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Thread: RM764 closures

  1. #1
    Member akjw7's Avatar
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    Default RM764 closures

    I guess a statement like "remainder of unit 20A" doesn't mean what I thought it did...

    I'm just frustrated because a while ago I picked up a reg booklet and saw that the RM764 (20A Antlerless hunt) was back on for this year. So I found a buddy to go with me on a nice float on the Tanana. I was really looking forward to a nice river trip and hunt with a decent chance at success. Great right?

    So this weekend (a couple weeks before opening day) I happen onto the hunting supplement in the news miner and see that F&G has subdivided the hunt further. Instead of just having zones now they have sub-zones and most of them are not going to be open at all - not even a single day. Even one of the few zones (2B) that is open has a two mile wide corridor along the tanana that is closed! (reminds me of some other corridors that frustrate me!!!)

    I figured reduced quotas and a shorter season...but to not even be open for a single day? How does that possibly fit with a regulation booklet that says there is an antlerless hunt by registration permit for the remainder of 20A?

    Unfortunately for me it seems like only people with some money (boat, wheelers, not to mention gas money) get to participate in the antlerless hunt this year. Not your fault if you have the resources to take a cow out there - enjoy it! I'm just jealous that I don't get the chance. (I know - whiner right?!) Don't get me wrong I don't want to harvest a cow at the risk of low moose numbers in the future - so if F&G says no cows I'm ok with it...but at least put the information out there ahead of time so people don't plan hunts and later have the boom dropped on them. Again an EO closing an area at a time after opening day is fine with me - but to just never be open at all after the regs say it will be - that bugs me.

    Guess that's the end of my venting!

    After all there is still bow hunting in the FMA and possibly some road hunting in other areas...but in addition to the meat I like the experience and those remaining options just aren't what I'd like to get out of a moose hunt. I'll still do it, but I'd have much rather taken a nice 3 or 4 day float on the tanana to spend some quality time enjoying a hunt. I may still do it during the open bull harvest season but the antler restrictions make the odds of success much lower than the cow hunt would have been. (oh and it's a week later, so my hunting partner can't go! Now I'm back to hunting by myself, which I have done before and will do again, but for safety's sake I'd rather have a partner.)

    Good luck this season!

  2. #2
    Member cruzer17's Avatar
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    Default

    Is there some place onliine that I can review this supplement? I can't seem to find it in any of my searches. I too have been planning a hunt there for some time. Any additional info on this would be great.
    Thanks

  3. #3
    Member akjw7's Avatar
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    not aware of the news miner booklet being online

    here is the F&G page for the antlerless hunt (RM764) - http://hunt.alaska.gov/index.cfm?fus...008&hunt=RM764

    and here is another page from F&G, this one shows the new map and the sub zones and what's open or not... http://www.wildlife.alaska.gov/gis/i...nfo.RM764zones

  4. #4

    Default closures

    Thanks for that report. I knew they where cutting the numbers back but wow they closed everything. I guess that cuts my moose hunt out for this fall.

  5. #5

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    Wow, that sucks. We've had cow moose meat in the freezer for the last couple of years from one of the areas that is now closed. None in our party got the any bull tag either, and over the last couple years we tend to only see non-legal bulls except for one unlucky fork horned bull last year. Gonna be harder to get our meat this year. I wish they would throw it back to any bull all around, there is no shortage or bulls out there, we just can't seem to find the big boys, and the majority of the small bulls have 3-4 points or a paddle on each side.

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    Default Bombshell

    This morning I went to register for the RM764 cow hunt and I too was suprised to see that there were so many closures in the zone. Worst of all, it puts the rest of my hunting plans in jeopardy! I drew the Yanert bull hunt, DM764, and the registration hunt in the same area was a selling point for my hunting partner (who did not draw) who owns the plane we were going to use to get in there. No cow hunt may mean no plane and no hunt for me. I'm sure that some of the blame is on me for bad assumptions but it would have been nice to have this information eariler. I'm kind of bummed. I was really looking forward to this hunt.

  7. #7
    Member akjw7's Avatar
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    yep sure sucks...I still haven't figured out a new hunt yet. (still pissed too!)

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    Member Matt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akjw7 View Post
    yep sure sucks...I still haven't figured out a new hunt yet. (still pissed too!)
    What do you mean? You live in Fairbanks. There is moose everywhere...

  9. #9
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    Default That does suck

    I was actually planning on two hunts one for Bull and or one for the Cow permit,but Now I see they closed everything along the river makes no sense.GUess I'll try my luck at a Bull this year.Daniel

  10. #10
    Member akjw7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post
    What do you mean? You live in Fairbanks. There is moose everywhere...
    Well, hopefully you're just pushing buttons (if so that's fine! ), but even when there are moose "everywhere" it's not always that easy. So, please let me know what you know that I don't.

