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Thread: 416 Ruger

  1. #1
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    Default 416 Ruger

    Rumor mill is buzzing about Ruger and Hornady reps in Zimbabwe for the past few weeks trying out the new 416 Ruger cartridge on African game, including lion.

    I suspect it to be very similar to the 416 Rem Mag in performance.

  2. #2

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    Boy, Ruger is just in the "new" now a days, huh? 300, 338, 416, not coulnting the cahoots with Hornady and Federal. I would like to try out one of there offerings, but they arent with me yet... As soon as they come out with the 7mmRCM, I'll buy.

    Maybe I should have been in the ammunition business... I mean really, in Africa "testing" the new bullet. Its a .416 with a bunch of powder behind it! Could you not just shoot an engine block to verify function of the rifle, and oh, look at there, the bullet went right through the block. Maybe... just maybe it would go through that super tough skinned, near bullet proof gazel.

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    Default 416 Ruger

    New clothes for the 416 Remington/Hoffman. The real potential is to bring up the velocities safely to 2400 fps for the 400 grain bullet. Remington has had to back off on the velocity due to pressures. The best route for the Ruger is to regain the velocity not boost it. How about going with the Jeffrey 404 caliber (.423) than 416?

    No one "needs" more than 2400 fps. Rigby's do well at that velocity... thank you. The Weatherby is faster, but recoil and blast are quite the number.

    I have my 416... you can have the 416 Ruger I didn't buy when it comes out. It should be a winner, as will be all of the wildcats spawned by the case.

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    A 416 Ruger in the Alaskan model would be sweet.

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    Default Let the Rumors Buzzzzz....

    There is absolutely nothing to test, nolthing left to prove if we speak of ballistics. As has been said, the 400 grain forty caliber bullet at 2400 fps is pure business and it is well proven. Both the the 416 Rigby and the almost up to snuff 404 Jeffery started the band wagon rolling almnost a century ago and things haven't changed much since then.

    The 416 Remington will do it but it is a case full of powder and a chamber full of pressure, the Hoffman version is the same package and it gets there but with some grunting and straining. The great 416 Taylor won't quite get to the magic mark of 400's at 2400 but gets close. It is a smaller case than the Remington/Hoffman and won't quite make the mark at standard pressures. The 375 Ruger case is almost identical to the 416 Taylor capacity, so it will be in the neighborhood ballistically, inspite of any marketing hype yet to come It comes with a smooth waist line and will do it without a belt .

    What has come into being in recent years and promptly been ignored by all manner of gun press is the 404 (yes, 423" bullet diameter, like the Jeffery) Dakota. This is a 30-06 length cartridge case based on the Jeffery, (no belt) and will hit the mark without excess pressures and is a great performer, every bit the equal of the great 416 Rigby and the 404 Jeffery, sort of a hybrid between the two in a compact, modern package. This same case necked to 416 is a truly outstandanding 416 caliber cartridge with all the pros of the the others but none of the cons. It is a newly developed cartridge with the 400 grains at 2400 fps ballistic level at lower pressures than the Remington/Hoffman/Taylor and it is my guess, a better performer than the new 416 Ruger, if the Ruger uses the 375 Ruger case. I don't expect to be dethroned.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Default 416 "Something New"

    The 425 express is the .423 in the 338 case and is a smaller pretender to the Jeffrey. Not wanting to nit-pick, but the 416 Chatsworth-Taylor is a necked down 458 Win Mag... smaller than the Ruger case. But the Taylor at 2300 fps is a nice tight round that should have made it into the big time, but Taylor died and the momentum has never been there since.

    I agree that the Jeffrey and the .423 bullet need elevation to more usage. One can get the 404 in the CZ 550, buy be sure it feeds well. Call be old-fashioned, but shooting the "old" calibers connects me to history... not marketing hype. No matter how much power and panache, it still boils down to shooting well with whatever one is holding.

    Choose the maximum package that you can handle and learn to shoot it.

