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Thread: CCW places off-limits

  1. #1
    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Default CCW places off-limits

    The Loussac Library is posted that no guns or weapons are allowed on the premises. I am aware of all of the places off-limits and our ability to conceal and open carry in the state.

    My question pertains to the fact that this is a public library and should fall under municipal preemption signed by Governor Murkowski. Is this actually a "public" library? I realize that there are some city functions that occurr there so I am of the belief that any restrictions of the carrying of any firearms, both openly and concealed is not a violation of the law and that the posted sign, is in fact, a violation of preemption.

    Am I wrong in this line of thinking?

  2. #2
    Member akhunter3's Avatar
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    Good question.



    I would think that your right, but then again I'm no lawyer. That would certainly be a good thing to find out.


    On a side note, does anyone know if IHOP serves alcohol? I would like to OC in there but I don't know if they serve alcohol.



    Jon


    p.s. Did you ever draft that letter to the Governor?

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    Member stevelyn's Avatar
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    I've carried in there. It's not like anyone is shaking you down as you walk in the door. Concealed means concealed.
    Now what ?

  4. #4

    Default I doesn't matter if IHOP serves alcohol..they serve

    food and if you don't drink alcohol then its legal for you to carry in a place that serves food and alcohol...thats my understanding..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oneriver View Post
    food and if you don't drink alcohol then its legal for you to carry in a place that serves food and alcohol...thats my understanding..
    That may not be accurate. I thought that to be the case myself, but it appears to cover concealed handguns only in places that serve for on-premises consumption. I think I have found the only distinction between open and concealed carry in Alaska firearm statutes.

    http://www.dps.alaska.gov/statewide/...p/ACHPRegs.pdf

    (d) In a prosecution under (a)(2) of this section, it is

    (1) an affirmative defense that

    (A) [Repealed, Sec. 7 ch 62 SLA 2003].
    (B) the loaded firearm was a concealed handgun as defined in AS 18.65.790; and (C) the possession occurred at a place designated as a restaurant for the purposes of AS 04.16.049and the defendant did not consume intoxicating liquor at the place;

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    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevelyn View Post
    I've carried in there. It's not like anyone is shaking you down as you walk in the door. Concealed means concealed.
    I agree 100% that concealed means concealed. However, open carry is legal as well and I just wanted clarification on the library because they may have a policy that is in violation of municipal preemption which needs to be fixed immediately.

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    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akhunter3 View Post
    Good question.



    I would think that your right, but then again I'm no lawyer. That would certainly be a good thing to find out.


    On a side note, does anyone know if IHOP serves alcohol? I would like to OC in there but I don't know if they serve alcohol.



    Jon


    p.s. Did you ever draft that letter to the Governor?
    Actually, I have not as I totally forgot. Additionally, the local represenatives need to be conctacted. I also have some other letters I am working on as well that are topic related, etc... Thanks for the reminder.

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    Member akhunter3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flintlock View Post
    Actually, I have not as I totally forgot. Additionally, the local represenatives need to be conctacted. I also have some other letters I am working on as well that are topic related, etc... Thanks for the reminder.
    Yup, no biggie. I'd forgotten about it myself and was wondering if you'd sent yours in yet.

    I wonder how it would work if we only sent in 1-2 letters that were signed by however many people we could get? Do you think this would work better than writing multiple letters or would it be better to go the many-letter route?


    Jon

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    Quote Originally Posted by stevelyn View Post
    I've carried in there. It's not like anyone is shaking you down as you walk in the door. Concealed means concealed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Flintlock View Post
    I agree 100% that concealed means concealed. However, open carry is legal as well and I just wanted clarification on the library because they may have a policy that is in violation of municipal preemption which needs to be fixed immediately.


    Flintlocks got it right. In addition to this, those of us between 18-21 are not legally allowed to CC in town. OC only. Just another reason to find out for sure whether it is a violation of the preemption or not.

    Same thing with the carrying in IHOP, I would really like to see that law changed to allow for OC in alcohol-serving restaurants, maybe even change it a little bit so that it would be allowed so long as your outside of the bar area in the restaurant?


    Jon

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    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akhunter3 View Post
    Yup, no biggie. I'd forgotten about it myself and was wondering if you'd sent yours in yet.

    I wonder how it would work if we only sent in 1-2 letters that were signed by however many people we could get? Do you think this would work better than writing multiple letters or would it be better to go the many-letter route?


    Jon
    Actually, I think it probably works better when individual letters are sent. I will try to get some people from some other forums to participate as well..

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    Open carry in town?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildalaska View Post
    Open carry in town?

    It's the only way I can carry, being under 21. I've never had a soul say anything, in fact most folks don't even notice.


    Jon

  13. #13
    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildalaska View Post
    Open carry in town?

    Not all-the-time, but occassionally it is a simple and comfortable option and it is nice to know that the freedom is there if one so chooses to carry that way and with the law on our side. Additionally, unintentional printing is not a concern.