    Most of the moose hunting that I know of in the nearby interior is with wheelers, jet or air boats, or wheelers hauled by boats. I can road hunt with all the other people or archery hunt the FMA (again with all the other people) but I like to be in the woods a bit.

    Like I said I'll still be hunting, but the lack of a cow hunt in zone 2 (2a now) has killed the month or so long plans I had with my hunting partner including time off, borrowed gear, etc. and it just pissed me off that the regs made it seem like there would be a hunt...and there isn't.

  11. #11
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post
    What do you mean? You live in Fairbanks. There is moose everywhere...


    ???????what does that mean?

    Anchorage and the Valley have as many Moose or more then Fairbanks and surrounding communities... has ANY ONE really taken the conservationist view as to Why?????


    1 TIGHTER HUNTING REGS AND NOT EVERY ONE CAN BLAST AWAY IN TOWN.
    2 WHEN THE LAST TIME A PACK OF WOLVES WONDERED THROUGH TOWN?
    3 BEARS????? RUN THROUGH AND GRAB A TRASH CAN, NO TIME FOR MOOSE.

    moose have taken to our suburbs to survive i see six a day here at the house i see 1 in six days out in the field.... leave out side Fairbanks and count how many you see a day.. Anchorage and the Vally have taken over the glen hwy tier II hunts the steece hwy and Taylor hwy hunts as well.

    why??? BECAUSE it looks like California down there. a house on every hill and spreading.

    as for living in Fairbanks... there is a reason we do. it is the same reason we put up with a FULL 7 months of real winter and the moose we eat is the heating fuel we put in our tank not buying BEEF.

    he is right to be upset. as i was last season when my farm became archery only... with out any one asking me how i hunt. F&G advertise these hunts and then make changes with little to no notice.

    as for that, the only notice i saw on this hunt was a hand written flier on the door at Clear sky lodge.

    NOW we all belong to this forum so that we may enjoy hunting and the company. I AM a 40 year old 40 year Alaskan... I will fight for your rights just as fast as mine. some of us are new up here, in Ak, and some of us are still adjusting to how many have showed up. one thing about us long term Alaskans; we are VERY territorial. especially when some one is stepping on another Alaskans TOES... we are all bound by the REG book. Deal with it. or go HOME...

    Vince
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  12. #12
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    Default get involved

    doesn't do any good to be upset there was a lot of press about antlerless hunt last board meetings. Go to local advisory board meetings, and help keep these hunts that biologists want open. Good luck hunting this year

  13. #13
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fshgde View Post
    doesn't do any good to be upset there was a lot of press about antlerless hunt last board meetings. Go to local advisory board meetings, and help keep these hunts that biologists want open. Good luck hunting this year
    thanks fsgde for making it simple i found a soap box and hopped on. you cant do squat about the issue if you sat on your duff at home. Period. as for where you live it IS PUBLIC land. i have to share so do you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    ???????what does that mean?

    Anchorage and the Valley have as many Moose or more then Fairbanks and surrounding communities... has ANY ONE really taken the conservationist view as to Why?????


    1 TIGHTER HUNTING REGS AND NOT EVERY ONE CAN BLAST AWAY IN TOWN.
    2 WHEN THE LAST TIME A PACK OF WOLVES WONDERED THROUGH TOWN?
    3 BEARS????? RUN THROUGH AND GRAB A TRASH CAN, NO TIME FOR MOOSE.

    moose have taken to our suburbs to survive i see six a day here at the house i see 1 in six days out in the field.... leave out side Fairbanks and count how many you see a day.. Anchorage and the Vally have taken over the glen hwy tier II hunts the steece hwy and Taylor hwy hunts as well.

    why??? BECAUSE it looks like California down there. a house on every hill and spreading.

    as for living in Fairbanks... there is a reason we do. it is the same reason we put up with a FULL 7 months of real winter and the moose we eat is the heating fuel we put in our tank not buying BEEF.

    he is right to be upset. as i was last season when my farm became archery only... with out any one asking me how i hunt. F&G advertise these hunts and then make changes with little to no notice.

    as for that, the only notice i saw on this hunt was a hand written flier on the door at Clear sky lodge.

    NOW we all belong to this forum so that we may enjoy hunting and the company. I AM a 40 year old 40 year Alaskan... I will fight for your rights just as fast as mine. some of us are new up here, in Ak, and some of us are still adjusting to how many have showed up. one thing about us long term Alaskans; we are VERY territorial. especially when some one is stepping on another Alaskans TOES... we are all bound by the REG book. Deal with it. or go HOME...

    Vince
    Iterior Alaskan
    Not to get overly involved in an interior vs. south central contest, but as a 30 year old 30 year Alaskan I can tell you that we all CHOOSE to live where we do. I live just outside of wasilla and although we aren't shrinking like much of the interior and have reasonable infrastructure, comparing an area of a few hundred thousand people to a state (california) of over 37 million is absolutely ridiculous.

