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Thread: Bear Fence. New Product?

  1. #1
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    Default Bear Fence. New Product?

    We are a small electronics company in Southern Utah with Alaska ties. We have a concept for a new product that we are seeking feedback on before we commit to a big outlay of $$$ to get it into manufacturing.

    As many already know, an electric fence around a camp site, aircraft, food cache etc. is an effective deterent to bears and perhaps wolves.

    What we are proposing and have prototyped is a small, lightweight electric fence kit that is designed specifically for outdoorsmen to backpack, carry in an aircraft or ATV then set up quickly and securely.

    The kit will feature a small fence charger unit powered by 4 AA batteries, a car-fob style remote control so the unit can be energized/deenergized from inside or outside the containment area. A positive operation indication like the double beeps from a car alarm system and an alarm system that alerts the operator that the system has been tried, that is that an animal has caused a discharge. The target battery life is one week on a single set of batteries with a warning that they are failing. Also an optional solar recharging system will be offered.

    The balance of the kit will have 500' of 1/2" wide white tape style fencing to allow three strands of fencing around a 40' x 40' enclosure with light weight fiberglass poles 48" tall and a roll of bright orange plastic flagging to alert humans and attract animals to the fence tape.

    This will all be packaged in a lightweight nylon bag similar in form and lighter than a folding camp chair.

    Our target retail price for the system is in the $299 price range.

    Feedback/comments/requests/suggestions are solicited.

    Thank you all for the help.

  2. #2
    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    Sounds good. Make the key fob and fence charger totally waterproof and it might be a good deal.

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    It is a good idea with the Keyfob part as long as you could still use it if you lost the dang thing.

    A friend of mine Keenen in Palmer, Alaska called Fence Emporium is selling something similar to that. He sells quite a few in the summer. Atleast one a week.

    No key fob but the same concept.

    Make the poles breakable for something small.

  4. #4
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    I think you need atleast 5000 volts to do the job as well. I don't remember the number but I know it's atleast 5 if you don't want them coming back.

  5. #5

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    Thats the one I used, made in Palmer. Heres their link

    http://www.electrobearguard.com/Product.html

  6. #6
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    well if you have a demo that you want to be tested send it my way, I'll put it around the hen house or green house. Any day now I expect some brown bear raiding to be happening around here.

  7. #7

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    How much does your kit weigh? Your competition seem to be close 20lbs. I would never pack something that heavy via a backpack.

  8. #8
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    The link above has a 2lb 20'x20' kit. It's $340.

  9. #9

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    It can be had for $299 at Wiggys Alaska in Anchorage from Marc T.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKDoug View Post
    The link above has a 2lb 20'x20' kit. It's $340.

    I gave up on the site when I saw that Kit 1 was 18lbs.... Should have kept scrolling down! Now if it was only cheaper......

  11. #11
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    I strongly agree with a couple of the above posts. It's gotta be waterproof and pack a very good wallup. Providing alittle more volts than the competition wouldn't hurt your sales either.

  12. #12
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    Default My thoughts...

    I have been interested in buying an electric fence for years. We float NW Alaska rivers each Fall and the gravel is not good for most fences from what I read/hear. The poly fence kit that Electrobearguard (in Alaska) sells is too heavy at nearly 30 lbs. Their lightweight "hunter" kit will not work reliably on gravel bars. UDAP sells a kit that I am thinking of buying now for our upcoming September trip on the Wulik. However, it relies on the bear contacting both wires to work on gravel bars. That takes away from the peace of mind for me personally. If your fence would be lightweight, yet still effective on gravel bars, it would certianly fill a niche in the market. Additionally, an audible alarm that would sound when the fence was tripped would be far more valuable than a beep when it was turned on and off. Nice gimmick for the kids and their sports cars, but for bear protection, I want the audible alarm when brownie is approaching my tent at 3 in the morning. Margo Supplies (Canadian company) has a siren that hooks up to electric fences but it is heavy and requires large batteries. Seems it would be impractical to use in mobile camps along a river. During a float trip, you will be moving to a new gravel bar each night. The kit needs to be built around that. Lightweight, portable, and easy to set up and take down. People that are resourceful enough to have a cabin in the woods are also resourceful (and frugal) enough to put together their own semi-permanent electric fences. If you want to sell electric fences, I would target the backpacker, hunter, and float trip crowd. We are the ones with limited options due to the previously mentioned restraints on the current models. Otherwise, the established UDAP kit for $299 would probably overshadow your product as they are very well known and offer a 4 lb fence. I would love to see a picture of your kit and the specs. Email that to me if applicable. As for what I would want to see in an electric fence...Particularly a strong charge delivered and a small physical size of the kit and definitely lightweight. Folding carbon fiber rods (thin and wind resistant) with aluminum tipped ends (male ends)that fit into a 12" poly stake (with female end) with a receptacle that holds it so you don't break the stake putting it into the gravel, lightweight poly fence that will deliver a decent shock on gravel bars, reinforcing stakes with 550 cord on all four corners, proven usage in the 0-20 degrees range, a fence height low enough to step over so no gates were needed (when the fence is off of course), and a rigid (yet lightweight) hard case to provide protection from airport gorillas. That would be a kit I would spend $300+ on today. You asked.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Default my thoughts

