Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 27

Thread: Russian River closure

  1. #1

    Default Russian River closure

    For those that do not know it yet, by emergency order from the Forest Service and Kenai Wildlife Refuge, the Russian River fishery is closed form 11 pm to 6 am due to bear activity. To many idiots out there do not treat the bears with the respect they deserve and now because of their actions, we have more restrictions to deal with. On a good note, I saw that over 5,000 reds were counted in the Russian yesterday!!

  2. #2

    Default Does that include the confluence?

    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45
    For those that do not know it yet, by emergency order from the Forest Service and Kenai Wildlife Refuge, the Russian River fishery is closed form 11 pm to 6 am due to bear activity. To many idiots out there do not treat the bears with the respect they deserve and now because of their actions, we have more restrictions to deal with. On a good note, I saw that over 5,000 reds were counted in the Russian yesterday!!
    Does that include the confluence too? What is the area that is closed, just the Russian? What area does the confluence include? Does that mean fishing the Russian? What about just being there before 0600, is that illegal?
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  3. #3
    Member jmg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    At the end of the cul-de-sac
    Posts
    963

    Default

    AkHunter45 - while I agree with you that a lot of people at the russian are not idiots and don't treat the bears with respect, I believe they closed the fishery because the bears were too close to the trails lately, and they did this only after a bear attacked a guy in his tent last week. I might be wrong here but that is what I believe the ADN said the other day.

  4. #4
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    240

    Default

    The reason that they closed it is because brown bears and people can not coixist without problems. People on this site are always quick to blame the person involved when there is a bear conflict. I bet this recent conflict was the guy in the tents fault because his snoring sounded like a salmon in distress.

  5. #5

    Default

    Here's my take on this whole thing, we constantly read about how people are getting close to the bears so they can get pictures, then we hear about someone shooting a sow with cubs and the constant reports of people leaving coolers and backpacks laying around with food in them. I can see that some people here don't have any sympathy for the bears, well thats your right and your entitled but the bears were there first, they were enjoying the salmon runs long before we came along and they deserve, at the very minimum, space to do their thing. So tell me there are no idiots down there the next time someone decides to get close for a picture and gets his **** fool head bit off. Here's a link for the closure. http://www.fs.fed.us/r10/chugach/new...sreleaseB.html

  6. #6
    Member jmg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    At the end of the cul-de-sac
    Posts
    963

    Default

    <<I bet this recent conflict was the guy in the tents fault because his snoring sounded like a salmon in distress.>>


    Bahahahaha, that is hilarious!!! Akhunter45 - I don't think anybody has said that there are not idiots down there. Read my post from a week or so ago about the guys that stood their ground to the cub down there then just fired a shot to get rid of him. There are lots of these people down there. But I think this specific closure was a result of the attack in the tent last week, no? That's all I was saying. Want a better picture? Get a zoom lens.

  7. #7

    Default

    No, I don't believe thats why it was closed, I think they are in fear of another shooting or attack, same as last year so that is why they closed it. Don't need a picture better than that, I can see fine from here.

  8. #8

    Default People And Bears

    I believe people and bears have been fighting over fishing holes in AK for hundreds of years, probably not a new thing at all, as well as bears fighting other bears for fishing holes, and people fighting other people over fishing holes. All that has probably gone on for hundreds of years on a smaller scale. Stupidity is probably nothing new either, just more people these days...
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  9. #9
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    268

    Default The Bears were NOT there first

    Go back 25 years (which is all I can actually speak to )........very very very few bear conflict at the Russian River.........because there were no bears there (or a lot fewer than there are now at any rate......especially Brown Bears)

    the salmon run was a LOT smaller back then.......there were a lot LESS carcasses washing down the stream and of course fewer people leaving trash and food laying around

    the bears do not FISH in the lower russian river.........it's not a place which makes it easy for bears to catch fish........bears fish the UPPER Russian River (above the falls) ........ the bears on the lower Russian have been attracted there by man, his artificailly enlarged salmon run, the massive number of carcasses washing down, and the trash and food the hundreds of people leave laying about

    I'm sorry but facts are facts and you are not going to be able to have Brown/Grizzly bears co-existing with THOUSANDS of humans.......even if every human were on his/her best behavior this is a recipe for disaster

    Thinking that this can work is the same mentality that tells us that we should keep our garbage cans inside our house in the middle of Anchorage ....... what's next....... gotta store the BBQ grill in the living room?