    The reason so many unit 20 cow hunts have been suspended is because there aren't a sustainable number of animals left. Blame us poor, and seemingly numerous, valley folks if you want, I'll continue to put most of the blame on an excess number of non-two legged predators and misinformed management techniques.

  15. #15
    Member akjw7's Avatar
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    fshgde - I definitely agree with the get invovled comment - however if that was suggested as a reason that I shouldn't have been surprised when I learned only certain sub-zones were open I disagree. I think I should be able to read the regulations book and find out if there is a hunt in my area - it's not reasonable to say I should go to board meetings so I can know if there is a hunt or not.

    I just think the reg book shouldn't have said "remainder of 20A antlerless hunt by registration permit" since it's clearly not the remainder of 20A, but only a fraction of the GMU that is actually open.

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    Wow heated some what again. I am pretty sure everyone in Fairbanks even us 35 year old 10 year Alaskans knew this was temporary. They said the numbers were high and needed to be thinnned to prevent a crash. NUMEROUS people came out this year in protest of the hunt, period. I would agree with the any bull, I have seen numerous in-betweens and not enough legals and I have hunted the area since 2000. But we have to assume that F&G know what they are doing. Good luck to all that are heading out this year in search of fuel oil!

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by F-16Pointy View Post
    Wow heated some what again. NUMEROUS people came out this year in protest of the hunt, period. But we have to assume that F&G know what they are doing.
    Yeah those protesters were the old guys that have cabins in that area and are sick of other hunters intruding into their little piece of the world. They claim they were worried about the reduction in cows.....I call BS, they dont care about the cows, they just dont want everyday Joe's riding their wheelers and river boats into their little paradise. A bud attended the meetings and he stated it was clear as day what the agenda was, looks like they got what they wanted!

  18. #18
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaCub View Post
    Yeah those protesters were the old guys that have cabins in that area and are sick of other hunters intruding into their little piece of the world. They claim they were worried about the reduction in cows.....I call BS, they dont care about the cows, they just dont want everyday Joe's riding their wheelers and river boats into their little paradise. A bud attended the meetings and he stated it was clear as day what the agenda was, looks like they got what they wanted!

    okay cub how much time DO YOU spend out in 20 A????

    the brows this year is less then knee high still. the bears have flat taken over I found 4 dead calves last year on my property alone? the management may be mistaken and the methods it chose to put out that information for the rest of the state may read wrong or so that it is misunder stood. good ol boys my butt. i haven't seen a moose along the road to clear all summer. would i take one Legally giving the chance? you bet ! i have kids to feed. but part of me agrees it was necassary. they are over browsed. but now i dont see as many so MAYBE....... it is time to pull back into those area's that did not really get hunted.

    and if your curious i put over 1739 miles on my 4 wheeler THIS summer on the rex, rexanna, ferry road, all in 20 A... and all those other good ol boys? they spend all there time out there too.

  19. #19

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    Here is the reason(S) for the previous and now reduced /suspended cow moose hunts in 20A. This is according to my sister in-law, a area biologist in the Fairbanks office of ADFG.

    First off, the tanana flats moose population has been on the verge of major collapse, due to over population, for years. It has the highest density moose population in the entire state, with 1 or 2 exceptions.

    In the past 7 years there has been over 330,000 burned by 2 major fires.
    7 years ago a "controlled" BLM burn scroched 180,000 acres, 2 years ago 150,000 acres burned due to carelessness of a resident. In the short term, much browse was destroyed, in the long term the browse will flourish promoting a population explosion. In the interm (and prior to the fires) the AB resposible for the moose on the tanana flats is trying to head off a crash.

    The twinning rate and mortality rate of calves has been low due to stress on the cows; inadequate forage, and overall high moose population.

    The AB established the registration cow hunts in order to slow the reproduction rate in an attempt to stave off a population crash and bring the cow/bull ratio in line.

    After a few years of cow hunts, local human populations began raising concerns over the number of moose being taken, without understanding the biological reasons for such hunts. This created political pressure that was applied to the AB trying to manage the moose population. Many of the people (as I hear it) raising a stink over scientific game management that they cannot understand are the local natives in Nenana. You do the math: ADFG + Natives + Politics =

    Thats it in a nutshell. As to why this years reg. cow hunt was slashed suddenly, I haven't spoken to my sis in-law about yet. I will get back as to the "why" it happened as soon as I talk to her.

    For the time being, hope that the AB(s) can somehow manage to get his/their jobs done while attempts to stymie the science of wildlife management are constantly placed in the path of ADFG biologists.

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    give somebody a nut one year and they expect to have it every other year - I wish they never started the 20a free for all - should have just gone all draw

    I don't know why some of you folks cant just accept a closure, move one, and find somewhere else to go.....you live in an area where just about every place you go has huntable populations of moose. Get off the computer, get out that old thing call a map and start looking.

    as I have to remind my kids on occaision....this aint no gravy train

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