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Thread: New powder?

  1. #1

    Default New powder?

    Does anyone know if a powder company has released a new powder that works like the factory-load powders in the short and compact magnums yet?

    Jack.

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    And what would that powder be?

    Do you mean the powder that makes the WSM's perform equally with their larger belted mag counterpart? They don't make it.

    Do you mean the powder specially formulated so the ammo factories can reach velocities unobtainable by us common, no nothing, home ammo makers? Not gonna happen.

    Or do you mean the same old cheap Olin W760 ball powder that performs the same as it always has even when handloaded and shot through the chronograph with every caliber you stuff it in? This same magical powder that was loaded in the 300 WSM, the 300 WM and the new 375 Ruger factory loads and when pulled form the cases and run through my 30-06 it gave the same velocity as my old off the shelf W760 has for years?

    Do you mean the "special powder" that was used with "special loading technique" to give super unobtainable ballistics, from all the new calibers, that the handloader cannot achieve? Do you mean the "non-canister" powder so often written about by all the best known gun writers who shoot their free guns from from the keyboard and their mouth off from the hip?

    I know where that powder is. Right where it has always been.

    The factory loads I chronograph do not measure up to the advertising of their purveyors. It could be a special powder that defies the laws of physics was used or it could be that somebody lied!

    Since I'm not allowed to give handloading tips or load date any more for fear of someone being sued as advocated by so many here on this forum, I'm probably not going to be able to help much.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Member alaska bush man's Avatar
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    Default Reloader 17

    Hodg. has a new powder out Hybrid 100V

    Alliant has Reloader 17

    and IMR had 4007SSC that is new!

    All for the short Mag

    Murphy I will be your friend! Be Kind!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    And what would that powder be?


    Since I'm not allowed to give handloading tips or load date any more for fear of someone being sued as advocated by so many here on this forum, I'm probably not going to be able to help much.
    Murphy, I think I know where this is coming from. It must have been a public post on ones desire to have reloaded ammo for his pistol I believe it was. If I must, for example, my statement was not directed to you, more in line for those that would innocently enough to take on a venture to help a fella out. The liabilities would be towards me as well if I chose to help out and wanted to myself and I recall yrs. ago the need to have it done by someone that could point out exactly what needed to done but..............I too had to learn. Wish it would have been with one such as yourself with the many hrs. at a table and at a range to learn from, it would have saved me many a pondering moments that was not clear yet at that time.

    I believe your gesture and invite to the fella was a good one! Certainly if he was nearby, for him it would have been a grand time. For me it could have been a disaster(shrug)...Murphys laws apply

    Pistols, Learn it well, Shoot it often, Carry it always! ( a quote from a fellow reloader)

    regards,

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    Quote Originally Posted by alaska bush man View Post
    Hodg. has a new powder out Hybrid 100V

    Alliant has Reloader 17

    and IMR had 4007SSC that is new!

    All for the short Mag

    Murphy I will be your friend! Be Kind!
    Thanks, Jeff. I guess I was a little sarcastic. Those are new powders and I haven't tried a one of them. I've only seen the 4007SSC, Snyd says ti is a good one.

    And my apology to Jack, I'll try to say something useful or just keep my yap shut.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Quote Originally Posted by grizz106 View Post
    Murphy, I think I know where this is coming from. It must have been a public post on ones desire to have reloaded ammo for his pistol I believe it was. If I must, for example, my statement was not directed to you, more in line for those that would innocently enough to take on a venture to help a fella out. The liabilities would be towards me as well if I chose to help out and wanted to myself and I recall yrs. ago the need to have it done by someone that could point out exactly what needed to done but..............I too had to learn. Wish it would have been with one such as yourself with the many hrs. at a table and at a range to learn from, it would have saved me many a pondering moments that was not clear yet at that time.

    I believe your gesture and invite to the fella was a good one! Certainly if he was nearby, for him it would have been a grand time. For me it could have been a disaster(shrug)...Murphys laws apply

    Pistols, Learn it well, Shoot it often, Carry it always! ( a quote from a fellow reloader)

    regards,
    Tim, my friend. All is well. I had received a PM or two and was annoyed at the comments. It sprang form a couple of "need ammo" posts.

    It isn't like I'm making money form the ammo, it's pretty much recovery of cost of components.
    I've provided tutalage for a couple dozen forum visitors and sent load data to over a 100 from the forum. No body blew them selves up yet.

