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Thread: .600 NE Lite?

  1. #1
    Member .338-06's Avatar
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    Default .600 NE Lite?

    Ok, maybe this is crazy, but I know I'm not the only one to notice that the .600 Nitro Express and 20 ga are the same caliber.

    A little crazed internet searching has produced a heavy-barreled, rifled single shot 20 ga from H&R, 20 ga 2 3/4" brass shells from Magtech and a distinct lack of .62 caliber moulds, but .62 bullets weighing in at 900 gn. Yikes!

    What I'm hoping for is a 500-600 gn bullet/slug running at 1600-1800fps. Can this be done without it being more dangerous behind the muzzle than in front of it?

    I don't know strong the H&R/NEF receivers are, but my Handi Rifle can handle .30-06 pressures and 'bolt thrust' and I can have the heavy 20 ga barrel fitted to my rifle receiver for $100.

    I can get a custom mould made, but I haven't seen a 20 ga die set, though RCBS makes one in 12 ga.

    So, am I totally nuts? If I'm not, wouldn't it be cool!?

    Thanks for any comments.

  2. #2

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    My instinct is no. But that's an informed guess. Look at the ballistics of 20 gauge slugs compared to what you're proposing.

    20 gauge is a pretty common "fowler" or trade gun in the muzzleloading world. Most folks shoot patched round balls or shot, but I'd bet you will find some lead conical bullet moulds in 62 cal if you look around in that world.

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    Member IceKing02's Avatar
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    Default Sorry, you're nuts...

    Just shoot a 20g slug of about 390grains at 1800fps with preloaded Remington high-velocity sluggers...or a 12gauge that shoots a true, premade, preloaded, fully functional and fully tested 601.5grain slug of lead at 1500fps...

    If you REALLY feel the need to push big lead just make the real commitment and get an elephant gun...wussy...

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceKing02 View Post
    Just shoot a 20g slug of about 390grains at 1800fps with preloaded Remington high-velocity sluggers...or a 12gauge that shoots a true, premade, preloaded, fully functional and fully tested 601.5grain slug of lead at 1500fps...

    Where's the FUN in that? Since RCBS makes a sizing die for 12 ga brass but not 20 ga, I might just have to make the leap to a .72 caliber rifle.

    If you REALLY feel the need to push big lead just make the real commitment and get an elephant gun...wussy...
    I don't think I a wussy-just broke! Tell me, which do you think is more expensive to raise, sons or daughters? I have two daughters.

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    Member IceKing02's Avatar
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    Default Gimmee a little while as I...

    Got one of each! I'll let you know which one costs more in 2020...

    Seriously, just get a 45-70 if you want to shoot the big guns--they will ROCK you!

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    Got 2 .45-70s and 1 .458 Winnie. If you don't have bigboreitis you just can't understand.

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    You are "totally nuts", and you've gotta a totally Kool idea there.

    Go ahead on, and see where it takes you. If nothiing else you're bound to learn something from the research.

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    One ounce is 437.5 grains.

    600 N.E. bullet weighs 900 grains, 2.05 ozs, at 2050 fps.

    The 20 gauge is slug weighs 390 grains, .89ozs. (7/8 oz) at 1150 fps.

    Lets see more than twice the weight at almost twice the velocity, hmmm.
    Half the mass times velocity squared. Double the weight and double the velocity the factor will be 8 times the energy level.

    900/7000=.1285714 pounds
    m =.1285714/32.14 (g1)=.0040003 ergs
    m/2=.0040003/2 = .00200015 (half the m)
    m/2 *v*v=8,405 foot pounds of energy

    390/7000=.0557142 pounds
    m =.00557142/32.14 = .0017334 ergs
    m/2=.0017334/2 =.0008667
    m/2*v*v = 1146 ft lbs of energy.

    You be the judge.
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    Check out the Graybeard Outdoors Forums. The Section marked big bores. See the post 12 gauge from hell. Ed Hubel builds shotguns to take massive amount of pressure. He lives in the Michigan Area. Happy Surfing.

    Ron

    Here is the Link:

    http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/index.p...c,79991.0.html

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    Member IceKing02's Avatar
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    Default Oh Yeeeaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh!

    Hopefully I don't have to GO to hell to get a 12g from hell!!!!

    That's the BOMB!

  11. #11
    Member IceKing02's Avatar
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    Default Hey Murphy, not ALL 20g slugs are slow...

    Here are a couple of them that look like they meet or beat the heck out of a 45-70 Gov't!!!

    #1: Hastings Sabot Slugs, 20ga, 15/16oz, 2000fps...that's 3600ft/lbs of energy from a 20ga!!!

    #2: the "weenie load"...20ga, 3/4oz, 1800fps...that would be 2360ft/lbs of energy from a 20ga...

    Who says you need the 12ga FH...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    One ounce is 437.5 grains.

