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Thread: 460 Dangers???

  1. #1
    Member BigHinER's Avatar
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    Default 460 Dangers???

    OK. I received an email from a friend who found the story etc.... anyway it goes like this. I copied and pasted the email below; too much typing for me. I looked a little further and found more pictures of the guys "thumb" here on the AR15.com fourm http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...664580&page=17 My question is this---- Could this really have happened? I can't find anything on Snopes.com. It won't allow me to copy the pics from the email, so I will upload the example.

    ***WARNING GRAPHIC WARNING GRAPHIC WARNING GRAPHIC***

    How NOT to hold a revolver!
    A St. Louis, Missouri guy on my AR-15 forum had a bad accident with his S&W 460XVR Magnum yesterday. He was shooting with a two handed hold and got his left thumb up near the lower front of the cylinder. The normal (powerful) gasses blowing out at the barrel/cylinder gap ripped the top of his left thumb off. I've added some of his posts & some pics.

    S&W 460XVR Magnum
    460XVR blew my thumb off today!
    No joke, about 1/2 of my left thumb is gone ... what's left is a friggin mess.

    It's pretty hard to type, and I'm only posting because you never know, it might save somebody else a thumb. I was using a 2-handed grip, fired off a Cor-Bon DPX .460 and the blast came violently out the side of the gun.

    At first my thumb was so covered in blood that I couldn't see how bad it was ... and I was full of adrenaline and felt no pain. And honestly it looked really bad, my whole hand was covered in blood and it was kinda gushing.

    The blown-off thumb was on my support hand. I'll re-create the grip tomorrow to see where my thumb was, but it's not like I didn't already know not to get any body part near the cylinder gap. And even if I totally screwed up and did, taking my thumb clean off seems a bit excessive?

    Just be careful with those 460's. That case operates at such high pressure, it's just asking for trouble.

    BTW, I bought my 460 new and had exactly 12 rounds through it. Info about the gun, it's a full-size 460 with the 8 3/4' barrel and factory installed compensator. It's one of the Whitetails Unlimited models. Ammo was 200gr Cor-Bon DPX.

    The gun only had 12 or 13 rounds of the Cor-Bon through it, and 10 .45 Long Colt rounds through it. So it was essentially still brand new.

    Saw a hand specialist while there today. Lots of ways to try and save what's left, but first I just have to hope it doesn't get infected in the next few days ... then surgery early next week.
    The hand specialist I spent a few hours with last night said that in gunshot wounds there is always a lot more damage than is first visible ... same with things like fireworks going off in your hand. A lot more flesh around the wound is dead, and will rot and fall off over the next couple days. That's why it's so important to keep clean, and that's also why they can't do surgery now. If they wrapped new skin over dead skin it would just puss out, possibly turn gang-green, and they'd have to start all over again.
    This is an example of how he was holding his revolver.
    Wrong, wrong, wrong!


    Last edited by BigHinER; 02-20-2008 at 21:52. Reason: ADDED GRAPHIC WARNING
    Originally Posted by BIGBOB
    Estimate of time of death appears to be same day he died.

  2. #2
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    Thumbs down

    This is the same danger that exists with any very high pressure round, if you put your thumb in line with the cylinder gap. It takes a bout 50,000 psi to do this kind of damage. The 454 Casull, the 500 S&W and the 460 S&W all exceed this pressure level normally. The 480 Ruger is another high pressure round though not as high as the others I think the limit for it is about 48,000 psi. Now the 44, 41, 357 mags will ignite your flesh also but will not have the severing effect of the higher pressures.

    I have seen people shoot magnum revolvers by resting the frame forward of the trigger guard on their support forearm. This will set a Levi's jacket on fire, I mean flaming. It will leave a permanent brand on the skin with a deep burn through the skin and it will melt a nylon jacket and blend it into the skin of your left arm........and apparently it will sever the end of your left thumb.

    I really don't see how we could get our thumb that far forward but I guess some folks have longer thumbs......well, they used to. That really looks like a grip from the movies anyway.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    Everyone who purchases a revolver should be required to shoot it in the dark. hehe. It becomes VERY obvious where you dont want to put a body part.

  4. #4
    Member BigHinER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    .... some folks have longer thumbs......well, they used to.
    I hate to say it....LOL
    Originally Posted by BIGBOB
    Estimate of time of death appears to be same day he died.

  5. #5
    Member Bear Buster's Avatar
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    Default I got the same thing today, plus thumb pic

    Subject: FW: How NOT to hold a revolver!
    Thought you might find this interesting

    How NOT to hold a revolver!
    A St. Louis, Missouri guy on my AR-15 forum had a bad accident with his S&W 460XVR Magnum yesterday. He was shooting with a two handed hold and got his left thumb up near the lower front of the cylinder. The normal (powerful) gasses blowing out at the barrel/cylinder gap ripped the top of his left thumb off. I've added some of his posts & some pics.



    S&W 460XVR Magnum
    460XVR blew my thumb off today!
    No joke, about 1/2 of my left thumb is gone ... what's left is a friggin mess.