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    Bob, Yeah you're right the Taylor is the 458 WM necked down but it is closer to the capacity of the 375 Ruger than the 416 Remington. Truth be known if the Taylor launches the 400 grains at 2300 fps and the Remington at 2400 fps, the Ruger case would give us about 2350 fps at equal pressure. Certainly a go getter for sure and nothing worth quibbling over among the three but any level of new marketing hype will be spilled out to indicate magical powders and field performance the likes of which never seen before.

    I have always thought the 458 Winnie should have been a 40 caliber, a 416, instead of the 45 because the capacity is just not enough for a 500 grain bullet. Then of course we have the 458 Lott which is a real 45 caliber performer and that is the case the 45 caliber should have been reserved for.

    The taylors 400 at 2300 and the 350 at 2400 is a bunch of punch and it makes a very sensible 300-350 grain caliber that can be upped to the 400 grain load when needed, which it rarely is.

    I think the 425 Express is on the 300 Win mag case and it matches the Taylor grain for grain and is the equal of the Jeffery's original loading, at greater pressure of course. There is also a 411 on that 300 Win Mag case.

    I agree with the historical connection and the Jeffery has been one of my favorites for decades. It is such a well designed case.




    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaBob View Post
    The 425 express is the .423 in the 338 case and is a smaller pretender to the Jeffrey. Not wanting to nit-pick, but the 416 Chatsworth-Taylor is a necked down 458 Win Mag... smaller than the Ruger case. But the Taylor at 2300 fps is a nice tight round that should have made it into the big time, but Taylor died and the momentum has never been there since.

    I agree that the Jeffrey and the .423 bullet need elevation to more usage. One can get the 404 in the CZ 550, buy be sure it feeds well. Call be old-fashioned, but shooting the "old" calibers connects me to history... not marketing hype. No matter how much power and panache, it still boils down to shooting well with whatever one is holding.

    Choose the maximum package that you can handle and learn to shoot it.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Quote Originally Posted by DPhillips View Post
    Rumor mill is buzzing about Ruger and Hornady reps in Zimbabwe for the past few weeks trying out the new 416 Ruger cartridge on African game, including lion.

    I suspect it to be very similar to the 416 Rem Mag in performance.
    I use a 350 grain Barnes X or 350 Speer Mag Tip with 75 grains of RL15, for plinking, in the 416 Taylor. I use a "light" loaded 400 grain at 2150 using 68 grains of RL15, pretty much the same load as the 450/400, which killed everything Africa has to offer. This case is a bit smaller than the Ruger 375. If necked up to 416, it should be a prefectly useful caliber. I liked the 98 Mauser for this application but any Ruger .30-06 or larger would do with another barrel of similar profile. I used a Hogue Overmolded stock, shades of the "new" idea Hawkeye in .375 Ruger. I got the African model as I have the Alaskan's first cousin already. I was too cheap to put iron sights on the naked barrel, so I use a Weaver 2.5K scope. One brown bear, one shot.

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    Default Old ballistics...New calibers..

    I agree about the Taylor, it is a good one and doesn't have to reach the limits to get there. I had a 21" barrelled 416 Taylor and shot the 400 grain bullet at 2200 with Rl-15 and the 350 grain Speer mag tip and Swift A frame at about 2350 with the same powder charge, all loads with 70.0 grains of RL-15.

    I no longer have that rifle but well remember it's capability in the field, it was a killer. I have a 450/400 3" gun and it's ballistics seem mild by todays standards but it is, as you say, a well proven caliber on the African continent. Forty caliber rifles make for short tracking.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Thumbs up .416 Ruger AND .416 Steyr