    600 N.E. bullet weighs 900 grains, 2.05 ozs, at 2050 fps.

    The 20 gauge is slug weighs 390 grains, .89ozs. (7/8 oz) at 1150 fps.

    Lets see more than twice the weight at almost twice the velocity, hmmm.
    Half the mass times velocity squared. Double the weight and double the velocity the factor will be 8 times the energy level.

    900/7000=.1285714 pounds
    m =.1285714/32.14 (g1)=.0040003 ergs
    m/2=.0040003/2 = .00200015 (half the m)
    m/2 *v*v=8,405 foot pounds of energy

    390/7000=.0557142 pounds
    m =.00557142/32.14 = .0017334 ergs
    m/2=.0017334/2 =.0008667
    m/2*v*v = 1146 ft lbs of energy.

    You be the judge.

    Yes.....well, I'm not man enough for a full on .600 NE round-especially in a 9lb gun! As I posted earlier I'm looking to come up with a CHEAP .600 LITE (More Taste, Less Filling).

    I'm figuring the test bed gun (and myself) should be able to handle a 600 or 700 grain projectile at 1800fps on the top end. Or, I might just use blackpowder! The idea is to have some fun with a big brass case with a bullet (or boolit) sticking out of it. As you well know, there really isn't a practical reason to own a .600 NE

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrassLakeRon View Post
    Check out the Graybeard Outdoors Forums. The Section marked big bores. See the post 12 gauge from hell. Ed Hubel builds shotguns to take massive amount of pressure. He lives in the Michigan Area. Happy Surfing.

    Ron

    Here is the Link:

    http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/index.p...c,79991.0.html
    Ron, I am.......awed and not a little frightened! My idea looks pityful compared to Hubel's.

    About his 28ga FH, "400 grain slugs, going 2300fps to 2800fps should be good for deer"
    Good for deer!? I can't get that (2800fps) from my .458 WinMag! Must be some mean deer in Michigan!

    Well, it looks like I'm walking a well-trod path....again. There was a great link to Rocky Mountain Cartridges, pretty solid looking cases, not balloon head like the Magtech.

    Let's see, NEF 20ga 'Ultra' barrel for my receiver-$100, .60/20ga 600grn mold-$95 and 40 cases with loader-$115. Total $310 That certainly fits my 'cheap' request.

  14. #14

    Default Uh-huh

    Quote Originally Posted by .338-06 View Post

    Let's see, NEF 20ga 'Ultra' barrel for my receiver-$100, .60/20ga 600grn mold-$95 and 40 cases with loader-$115. Total $310 That certainly fits my 'cheap' request.
    You forgot RECOIL PAD, PRICELESS !! LOL
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    Default 600 NE and 20 gauge - Indian Connection

    The 600 Nitro lineage can be traced to the Maharaji of Patiala who commissioned a 2 1/2 inch 20 bore double rifle set from Alexander Henry in 1867. It launched a 680 grain paper patched bullet at 1450 fps. Like the 450 3-1/4 inch BPE turning in to the elephant killer with cordite when Rigby worked their magic, bringing the Raj's 20 bore to 3" and using cordite brought about the 600 nitro. Yes, the 20 gauge (.62 cal) and the 600 are kissing kin. 2 1/2 inch cases are the same exact size for 20 gauge and the first 600's 2 1/2 version.

    The gun trade in those days worked hard to gain clients and what they needed in the field.

    The article I quote is in "The Double Gun" Autumn 2006 journal.

  16. #16
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    Default

    Thanks, AlaskaBob!

  17. #17
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    My 500 S&W handi rifle shoots 500 grain hornadys at 1589 FPS.

    It may go the same speed with a little heavier hardcast too.

    Just a thought.
    "You have given out too much reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later".

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    Default Another avenue?

    All of this talk of throwing big lead out the front end of big bore brings up the ultimate slug guns, the Holland & Holland Paradox and the Westley Richards Super Explora... 700 grains out the front end as a slug or also shooting decent shotshell patterns... Last two inches of the barrels had ratchet style rifling.... with the modern rifled screw-in choke being the present variation.

    I guess one could try a double 12 gauge with screw in rifled chokes and see.... would have to be lucky to get close regulation from scratch. The slugs are smaller than bore, then hit the rifled chokes where the bore decrease, snugs the slug and imparts spin. Westleys were capable of 300 yards kill.

    While cranking up a 20 gauge is not realistic, remember that the 12 gauge with a huge slow moving slug is a major force to be reckoned with. Moose and small bear (along with African Eland, Kudu, etc) will drop to a 12 bore. Momentum and penetration win the day.

    We often think that all of the technology is new.. it is just repackaged... .40 S&W is really the old 38-40. The 45 ACP is a 45 Schofield. The 375 Ruger is a wildcat of the Newton. The 30-06 and 375 H&H are... well ... timeless.

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