    It's pretty hard to type, and I'm only posting because you never know, it might save somebody else a thumb. I was using a 2-handed grip, fired off a Cor-Bon DPX .460 and the blast came violently out the side of the gun.
    At first my thumb was so covered in blood that I couldn't see how bad it was ... and I was full of adrenaline and felt no pain. And honestly it looked really bad, my whole hand was covered in blood and it was kinda gushing.

    The blown-off thumb was on my support hand. I'll re-create the grip tomorrow to see where my thumb was, but it's not like I didn't already know not to get any body part near the cylinder gap. And even if I totally screwed up and did, taking my thumb clean off seems a bit excessive?
    Just be careful with those 460's. That case operates at such high pressure, it's just asking for trouble.

    BTW, I bought my 460 new and had exactly 12 rounds through it. Info about the gun, it's a full-size 460 with the 8 3/4' barrel and factory installed compensator. It's one of the Whitetails Unlimited models. Ammo was 200gr Cor-Bon DPX.

    The gun only had 12 or 13 rounds of the Cor-Bon through it, and 10 ..45 Long Colt rounds through it. So it was essentially still brand new.
    Saw a hand specialist while there today. Lots of ways to try and save what's left, but first I just have to hope it doesn't get infected in the next few days ... then surgery early next week.
    The hand specialist I spent a few hours with last night said that in gunshot wounds there is always a lot more damage than is first visible ... same with things like fireworks going off in your hand. A lot more flesh around the wound is dead, and will rot and fall off over the next couple days. That's why it's so important to keep clean, and that's also why they can't do surgery now. If they wrapped new skin over dead skin it would just puss out, possibly turn gang-green, and they'd have to start all over again.
    This is an example of how he was holding his revolver. Wrong, wrong, wrong!

    This is what's left of his thumb.












  6. #6
    Member ADUKHNT's Avatar
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    I know the first day I shot my 460 I was shooting off of a rest and sand bag, I was setting the frame not the bbl onthe bag, after two rounds the bag was blown open. This round is crazy pressure and if before mentioned in other 460 threads if the guy shot the 460 after the 45 Colt without cleaning the pressures were surley increased. I don't know if the story is true but it seems possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ADUKHNT View Post
    This round is crazy pressure and if before mentioned in other 460 threads if the guy shot the 460 after the 45 Colt without cleaning the pressures were surley increased. I don't know if the story is true but it seems possible.
    How could that be? What does a 45 Colt round do to the 460 to increase pressure?


    I think not. If the 45 colt left a huge build up of crud in the cylinder it could encroach on the "space" in the cylinder for the 460 round, but you couldn't chamber the 460 if that were the case, and that isn't likely the case. This thing operates at pressures never before experienced in a revolver. The 454 has a higher SAAMI pressure limit but ammo isn't loaded (factory) to that limit because you can't keep the bullets in the cases even with a serious crimp. With the very effective muzzle brakes on the S&W 460 and 500's they can use the max'ed out ammo and any limp wrist can shoot them.

    Now I don't mean to say that all you S&W 500 and 460 shooters are limp wristed, but when I see you shoot the gun with full power loads and without the muzzle brake, I'll know you are not! Anyone want to make a video?

    I think this unfortunate gentleman's experience is similar to a well healed Doctor driving a V-tail Bonanza and he breaks the tail off. We would say: The good doctor could afford more airplane than he could fly. This may be one of those situations. I would say this individual has zero experience with a revolver (or any handgun) and knows absolutely nothing about the workings of them.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  8. #8

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    Yeah, my reaction to the account was that the guy's a real d--b s--t, you fill in the blanks. That's even more basic than Revolver 101 stuff. Call it basic common sense. Sorry for his pain and loss of flesh, but he had no business picking up that revolver, much less a load of 22 shorts, if he didn't know any better.

  9. #9

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    Some people have longer DNA strands than others. Blame the gun,yea right. He was obviously holding his support hand thumb up by the front of the cylinder. Maybe he should have learned to properly hold a revolver before picking one up. Tough lesson learned.

  10. #10

    Default yup

    Quote Originally Posted by akspecialus View Post
    Some people have longer DNA strands than others. Blame the gun,yea right. He was obviously holding his support hand thumb up by the front of the cylinder. Maybe he should have learned to properly hold a revolver before picking one up. Tough lesson learned.
    And I bet the lawyers are already circling. Odds are, the price of S&W will jump again, all because of a fool. He probably wasn't related to the woman who dumped hot McDonalds coffee in her lap, but for the sake of the gene pool it would have been better if he'd been shooting rested prone with the revolver clasped between his legs.

  11. #11

    Default Tool

    A revolver is no different than a Skil Saw, use it improperly and it'll cut your fingers off too. Some people just don't understand the laws of physics.
    IT'S A TOOL, use it properly !
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

    On the road of life..... Pot holes keep things interesting !

  12. #12
    Member AKGUPPY's Avatar
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    The "possible" reason for higher chamber pressures after shooting 45LC lead bullets is barrel fouling. If you follow-up with a jacketed 460 round, that's probably going to provide lots of back-pressure which escapes through the barrel/cylinder gap. This in effect is a cutting torch.