    Greetings to all! I have never done this kind of thing before, so here goes... I have .416 Steyr reamers that Dave Manson made for me in December 2003. Bit of an intro first though... I live in the SW, but am a staff writer for a major European shooting magazine. Just recently I have begun to write for US publications, and have contributed to several Barnes manuals. Have taken over 50 critters in Zimbabwe, hunted in Alaska (almost got eaten by a brown bear!), Canada, and Europe most recently- that is enough history, now onto the GOOD stuff! --- Very early in 2004. I had a .416 Steyr built on a .376 ProHunter. I worked extensively with the .376 back in 2000, putting over 1,200 rounds through it in 6 months. My reward? I obtained sub MOA groups with 11 different bullets. 270-gr Barnes XLCs were scary! Consistant groups in the .400s using TAC for 2,500 fps in the 20" barrel. They ALMOST go full-length in zebras, from front to rear, or rear to front... how much MORE penetration do you need than that??? --- I kept thinking how efficient the .376 was, and thought that the efficiency might correspond to how a .308 almost gets 30-06 velocities on a bunch less powder (with 150 gr or lighter bullets). I kept thinking that a 416 version might be even more efficient, so built one. --- 1,500 rounds later- and being very conservative, as my data would be published- I can tell you the .416 Steyr is extremely efficient. With 59.4 grs of a medium burning powder, I very safely get 2,153 fps with the 400-gr Hornady RNSP. 350 gr Barnes do 2,426 with my favorite load, shooting into 0.70" (all references are 3-shots at 100 yards, and from a 24" barrel). The 300 gr Barnes does 2,631 on 68 grs of a ball powder, and a softer shooting load went 2,416 on 62.5 grs of a log powder. --- I had some 350 Barnes TSXs cut back down to 250-grs... the top load does 2,950 fps on a ball powder. A great load with only 50 grs of Accurate 5744 behind this lighter bullet, still gave 2,446 fps- recoil was very light. In water jug testing, it pentrated 20% deeper than a 180 gr Nosler Partition, when loaded to the same speed. ----- The 400 Hornady would regularly shoot into under 3/4" all day long. I could shoot this rifle with full power loads from the bench, for 100 rounds, and not even go home sore. My article with almost 50 loads (I tried over 120 bullet and powder combinations) was published in Europe later in 2004. I visited Steyr and tried my best to interest them, but they were very conservative (though still somewhat interested). So much for the 416 Steyr................. Now, about the possible .416 Ruger. I have been shooting one for almost 9 months, but had to call it the .416 African-Alaskan, because I am not Ruger! (The name of my cartridge says what it is- I did not need to put my name or initials after it!). --- It is simply the .375 Ruger opened up. Water capacity is 101.7 grains. Later this year you will be able to read all about this cartridge. I have very comprehensive load data for it, testing a broad range of bullets, from 235 grains to 400. --- Over 100 bullet/powder combinations were tried, shooting over 800 rounds in total so far. I just did not work up MAX loads, but spent a fair bit of time working up medium, moderate and light loads, so just about anyone can shoot it, and have fun. --- Please do not ask about specifics, as that will come out by early fall or late summer. --- Bottom line though- 400s safely do 2,400 fps, 350s hit 2,550+, 300s are faster than 150s from the 30-06. I have loads that would be fine for deer, elk, moose, up through to brown bears, or zebras, eland, buffalo or elephant. --- It was built on a Ruger Alaskan with the original Hogue stock, 25" Lilja #7 contour SS barrel, which fills the Hogue barrel channel up fully. The original Ruger barrel contour is much too light for a 416. NEGC safari sights front and rear. --- I really cannot go into any more detail at this time. You will read all about it soon enough. --- Please realize I am going about a 100 miles and hour right now, so cannot answer a bunch of e-mails. --- I am a fellow shooter and hunter, who just wanted to share my experiences with guys of similar interests. --- Hit 'em hard with good bullets, in the right places... and they WILL GO DOWN! Best regards to all, Alasken 416

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    Thumbs up .416 Ruger AND .416 Steyr

