it's been in less than ideal conditions (calm days in Aleutian Hell are rare). Can I hit @ 300 under hunting conditions? Only if conditions such as lighting, presentation, vegetation and particularely wind are perfect.

    However, nothing I've ever shot has been much over 100 yrds, so taking a whack at an animal beyond 300 doesn't make sense to me except in very rare circumstances.

    I always try and find a way to close the distance before shooting.
    Now what ?

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    I would guess this post is merely to incite debate and for that, bravo. It has and it is enjoyable. To answer you question would be simple, at any distance where you can hit the animal in the heart. My guess is, that would be much closer than you think. In any case I can assure you that it is likely at a greater distance than you can hit with consistancy from field positions.

    For an accomplished riflemen it is certainly a 300 yard gun. Some animals, though they are on the list of prey for the ought six, should never be attempted at anywhere near that distance. If you can hit prairie dogs routinely with it from improvised field positions (not a bench or shooting rest) then you can hunt heavy game at that range, giving consideration to the power and game size.

    I have known shooters who could hit 9 of 10 dogs at 300 from standing position, using the iron chicken rifle. Don't recall seeing any of them with the '06 but they could do it. I've made a lot of good shots beyond 300 yards but can say none of them were easy. Prone on the matt at known ranges is different than field shooting where range estimation is critical.

    I will say the 30-06 has rarely ever failed to deliver the killing shot when the rifleman did his part.
    Sorry.Dont what to start a problem at all.

    I was just asking cause i was told my 30-06 ...which i never shot can bring down big game at 600 yrd.So i asked the board what type of big game?

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    I suppose a duiker but.....it would be hard to see but that isn't big game. Cabin don't take offense-big game should not be shot at 600yds. so....tell your buddy it is a nogo. My longest off hand shot was with my old .375 RUM and ranged at a distance of 370 yds-confirmed. That 60" plus bull hit in the lungs and dropped and got up and walked some 50 yds max and dropped. I had an open shot literally and he was on the prod for a cow and I was confident and booom! Simple as that.

    Would not have taken the shot with an aught six though. I like to get close as well but....there is a time, oh well.

    best to you.

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