  13. #13
    Member tyrex13's Avatar
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    There was a follow up video to that thread on ar15.com where a guy cut multiple hotdogs in half with the blast from the barrel gap on one of his revolvers. Good stuff.

  14. #14
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    Default poor grip

    Much like holding to high on a semi auto this is what fire arms instructors call a "self correcting" error.

  15. #15

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    When common sense isn't available then learning the hard way usually does the trick!

    Brown Bears fill in the blanks comment pretty much hits the nail on the head. Evidently this guy is new to the revolver world. Oh well he knows now!

    I'm not intending to steal the thread here but I got a similar funny story to tell

    We had a local guy that decided to join our coyote hunting group this year. Our group has been hunting together for years and we are well established. Meaning that this fella wasn't invited he just kinda showed up.

    Our method of hunting involves circling a section of land and then a couple of vehicles will drive into the section and jump the critters and get the fun started. Many times the coyotes need a little encouragement to get moving. The standard method for doing this is simply sticking your gun out the window and touching off a round (in a safe direction). Most of us carry handguns for this purpose. Well the new guy who is into the latest and greatest got himself a 460 for this purpose. On one particular day he drove back into a large patch of grass but nothing jumped so one of the fellas got on the radio and told him to make some noise (shoot his gun) into the big ditch in the middle of the grass patch. This is where things went south for the rookie coyote chaser. He was sitting in the drivers seat in his SUV and he pushed the button and rolled down the window on the passenger side of the vehicle then raised up the boomer and shot it out the window on the other side of the truck. The muzzle had to be a full three feet inside the truck when the 460 breathed fire. Needless to say the dumb @ss lost a good percentage of his ability to hear on that day. His new nickname is "WHAT" cuz he sure says it a lot! However to date he's still got both of his thumbs!

  16. #16

    Default Look at it this way.....

    We got the Bradey Bill and such because people blame the guns.

    If we let an idiot's stupidity speak for the 460 or any other caliber, we're doing the same thing to ourselves.

  17. #17

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    The idiots stupidity isn't speaking for the 460 but rather for the idiot.

    The Bradey people aren't smart enough to realize that guns can't think therefore they try to blame the gun. Hopefully the readers on this forum know the difference.

    If you go to a wood carving forum you read about some idiot running a chisel into his leg because he was using his leg as a work bench, If you go to a lumberjack forum you read about some guy's chainsaw kicking back and giving him battle scars on his forehead etc. etc. This happens to be a handgun forum so I think we can feel free to talk about handgun blunders. Hopefully as we shake our heads in wonder we are learning from these amazing feats of stupidity. Whether it be a chisel, chainsaw or a gun the operator and the operator only is responsible for his own ignorance concerning proper use of the tool at hand!

    I am not going to tip toe around the Bradey clan nor am I going to be painted into a corner with them. They are arrogant and adamant on their stand on gun rights and I am twice as arrogant and twice as adamant on my stand! Talking about ignorant people doing brainless things with a 460 doesn't change that!

  18. #18

    Default We agree

    Quote Originally Posted by elmerkeithclone View Post
    The idiots stupidity isn't speaking for the 460 but rather for the idiot.

    The Bradey people aren't smart enough to realize that guns can't think therefore they try to blame the gun. Hopefully the readers on this forum know the difference.

    If you go to a wood carving forum you read about some idiot running a chisel into his leg because he was using his leg as a work bench, If you go to a lumberjack forum you read about some guy's chainsaw kicking back and giving him battle scars on his forehead etc. etc. This happens to be a handgun forum so I think we can feel free to talk about handgun blunders. Hopefully as we shake our heads in wonder we are learning from these amazing feats of stupidity. Whether it be a chisel, chainsaw or a gun the operator and the operator only is responsible for his own ignorance concerning proper use of the tool at hand!

    I am not going to tip toe around the Bradey clan nor am I going to be painted into a corner with them. They are arrogant and adamant on their stand on gun rights and I am twice as arrogant and twice as adamant on my stand! Talking about ignorant people doing brainless things with a 460 doesn't change that!
    We agree completely, and that's my point. Sorry if that didn't come through. Some folks on this thread were starting to speculate that other calibers wouldn't do it as bad, and it was starting to feel like folks were spending too much time talking about the guns, rather than the idiots.

    My favorites among the idiots I've seen was the guy who snuggled up behind the rear sight of his brand new FA 454. Just like you get close to the rear sight on a rifle. Before anyone could say anything he fired and took off about half his nose with the rear sight as the front sight was on its way to burying itself in his forehead. We were all laughing and he was yelling about suing Freedom Arms because the directions didn't tell him not to do that.

    Sheesh!

  19. #19

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    I'm bettin all of these guys got their tongues stuck to the slide when they were little!

  20. #20

    Default yup

    Quote Originally Posted by elmerkeithclone View Post
    I'm bettin all of these guys got their tongues stuck to the slide when they were little!
    I knew a bunch of them growing up. But where I was, there was no ice. Peeing on electric fences worked just as well.

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