    Greetings to all! I have never done this kind of thing before, so here goes... I have .416 Steyr reamers that Dave Manson made for me in December 2003. Bit of an intro first though... I live in the SW, but am a staff writer for a major European shooting magazine. Just recently I have begun to write for US publications, and have contributed to several Barnes manuals. Have taken over 50 critters in Zimbabwe, hunted in Alaska (almost got eaten by a brown bear!), Canada, and Europe most recently- that is enough history, now onto the GOOD stuff! --- Very early in 2004, I had a .416 Steyr built on a .376 ProHunter. I worked extensively with the .376 back in 2000, putting over 1,200 rounds through it in 6 months. My reward? I obtained sub MOA groups with 11 different bullets. 270-gr Barnes XLCs were scary! Consistant groups in the .400s using TAC for 2,500 fps in the 20" barrel. They ALMOST go full-length in zebras, from front to rear, or rear to front... how much MORE penetration do you need than that??? --- I kept thinking how efficient the .376 was, and thought that the efficiency might correspond, to how a .308 almost gets 30-06 velocities on a bunch less powder (with 150 gr or lighter bullets). I kept thinking that a 416 version might be even more efficient, so built one. --- 1,500 rounds later- and being very conservative, as my data would be published- I can tell you the .416 Steyr is extremely efficient. With 59.4 grs of a medium burning powder, I very safely get 2,153 fps with the 400-gr Hornady RNSP. 350 gr Barnes do 2,426 with my favorite load, shooting into 0.70" (all references are 3-shots at 100 yards, and from a 24" barrel). The 300 gr Barnes does 2,631 on 68 grs of a ball powder, and a softer shooting load went 2,416 on 62.5 grs of a log powder. --- I had some 350 Barnes TSXs cut back down to 250-grs... the top load does 2,950 fps on a ball powder. A great load with only 50 grs of Accurate 5744 behind this lighter bullet, still gave 2,446 fps- recoil was very light. In water jug testing, it penetrated 20% deeper than a 180 gr Nosler Partition, when loaded to the same speed. ----- The 400 Hornady would regularly shoot into under 3/4" all day long. I could shoot this rifle with full power loads from the bench, for 100 rounds, and not even go home sore. My article with almost 50 loads (I tried over 120 bullet and powder combinations) was published in Europe later in 2004. I visited Steyr and tried my best to interest them, but they were very conservative (though still somewhat interested). So much for the 416 Steyr............................................. ................ Now, about the possible .416 Ruger. I have been shooting one for almost 9 months, but had to call it the .416 African-Alaskan, because I am not Ruger! (The name of my cartridge says what it is- I did not need to put my name or initials after it!). This is a project I did all on my own, personally, with no involvement from Ruger at all. --- It is simply the .375 Ruger opened up. Water capacity is 101.7 grains. Later this year you will be able to read all about this cartridge. I have very comprehensive load data for it, testing a broad range of bullets, from 235 grains to 400. --- Over 100 bullet/powder combinations were tried, shooting over 800 rounds in total so far. --- I just did not work up MAX loads, but spent a fair bit of time working up medium, moderate and light loads, so just about anyone can shoot it, and have fun. --- Please do not ask about specifics, as that will come out by early fall or late summer. --- Bottom line though- 400s safely do 2,400 fps, 350s hit 2,550+, 300s are faster than 150s from the 30-06. I have loads that would be fine for deer, elk, moose, up through to brown bears, or zebras, eland, buffalo or elephant. --- It was built on a Ruger Alaskan with the original Hogue stock, 25" Lilja #7 contour SS barrel, which fills the Hogue barrel channel up fully. The original Ruger barrel contour is much too light for a 416. NEGC safari sights front and rear. --- I really cannot go into any more detail at this time. You will read all about it soon enough. --- Please realize I am going about a 100 miles and hour right now, so cannot answer a bunch of e-mails. --- I am a fellow shooter and hunter, who just wanted to share my experiences with guys of similar interests. --- Hit 'em hard with good bullets, in the right places... and they WILL GO DOWN! Best regards to all, Alasken 416