    There are many of us in the country and this state that believe in the whole second amendment, not just just part that says, to keep...

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    Great way to make friends for gun owners but hey, ymmv

  15. #15

    Default Open Carry

    I don't want to hijack this thread, but I'm curious on your opinions on open carry. I've been told that you need to be careful with open carry in populated areas with today's politically correct environment where to some open carry can be considered brandishment. To me there should have to be some sort of hostile or implied intent, but that is a fine line.

    Where I'm coming from with this comment, is that the proposed rule change to allow concealed carry in National Parks appears to be limited to concealed carry - not open carry. For most of the larger bear protection handguns, true concealed carry is not realistic. Its going to be interesting to see how the final rule change reads when this shakes out after the public comment period is over.

    -hiker
    "Happiness is a warm gun - bang bang, shoot shoot!"
    -Lennon/McCartney

  16. #16
    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiker View Post
    I don't want to hijack this thread, but I'm curious on your opinions on open carry. I've been told that you need to be careful with open carry in populated areas with today's politically correct environment where to some open carry can be considered brandishment. To me there should have to be some sort of hostile or implied intent, but that is a fine line.

    Where I'm coming from with this comment, is that the proposed rule change to allow concealed carry in National Parks appears to be limited to concealed carry - not open carry. For most of the larger bear protection handguns, true concealed carry is not realistic. Its going to be interesting to see how the final rule change reads when this shakes out after the public comment period is over.

    -hiker
    You are absolutely correct, the proposed rule change does appear to be geared towards concealed carry only. This may effect Alaska more so than other states because we are one of the only locations in the country where some of our National Parks allow the carriage of loaded firearms for bear protection. Open or concealed carry is not differentiated and if this proposed rule change goes through, that current ability may be restricted. Kenai Fjords National Park is an example..

    http://www.nps.gov/kefj/planyourvisit/firearms.htm

    I am not a lawyer, but as for open carry being considered brandishment, that is absolutely not the case and holds no legal water. OC is perfectly legal in this state and there is full state preemption which prevents any localities from passing any restrictions stronger than state law. It is not overly common or seen in populated areas such as in Anchorage, but there are a contingent of people that do it and generally don't run into any problems. If anything, helping to desensitize an overly hoplophobic society helps the cause in the long-run.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoplophobia

    Check out this site if you'd like to know more..
    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/

  17. #17

    Default Last summer

    I saw a guy sitting at Moose's Tooth last summer with a .44 strapped to his side. His friends were drinking but he wasn't. He got some nasty looks from some of the hippies in there.

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    Member greythorn3's Avatar
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    them hippies are funny, should open carry on on each hip with a belt with all the loops full of ammo.. hell might as well throw a shotgun on a sling on your back for shock factor too.



    Ray
    Semper Fi!

  19. #19
    Member akhunter3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiker View Post
    I don't want to hijack this thread, but I'm curious on your opinions on open carry. I've been told that you need to be careful with open carry in populated areas with today's politically correct environment where to some open carry can be considered brandishment. To me there should have to be some sort of hostile or implied intent, but that is a fine line.

    Where I'm coming from with this comment, is that the proposed rule change to allow concealed carry in National Parks appears to be limited to concealed carry - not open carry. For most of the larger bear protection handguns, true concealed carry is not realistic. Its going to be interesting to see how the final rule change reads when this shakes out after the public comment period is over.

    -hiker

    I have heard some of those stories where folks who were OCing were harrassed by the police for "brandishment." As for that being the case up here, I don't think it is in any way. I've OCed all over town and never had anyone say anything, nor have I had any real strange looks.
    Honestly most people don't even notice, and the ones that do don't seem to care. Do your research, know your laws, and go for it.
    I believe it is not only a good way to carry, but also allows for chances to educate people about firearms, the second ammendment, and a whole host of other things! Saw a guy OCing in Denny's a few weeks back, it really isn't all that uncommon.

    As for the Nat. Parks thing; I would like to see OC included in that. Like y'all have said, CC is not a realistic way to carry bear protection. Hopefully enough comments will come in to get the language changed a bit.


    Jon


    P.S. Don't know if someone already pointed this out, but check out http://www.opencarry.org

  20. #20
    Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveit View Post
    I saw a guy sitting at Moose's Tooth last summer with a .44 strapped to his side. His friends were drinking but he wasn't. He got some nasty looks from some of the hippies in there.
    Unless I am missing something, this may not have been legal...

    http://www.dps.alaska.gov/statewide/...p/ACHPRegs.pdf

    (d) In a prosecution under (a)(2) of this section, it is

    (1) an affirmative defense that

    (A) [Repealed, Sec. 7 ch 62 SLA 2003].
    (B) the loaded firearm was a concealed handgun as defined in AS 18.65.790; and (C) the possession occurred at a place designated as a restaurant for the purposes of AS 04.16.049and the defendant did not consume intoxicating liquor at the place;

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