    Mike Doogan nailed it when he said "we had a name for bears that wandered into town when I was growing up in Fairbanks.......was called them rugs"......

    The immediate permiter around the Russian River campgrounds/ferry is no different than a town in the summer.......every effort should be made to avoid attracting bears to that area.........but if they persist in frequenting the area I personally think the bears should be dealt with before we start passing idiotic laws which make it illegal to take your backpack off........

    to me there's a gigantic difference between irresponsibly having a trashy camp site or leaving food all over the river bank..........and having a cooler (although why anybody would lug a cooler in fishing is beyond me) or backpack 10 or 15 feet away while you fish........

    if a bear is willing to come down amongst a crowd of people to snatch a backpack (as I saw one of the Russian River "cubs" do last year) then that bear has lost it's fear of humans and sorry to say it..........he/she needs to be dispatched

    just like the bear who's willing to wander into the middle of town, across lawns, past houses and kids playing in the street to break into a fenced yard to rummage through garbage cans.......... or up on a back porch to tear up a BBQ grill

    that needs to be a dead bear.........the solution is not to require people to keep their garbage cans or BBQ grills (or bird feeders for that matter although I think those are idiotic too) in their living rooms.......

    back to the 11-6 closure....... it's a finger in the dike

    with all those bears around all those people eventually somebody is going to be mauled (again)......... bears can't tell time

    this (dead) sow who brought her 3 cubs to the area of the river inhabited by humans made a poor choice...... she's dead.........one of her cubs is most likely dead.......the other two are living on borrowed time

    I THINK (but I'm by no means sure) that the two remaining cubs are the subject of MOST of the bear/human confrontations

    Last year on the RR before the sow was killed I saw a LARGE male bear cruising the bank just inside the woodline.........he was pretty low key and not many people saw him.......he still had his "fear" of humans and was NOT willing to parade around like a circus bear and run down and steal stringered fish and PB&Js

    I never saw him again and my guess is he's in the upper river drainage eating fish he catches rather than peoples picnics and fish they drop or parts they discard

    OK end of my rant.........

    bottom line is IMHO either the problem bears are going to have to be dealt with or the fishery is going to have to be closed......

  10. #10
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    268

    Default The Bears were NOT there first

    Go back 25 years (which is all I can actually speak to )........very very very few bear conflict at the Russian River.........because there were no bears there (or a lot fewer than there are now at any rate......especially Brown Bears)

    the salmon run was a LOT smaller back then.......there were a lot LESS carcasses washing down the stream and of course fewer people leaving trash and food laying around

    the bears do not FISH in the lower russian river.........it's not a place which makes it easy for bears to catch fish........bears fish the UPPER Russian River (above the falls) ........ the bears on the lower Russian have been attracted there by man, his artificailly enlarged salmon run, the massive number of carcasses washing down, and the trash and food the hundreds of people leave laying about

    I'm sorry but facts are facts and you are not going to be able to have Brown/Grizzly bears co-existing with THOUSANDS of humans.......even if every human were on his/her best behavior this is a recipe for disaster

    Thinking that this can work is the same mentality that tells us that we should keep our garbage cans inside our house in the middle of Anchorage ....... what's next....... gotta store the BBQ grill in the living room?

    Mike Doogan nailed it when he said "we had a name for bears that wandered into town when I was growing up in Fairbanks.......was called them rugs"......

    The immediate permiter around the Russian River campgrounds/ferry is no different than a town in the summer.......every effort should be made to avoid attracting bears to that area.........but if they persist in frequenting the area I personally think the bears should be dealt with before we start passing idiotic laws which make it illegal to take your backpack off........

    to me there's a gigantic difference between irresponsibly having a trashy camp site or leaving food all over the river bank..........and having a cooler (although why anybody would lug a cooler in fishing is beyond me) or backpack 10 or 15 feet away while you fish........

    if a bear is willing to come down amongst a crowd of people to snatch a backpack (as I saw one of the Russian River "cubs" do last year) then that bear has lost it's fear of humans and sorry to say it..........he/she needs to be dispatched

    just like the bear who's willing to wander into the middle of town, across lawns, past houses and kids playing in the street to break into a fenced yard to rummage through garbage cans.......... or up on a back porch to tear up a BBQ grill

    that needs to be a dead bear.........the solution is not to require people to keep their garbage cans or BBQ grills (or bird feeders for that matter although I think those are idiotic too) in their living rooms.......