  12. #12

    Default Good Read

    That's a good overview of a upcoming product.
    I currently own and dhoot a 416 Taylor, built on a commercial Mauser. It gives about all the performance expected with a noticable reduction in recoil and ammo cost (if you make your own), over the Weatherby and Remington, and Rigby.
    My favorite load is a Barnes 350 grn TSX @ 2200 fps, and a 365 grn gas checked cast bullet at 2100 fps. Yep I know, those aren't maximum loads but they are accurate and deliver plenty of power.
    A-Square and Double-Tap load quality premium ammo for the 416 Taylor, I kinda wish the major arms companies would build rifles for it, a quality underated and underused caliber.
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

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    Default .416 African-Alaskan

    I just wanted to clairify that the second 416 I have built (.416 Steyr was the first), based on the 375 Ruger case, was done all on my own, with no involvement from Ruger at all. Who knows if they have done this, or if such a round will ever come to market? I am calling my version the .416 African-Alaskan, or .416 AA for short.

  14. #14

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    Alasken 416

    Welcome to the forum. Quite a post you have there. I am considering a 416 in some form, unsure of just what yet. A lot of good information there. I will keep things short, is it possible to rent a reamer from you in one of these calibers? I have not found any to date in these calibers and did not really wish to pay for a reamer for one project. I will most likely use Robert Hart to build the rifle as they are local and have always built high quality accurate rifles for me. Thanks for your time!

    Dorm

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    Hello all- I read a lot but try never to open my mouth. I spent yesterday shooting prairie dogs with my 264 win- a little overkill but the flock shooting off the mound was spectacular. So jazzed for another rifle. I have been looking for a great 416. I don’t own one yet and shudder at the costs of the classics. My question is will Ruger do it right. They shocked everyone with the compacts which I think would have been great in .25 or 6.5 caliber but in 30 seems a bit blasé” . Will they shock everyone again and come out with a 2.8 full length cartridge. That would handedly exceed the 416 rem. Should be closer to the Rigby and hopefully cheaper. Would give them a battery from 6mm all the way to at least .423? But alas they don't seem to think like me.
    My other question is why not the 416 rum. Is it only because the rebated rim? Case capacity seems good seems like it would be in the ball park of the Rigby which appears to be the bench mark.
    About home many grains does the 416 Murphy hold?

  16. #16

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    I've been trying out a 416 Taylor on a Savage action over the past couple of years and, the belt aside, it's a really nice cartridge. It seems to pack a good thump on the receiving end but with duplicate loads to some posted here by 416 Taylor it doesn't beat me up too bad even on the 8.5 lb. Savage. The drawback, of course, is the Savage action. I've been hoping that a commercial Mauser to build a Taylor will come my way, but no luck as yet. Now that the 416 Ruger is a reality it may be the answer. Seems like a natural on that cartridge and with the backing of Ruger and Hornady I'm guessing it has a more of a chance to become a mainstream cartridge than the Weatherby or Dakota. I had one in .338 WM and it shot OK but I thought it was pretty rough and had too many proprietary bells and whistles compared to a Mauser or even a M70.


    I have a couple of questions if anyone cares to answer:
    • First, I'm assuming that aside from cosmetics the Hawkeye is a M77 Mark II action?
    • Second, the Savage magnum action with stacked feed and CRF. I know they chambered it briefly for the 375 H&H and still produce short mags on it. Has anyone used these and are they any good?

  17. #17
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    The round is only as good as the bullet in front of it. I would like to see data on how well the DGX bullet is on big game. I loaded a box for my 375 H&H and wonder if it is a keeper round or a plinker round.

    Ron

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    Default Has anyone shot the new Ruger 416?

    I was wondering if anyone has shot the new Ruger 416 and what their experience was.

    I've read various posts around the web, but I would like to hear about first hand experience with the round.

    Thanks

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    I would recommend that you check the archives as someone did post a thread several months ago regarding his results from shooting his Ruger 416.

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    shphtr, Thanks I will try the archives.

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