    I have and use two fence identical fence systems. Each person has their own needs and desires but here were the things I considered...

    I'm not going to back pack a fence system. Back packing is a minimalist sport...

    I'm only going to use a system on floats, fly-in base camp type hunts and will use it to protect my gear cache, my boat or my base camp when bear densities require it...

    I need a system to last at least 10 days unattended.
    I want POWER!!! 8-10K watts
    I want the option of a grounded system (only string hot wires) with the earth acting as a ground or a alternating pos/neg wire system (no earth ground)... It all depends on the soil...

    I found that fence "tape" catches wind and/or ices much worse than the multi strand wire.

    Packaged systems are nice but expensive. I wanted cheap... I built two complete systems that do all the above for less than $250.

    I use a Zareba B10LI. I can power it with 4-1.5 volt Dcell batteries and get several weeks worth of 5-6K volts. I can power it with 1-6volt battery and get 6-8K volts (never tested longevity) or power it with a 12 volt source and get 8-10K volts for way longer than I need.

    I've actually started using 4-3.0 volt lithium D cell batteries. They deliver full power (8-10K) for 3 weeks or longer and are lighter than all the above options - and are not effected by cold.

    My base set up wieghs about 6-8lbs. I can go much heavier if I add additional posts, grounding rods and such... If needed I can use only the controller, wire and zip ties to create a sub 3lb system (if trees are present in place of posts).

    Wiggys Alaska is carrying a system very similar to what you described... It may be the UDAP I don't recall...

    http://www.udap.com/bearshock.htm

    I do wish you luck though - because when there is competition the consumer always wins...

  14. #14
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    Default Hey danattherock

    brother there are guys way smarter on this stuff than me but to my knowledge the ONLY way an electric fence works is for there to be a proper ground...

    You can't get that in a gravel bar, permafrost/tundra or real silty glacier dust type sand. So the the only other option is to run an alternating system... Here's what I do...

    I ground the system into the earth even if it's a poor conductor
    My top wire is a hot +
    6" down a ground -
    6" down another hot +
    6" down another ground -
    6" down another hot +

    A bear stands on the ground and touches a hot wire they might get something... Maybe they are wet, maybe it's raining.. Who knows I always ground the system in the earth just in case...

    A bear touches any two and WHAPPP 8-10K volts!!!! Is it fool proof? no - but it's the best I've come up with yet...

    Sorry, I just realized I jack'd this thread... Dana if you got other questions PM me..

  15. #15
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    Default Thanks for sharing..

    Thanks for the insights. I have been discouraged to say the least about having confidence in a fence on the gravel bars. I have been in contact via email with the makers of most electric fences out there. What I have found out is this...

    The poly fence systems will work without any ground. But they are heavy. The kit from Electrobearguard (in Alaska) is 28 lbs. At 300 + lbs, I am doing good to get my wife and I with all of our gear under the weight restriction of the bush planes. That is too heavy for a fence.

    The UDAP fence is only 4 lbs, but requires the bear to touch both wires if used on gravel bars. That is not confidence inspiring, but in reality, should work if the bear is moving forward into the fence.

    I would love for someone to design a system that would work on gravel bars dependably without relying on the heavy poly fence systems.

    Sounds like you have put a great deal of thought into it. Sadly, I am not very literate when it comes to electrical talk. Unfortunately, I will be reliant on buying a kit. Wish someone would make one that is worth a crap for remote float trips.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Default hey n7hqk

    Based on the above two posts.. Here's a suggestion -

    What about working with a polywire mfgr to see if they could build a 1/2 poly tape with the upper being the hot wire (+) and the lower being the ground (-)... At the terminal end you have a connection that would plug into the controller... Never again would you have a poor ground...

  17. #17
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    Default Nice...

    I like the way you think man. I would even feel good about a 1' tall poly fence that I could mount between 24" and 36" up the post. Nothing that will eat me can fit in the bottom two feet. That would keep weight/bulk down and still deliver the same charge as other larger/heavier poly fences. There simply has to be a better way to do things than what is currently on the market.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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