    back to the 11-6 closure....... it's a finger in the dike

    with all those bears around all those people eventually somebody is going to be mauled (again)......... bears can't tell time

    this (dead) sow who brought her 3 cubs to the area of the river inhabited by humans made a poor choice...... she's dead.........one of her cubs is most likely dead.......the other two are living on borrowed time

    I THINK (but I'm by no means sure) that the two remaining cubs are the subject of MOST of the bear/human confrontations

    Last year on the RR before the sow was killed I saw a LARGE male bear cruising the bank just inside the woodline.........he was pretty low key and not many people saw him.......he still had his "fear" of humans and was NOT willing to parade around like a circus bear and run down and steal stringered fish and PB&Js

    I never saw him again and my guess is he's in the upper river drainage eating fish he catches rather than peoples picnics and fish they drop or parts they discard

    OK end of my rant.........

    bottom line is IMHO either the problem bears are going to have to be dealt with or the fishery is going to have to be closed......

  11. #11
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    268

    Default The Bears were NOT there first

    Go back 25 years (which is all I can actually speak to )........very very very few bear conflict at the Russian River.........because there were no bears there (or a lot fewer than there are now at any rate......especially Brown Bears)

    the salmon run was a LOT smaller back then.......there were a lot LESS carcasses washing down the stream and of course fewer people leaving trash and food laying around

    the bears do not FISH in the lower russian river.........it's not a place which makes it easy for bears to catch fish........bears fish the UPPER Russian River (above the falls) ........ the bears on the lower Russian have been attracted there by man, his artificailly enlarged salmon run, the massive number of carcasses washing down, and the trash and food the hundreds of people leave laying about

    I'm sorry but facts are facts and you are not going to be able to have Brown/Grizzly bears co-existing with THOUSANDS of humans.......even if every human were on his/her best behavior this is a recipe for disaster

    Thinking that this can work is the same mentality that tells us that we should keep our garbage cans inside our house in the middle of Anchorage ....... what's next....... gotta store the BBQ grill in the living room?

    Mike Doogan nailed it when he said "we had a name for bears that wandered into town when I was growing up in Fairbanks.......was called them rugs"......

    The immediate permiter around the Russian River campgrounds/ferry is no different than a town in the summer.......every effort should be made to avoid attracting bears to that area.........but if they persist in frequenting the area I personally think the bears should be dealt with before we start passing idiotic laws which make it illegal to take your backpack off........

    to me there's a gigantic difference between irresponsibly having a trashy camp site or leaving food all over the river bank..........and having a cooler (although why anybody would lug a cooler in fishing is beyond me) or backpack 10 or 15 feet away while you fish........

    if a bear is willing to come down amongst a crowd of people to snatch a backpack (as I saw one of the Russian River "cubs" do last year) then that bear has lost it's fear of humans and sorry to say it..........he/she needs to be dispatched

    just like the bear who's willing to wander into the middle of town, across lawns, past houses and kids playing in the street to break into a fenced yard to rummage through garbage cans.......... or up on a back porch to tear up a BBQ grill

    that needs to be a dead bear.........the solution is not to require people to keep their garbage cans or BBQ grills (or bird feeders for that matter although I think those are idiotic too) in their living rooms.......

    back to the 11-6 closure....... it's a finger in the dike

    with all those bears around all those people eventually somebody is going to be mauled (again)......... bears can't tell time

    this (dead) sow who brought her 3 cubs to the area of the river inhabited by humans made a poor choice...... she's dead.........one of her cubs is most likely dead.......the other two are living on borrowed time

    I THINK (but I'm by no means sure) that the two remaining cubs are the subject of MOST of the bear/human confrontations

    Last year on the RR before the sow was killed I saw a LARGE male bear cruising the bank just inside the woodline.........he was pretty low key and not many people saw him.......he still had his "fear" of humans and was NOT willing to parade around like a circus bear and run down and steal stringered fish and PB&Js

    I never saw him again and my guess is he's in the upper river drainage eating fish he catches rather than peoples picnics and fish they drop or parts they discard

    OK end of my rant.........

    bottom line is IMHO either the problem bears are going to have to be dealt with or the fishery is going to have to be closed......

  12. #12

    Default

    Wow, 3 times huh?? We can definetly tell where you stand on this. Sorry but your wrong, the bears were there first, we just didn't see them. And about the closure, it worked last year so why not this year? Until it fails it seems to be a measure that works. I don't quite understand all the hatred towards the bears on the RR, do we really need to have our fish so bad that we have to kill the bears so we can "get ours"? If you want to leave your trash outside where they can find it, by all means, go right ahead and do so, but don't come crying when your get a ticket or a bear shows up and scatters it all about. A little common sense goes a long ways.

