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Thread: .470 Nitro Express Resources for reloading

  1. #1
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    Default .470 Nitro Express Resources for reloading

    Anyone have experience reloading a .470 Nitro Express? As you can imaging the majority of reloading manuals don't so much as mention this caliber. I own Speer's, Hornady's, and Barnes reloading manuals, but am looking for more powder, primer and practical advice to reload this behemoth. I have 500 gr Woodleigh FMJ, and 500 gr. Swift A-frames, with Norma Brass to feed my new Merkel. I have read online about foam wafers between bullet and powder, is this necessary? Any info or resources you could send my way would be appreciated. Thnx

  2. #2
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    Default

    Go to this forum and look in either the big bore or reloading sections.
    http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve?s=518103

  3. #3
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    Default 470 N.E. loads

    Hucksluck,

    Yes I do and I have several loads and no you don't need anything in the case but powder. They are very easy and predictable to load and lots of fun. They regulate at a certain velocity. With the Merkel I beleive it will cross 500 grain Woodleigh at 60 yards with 2050 fps. I'll check my notes tonite and give you the details. I use mostly IMR 4831. I have loaded for the 470 mostly but also the 500 (3"), 476, 450 and 450/400 both 3" and 3 1/4". I do like to shoot doubles.

    How do you like your Merkel? I've had my eye on an older Chapuis Brousse in 470 for a while. Actually trying to talk a guy into parting with it, and me parting with the cash, of course. I'll check my notes and send info later.
    Good shootin'.

    Murphy
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  4. #4
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    Default

    RL15 would be my choice of powder.

  5. #5
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    Default Loading the 470 Double

    Hucksluck,

    I got home from a shoot late last night and found my loading data but didn't get to post, I gotta sleep sometime.

    Anyway, this page of date was for a new Merkel with 26" barrels. All loads were chronographed with five shots each from each barrel. I shoot through the chronograph at a target while standng and have a rest (shooting sticks) that is padded and rest my hand on the padding and hold the forend in my hand. This way I can see as the shots come together then note the velocity of regulation. This range was 60 yards, at the owners request, so regulation was at a higher velocity than for longer range. Good loading practice still dictates carefully checking for high pressure signs as you go. The pressure limit for double guns is 40,000 psi so 60,000 indicators will not be present. Case ejection and action opening tension is important to watch.

    All loads are with Norma brass and Federal 215 Magnum rifle primers (these are 215M, the Match version of that primer). These are all with the Woodleigh 500 grain soft point. The Woodleigh solid is similar in construction and will perform accordingly. The solids will reach peak pressure sooner (steel under the copper jacket) so a maximum load will be about two grains less. Also they are under sized abut .0005" and need a tight expander. The reference for these loads is the A Square "Any Shot You Want" loading manual.

    H4831
    104 grains 2014 fps
    108 grains 2081 fps
    111 grains 2149 fps Regulation velocity
    112 grains 2157 fps Maximum load

    IMR 4831
    102 grains 2041 fps
    106 grains 2098 fps
    108 grains 2121 fps Maximum load

    RL-19
    102 grains 2020 fps
    106 grains 2090 fps
    108 grains 2151 fps Maximum load

    RL-22
    104 grains 1998 fps
    108 grains 2094 fps
    109 grains 2110 fps Maximum load

    RL-15
    86 grains 2050 fps
    88 grains 2100 fps Maximum load

    I included RL-15 in this because Allen mentioned it and it is a useful powder for the caliber. I have used it for the short barreled guns (23") but usually even those work best with the slower burners too.

    This particular Merkel was fired a total of 180 shots over a period of two weeks. It was the fourth of these late model Merkels I have shot and loaded for and they all were very easy to regulate. I like the rifles. I also had one in 9.3x74, a real dream to shoot. My own standard for regulation is 4 MOA. Both shots in 2" at 50 yards, 3" at 75 yards, etc. That is good enough for standing bigbore. I don't meet a lot of people who can do bettter than that.
    Doubles are great fun to shoot. I hope this helps. Good shootin'.

    Murphy
    Last edited by Murphy; 08-09-2006 at 09:27.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  6. #6
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    Default BROKE her in...

    Went out to the range to see what kind of groups I could get out of my new .470 Nitro Express Merkel. I was shooting off of a Caldwell led sled with two 25 pound bags of lead shot. I had loaded 8 different rounds (4 in each set) with IMR 4831, and IMR 4350 using Woodleigh 500 gr. FMJ, and 500 gr. Swift A-frame. I started with the 4350 @ 105 gr and another set @ 107 gr. with both bulletts (16 rnds total). Same scenario with the 4831 but with 110 gr and 112 gr accordingly. Norma Brass CCI 250 Primers(very limited on availability for powder and primer being in rural S.E. Alaska) My overall length was 3.85", dont know how to get a firm crimp in the canelure of the bullet as recomeded and maintain 3.94" the reloading sources read show.

    So anyhow to make a short story long, I've got a nice variety to see what she wants to eat. I get to the range and set up, get off six shots cleaning between every round, She's holding tight groups at 50 yds. (1.5 inches between the two barells, .5 inches when comparing same barell). I get back to clean and relaod and what do I see... the cheek swell on the stock has recoiled so hard as to impact the frame of the leadsled and taken a 3/8 " sliver out of the pretiest stock I've ever owned. I felt instant nausea, still do just writing this. I looked every thing over prior to shooting and could find no conceivable way that gun would be damaged in that rest. With the recoil pad compressed I had at least another 1/2" before the stock could have contacted the frame. I will try and post a few pics. I would appreciate any advice on how to best remedy this problem, as well as any suggestions on who can do a great job.

    I know I was going to get scratches and dings, just really didn't want it to be on the first day and nearly so bad..
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #7
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    Default Stand and Shoot

    Huck,

    Nice rifle you have there, sorry about the mishap.

    I don't mean to rub salt in your wounds but, I would not shoot that rifle on that rest. The rifle is not designed to be arrested so violently when recoiling. Also, the point of impact will be different when standing. That's alot of recoil to contain and the lead sled is mechanical device. The rifle must be allowed to move to absorb the recoil.

    I don't think the doubles are hard on the shoulder. The 10 plus pounds and forward weight makes it pretty easy on shooters.

    Did you chronograph these loads? Did all shots group together? I wondered about the Woodleigh solids vs the Swift A-frames, if they could be brought to the same point of impact. We usually put solids in the left barrel and softs in the right and load them to the same point of impact at range. I don't think I've ever used the A-frames in a double. A great bullet, but always used it in bolt guns. The Woodleigh Weldcore and FMJ solids will group together. Another good set of bullets for the double guns is the A-Square Dead Tough soft and their Monolithic solids. They can be made to shoot to the same POI. The same powder charge for both solids and softs rarely shoot together. I have settled on two different powders for some of them. Loads of fun, double guns.

    Sorry about the nick, I would abandon the sled. good shootin'.

    Murphy
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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