    I am annoyed when someone asks for a source for ammo or data and the thread is encoumbered with all kinds of irrelevent comments and unneeded advice so I think in the future I will delete the stupidity and move on. I have a long diatribe to post on the tomorrow.

    Thanks for putting me back on track and thanks for all you add to this site.

    Jeff Cooper is quoted with: The pistol; learn it well, carry it always. I added the 'shoot it often' in the middle. So we stole it from him but I'm sure he wouldn't mind. I like that, too.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Default

    Obviously, inviting someone over to teach them how to handload, with their own investment, and participation, should not introduce a liability.

    That's how I understood Mr. Murphy's invitation.

    Smitty of the North
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    You can't out-give God.

  8. #8

    Default New powder?

    Murphy, Grizz 106, Alaska Bush Man, thanks for your responses. Murphy, I understand your caution, anger and cynicism. You have a lot of wisdom to share and you have been threatened by bottom-feeders. What to do?
    Too many people without conciences or common sense. Too many lawyers included in this group. Me for #1, money is the god, **** the rest. You have a gift. I appreciate your comments, sarcastic as they may be at times.

    Idiots shouldn't reload, and we can't protect all the idiots. They are going to do stupid things no matter what precautions are in place, and IMHO they should be allowed to exemplify Darwin's theories. May we call it an experiment with the spin-offs benefitting the gene pool? If we need any new laws, we should have one that protects those with common sense and good intentions from any liability originating from idiots and bottom-feeders. Thanks for the help you have given to so many sincere, capable people.

    I will fiddle around (cautiously) with those new powders. I haven't blown up a gun since I was 16 (naive and inexperienced with reloading) and even then, it wasn't because of too much powder or a desire for ultra velocity, I just didn't know cases stretched and had to be trimmed. After all, when one can only afford 40 cases for the .30-06, they are going to grow.

    Thanks again guys. All I wanted was to get decent velocity and good accuracy out of the .270 WSM without pushing the limits with conventional powders. I might want to experiment with powders for a short-barreled .338 I have. I already know what doesn't work. By the way, my .270 WSM gives extraordinary velocities with factory ammo. It also far exceeds safe pressures with same, due to a target chamber and probably a very tight barrel. Tinkering and experimenting is called for to get it above .270 Win. velocities without excessive pressures. The powder information may help, but I know the charge weights will need to be kept down below any reloading book information, and I cannot extrapolate from conventional loading data.
    Jack.

  9. #9
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    Default New powders?

    Jack,
    Don't know, seems like a new powder or group of powders or new powder company shows up or comes to market every year or two!

    Hard to recommend something to try. So much of this stuff is subjective experience.

    It would take more time and equipment and money to test than most of us have..... just to give a reasonably good scientific, objective answer to some things like the all important pressure vs velocity curve for even a single run of combinations of bore, bullet, powder type and charge, case, primer, temperature, etc.

    As to the point of your question- One powder company I'd look at if trying to maximize performance in the high pressure, high velocity category would be VihtaVuori. While some of their powders seem to perform similar to their equivalents in the regular brands like Hodgdon, IMR, Alliant, etc..... a few combinations have been surprising and have given excellent results. Now, whether or not certain VV powders could give the promised and advertised MVs at acceptable pressures in some of the hyped, new mags.... I mostly doubt it but who knows? At the very least I've found VV to be a very good powder. Also, the VV 500 series is supposed to give high performance while helping to reduce bore erosion. I don't plan on burning up a couple of barrels to test the claim.

  10. #10

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    Hybrid 100V is an interesting new Hodgdon powder. I checked the Hodgdon load data for the 300 WSM and found that Hybrid 100V produced lower pressures and higher velocities with the heavier 30 Cal bullets, 168 and above. Too bad it isn't temp stable. I might give it a try anyway. Interestingly, 100V produced a lot higher pressures in 270 Win than other powders and in the 338 Win Mag it produced lower pressures and about equal velocities. Here's the Hodgdon Promo...

    HYBRID 100V This excellent new product is the result of combining the technologies of spherical powders and extruded propellants. The chemistry of a spherical powder is combined with the geometry of an extruded propellant, creating a smooth-metering, super short granule extruded shaped propellant with high energy. HYBRID 100V has a burn speed between H4350 and H4831, yielding superb performance in such popular calibers as 270 Winchester, 243 Winchester Super Short Magnum, 7mm Remington Magnum, 300 Winchester Magnum and dozens more.

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