  13. #13
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    268

    Default They were invisible??

    OK maybe you're right
    Maybe they were there but they were invisible..........and left no tracks

    A) F&G has documented the increase in bear population along the lower russian river which is NOT a historical Brown Bear area during the summer........

    B) I'm not talking about leaving trash laying around for bears to scatter.......I'm talking about being able to take your backpack off while you fish (no problem for me I don't take one)............or have garbage cans in a fenced enclosure by the house in the CITY OF ANCHORAGE.........or be able to pitch a tent and sleep in it in a campground (no problem for me either I sleep in a 5th wheel these days)

    C) It didn't work last year ........ the sow is dead......one of her cubs is (probably) dead.....the other two cubs have lost all fear of humans........they were raiding coolers and stringers last year and they're doing it again this year

    The only thing this "closure" does is make sure there's no mauling on the river from 11-6.........

  14. #14

    Default

    For your info, the closure happened after the shooting.

  15. #15
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    240

    Default

    They are bears. The Russian has too many people to have non-behaving bears. Shoot the offending bears. Move on.

  16. #16

    Default I agree

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearbait 1
    They are bears. The Russian has too many people to have non-behaving bears. Shoot the offending bears. Move on.
    Lots of bears out there. Take care of the problem and move on. All the whining about the bears being there first reminds me of P.E.T.A.
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  17. #17
    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Big Lake
    Posts
    6,832

    Default

    to bad but its easier to shoot the problem bears than the problem people...
    as long as human population contiunes to encroach on animal habitat we'll have these problems, never gonna solve them all by putting us on a fishing curfew, crap will still happen. If they could dispatch/harvest/kill the problem bears without it hitting the press all over the place it wouldn't be any big deal would it?
    If you wanna stay on top of the food chain you gotta act like it.

  18. #18

    Default

    So thats who we solve these kinds of problems, just kill it and make it go away. You can say all you want about how people that don't want to see the bears killed should be compared to P.E.T.A., especially me..........I really like eating tasty animals. I find it hard to believe there aren't others that feel the same way I do, or maybe they are just to afraid to speak out about it. If we have one problem bear thats hurting peple I'm all for taking care of business but killing 7-8 bears, especially cubs thats just a little to much. Maybe we should open it up to a hunt and let the "real" hunters go in and kill those cubs, make them feel like real men.

  19. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Chugiak
    Posts
    79

    Thumbs down Is it really that hard to put trash inside?

    I agree with most of what is being said on this topic, however, AKCHEESE, your argument loses credibility with your comment "Thinking that this can work is the same mentality that tells us that we should keep our garbage cans inside our house in the middle of Anchorage ....... what's next....... gotta store the BBQ grill in the living room?".
    Such a comment infers that it is okay to attract bears to our communities with trash so that our kids and pets can be attacked. It is one thing to defend yourself because of the mistakes of other human beings, it is another to advocate the baiting of bears into the heart of Anchorage because we are too lazy to keep our trash in a safe place, i.e., inside. Its all about the assumption of risk- leave your trash out, loose a kid; fish the Russian- take the chance of being mauled. I'd gladdly choose the later over the former.

    Perhaps I took the comment out of context, in which case, no harm no foul.

  20. #20

    Default Perspective

    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45
    So thats who we solve these kinds of problems, just kill it and make it go away. You can say all you want about how people that don't want to see the bears killed should be compared to P.E.T.A., especially me..........I really like eating tasty animals. I find it hard to believe there aren't others that feel the same way I do, or maybe they are just to afraid to speak out about it. If we have one problem bear thats hurting peple I'm all for taking care of business but killing 7-8 bears, especially cubs thats just a little to much. Maybe we should open it up to a hunt and let the "real" hunters go in and kill those cubs, make them feel like real men.
    All you need here is a good comparison I say. People get all emotional about bears we see all the time, such as the circus bears at the Russian. Maybe it's because I have no emotional attachment to these bears, but objectively thinking, you look at how many bears are killed hunting each year, and how many are exterminated each year in cities, whatever, how many get hit by cars/trucks, (I don't have any numbers but we all know it's a lot), it would be a very small number, almost insignificant. We kill them regularly. These are in public view so people get so emotional about it. So quit crying like P.E.T.A. members, shoot the problem bears and move on. It's what's done everywhere else anyway.
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •