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Thread: Prediction:

  1. #1
    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Angry Prediction:

    As the enviros become more powerful in this state, there will be more pressure to ban the "braappers" (that's what I call the really loud snowmachines that the idiot riders like to goose every few seconds) from state and federal lands. They will not differentiate between snowmachines or riders.

    Heck, even now I can hear them buzzing around out on the flats a half mile from my home. No game around because of the braappers.

    I have two snowmachines, and I ride, but I have responsibly quiet machines. I also like to get out on skis and snowshoes to look for bunnies and ptarmigan occasionally. Hard to do because of the braappers are busy zooming around without a thought to anybody else's land use. I don't think they even look around to notice the beauty, or the possibility that there might be wildlife around them. It's all about speed and noise for them.

    If the braappers don't tone it down and act responsibly they will ruin it for us all.

    By the way, what genius introduced the idea that riding with a noisy expansion chamber is macho and cool?

  2. #2
    Moderator hunt_ak's Avatar
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    I do not have a pipe or can or anything like that, but most people buy those to shed weight and gain horsepower. I guess there are some that might ONLY buy them for the noise. You have to remember though that this is a very very large state and you can always get away from people...

  3. #3
    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Default Big state

    Quote Originally Posted by hunt_ak View Post
    I do not have a pipe or can or anything like that, but most people buy those to shed weight and gain horsepower. I guess there are some that might ONLY buy them for the noise. You have to remember though that this is a very very large state and you can always get away from people...
    But that doesn't stop enviros from wanting to tie up and regulate every portion of it. We won't have to fight them if we show responsibility and consideration.

    Yes, I can go other places I guess. Should I have to? Should the game have to disappear from their old habitats? Places where ptarmigan used to come down from the mountains in spring are now overrun with snowmachine traffic. You can't find 'em anymore in places where they used to be common. This was not a problem with the older, quieter machines. But when you hook up 500-1000 cc's up to a huge paddle track and then add other stuff on to get yet more hp, you can go just about anywhere with impunity.

    Can't they just stick to the slopes and do their mindless hill climbing and start avalanches to be dug out from?

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    Wink 4-strokes Quiet

    When we are out grooming during the week we see lots of birds, moose and bunnies. But I think they are the smart ones because they hide on weekends. But I do think you have a point there, and it is time some people get just a little control over the way they ride. Take care on private property. Stay on the trail till you get to pubic land. And keep the noise down around People, Animals, Homes and Cabins. Think when you ride, that you might like to ride later, not just this second.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Boss View Post
    4-strokes Quiet......
    I'm sure we'll be forced into four strokes eventually in the same way and for the same reasons we're seeing it on rivers.

    The major complaint I hear about the few 4 stroke models available now is weight.

  6. #6
    Member HMWHC1's Avatar
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    IT IS SAD THAT A FEW BAD APPLES CAN AND DO RUIN THE WHOLE BARREL.RIDING ATVS SNOGOS OR WHATEVER .IN THE GREAT STATE OF ALASKA ONE SHOULD STOP NOW AND AGAIN TO SEE THE BEAUTY.OF EVERYTHING ,THESE PEOPLE WHO TEAR UP OUR TRAILS .ARE ACTUALLY TEARING UP THIER OWN BACK YARD .AND DON,T EVEN KNOW IT. IT STARTS AT HOME PEOPLE!!!!! TEACH OUR CHILDEN RESPOSIBLE RIDING.WHERES THE LITERATURE ABOUT THIS PROPLEM.WHERE IS IT.MAYBE ITS HERE!!!!! WHAT CAN WE DO

  7. #7

    Default Wow!!!

    Holy smokes, this is one he!! of a snowmobile bashing thread. Where do we start.....

    Places where ptarmigan used to come down from the mountains in spring are now overrun with snowmachine traffic.
    True colors coming through. Sounds like more of a complaint with an increase of snowmobiles in general, not just Braapers.

    This was not a problem with the older, quieter machines. But when you hook up 500-1000 cc's up to a huge paddle track and then add other stuff on to get yet more hp, you can go just about anywhere with impunity.
    The older machines are more "dirty" and more "noisy" than any machine I have in my "fleet" of animal scaring, avalanche causing, mindless hillclimbing machines.

    Some opinions expressed here have merit. I too do not like "canned machines". You're in luck, the average age of riders is getting older, 40ish something now. So hang in there, and all machines except for your perfect older slow machine will be gone.

    The current trend is for quiter machines. Will it happen overnight? NO! Even the "after market Cans" are getting quiter. There is a push for quiter but it will take a little time.

    As for racing around, going fast "zoom zoom", well it's going to happen because a lot of people enjoy the thrill. Not everyone enjoys to "put put" around.

    But that doesn't stop enviros from wanting to tie up and regulate every portion of it. We won't have to fight them if we show responsibility and consideration.
    Yes we will. Yellowstone park. If you have been following the history of that, then 'nuff said.

    Take care on private property. Stay on the trail till you get to pubic land. And keep the noise down around People, Animals, Homes and Cabins. Think when you ride, that you might like to ride later, not just this second.
    This is said perfectly. Way to put it Trailboss.

    Not all 500 cc plus riders with paddle tracks are evil and not everybody agrees on how a machine should be ridden. As an active member of our local snowmachine club I'd like to add this last statement...

    What have you done for your club lately?????

    Instead of getting on here and complaining, I challenge you to join your local club or become active in it by starting some sort of an education process at your local schools or teen hangouts to help educate rather than just fuss. Become part of the solution rather than point to a problem. By the way, I'm not saying it is only teens. I'm saying start educating the next generation of riders.

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    I broke trail two weeks ago to run my trap line. We had gottenabout a foot of new snow and the trail was smooth. My SWT Skandic makes a great wide trail, that is real smooth. For the rest of the week I could run out and check my traps and be back in two hours. On the way out I ran about 10 to 15 mph due to constant stops. On the way back I ran between 35 and 40 mph with a good smooth trail.

    Then the weekend came. Went out Sunday afternoon, and two of those Braappers passed us throwing a rooster tail 15ft high. Going down the trail they were constantly hitting the throttle and ripping out a hole 6 to 8 inches deep. But worse they were creating a mound of snow about a foot high every time they hit the throttle. Went out last night to check traps and the trail has gotten so bad it is just constant up and down. 5 to 10 mph all the way, both ways. All of my wolf sets in the trail are sprung, and usually dug out due to the paddle track springing the trap and it grabbing the paddle and being pulled out of the snow. My machine can cross these sets and never trip one, as can most machines. Just those large paddle tracks will spring them. Yes, the trail is marked that their is traps in the trail. Also last night found where someone had decided to drive a truck out the trail for about a half mile. They really tore things up bad as well.
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  9. #9

    Default Its called growing areas!!!

    Come on guys its obvious what is happening. All these "horrible" things are due to one thing mainly, the snowmoblie population is growing. More people out riding on the trails. Yes paddle tracks don't help matters. But with more people on the trails there is going to be more bumps regardless of the track. Not all people like to cruise at the speed you do on the trap line as Itsryd stated. It just kind of comes with the territory of Alaska's growing population.

    It also didn't used to take an hour to get from the glenn highway to huffman rd. in Anchorage at around 5:00 pm. Alaska is going up like it or not.

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    Brappers in the winter don't bother me. But these tools who have to ride their superloud snowmachines on the river I live on in the summer are a different story. I'm always hoping for a highspeed crash. F'em

  11. #11
    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Default Response

    Quote Originally Posted by ltsryd View Post
    True colors coming through. Sounds like more of a complaint with an increase of snowmobiles in general, not just Braapers....

    What have you done for your club lately?????
    My "true colors" are to be able to enjoy the outdoors at a variety of different levels and experiences; some motorized, some not. I try get out on my machine as often as I can in the winter. Not every weekend, but whenever the conditions are good. I haul wood, go ice fishing or hunting, and enjoy nature in general. I don't have any high performance machines, but I don't begrudge people who do as long as they're not deafeningly loud, don't ruin trails, and are conscious that others are sharing the outdoors with them. Many seem oblivious.

    Yes, the population is growing, and we will have to share the woods and trails. A minority of irresponsible people will end up ruining it for everyone if they are not reined in.

    I personally have no plans to join any club. This is as close to a club as I will ever be a part of, and I'll bet there are a lot like me, so lay your guilt trip elsewhere (seems like I've heard it before). I'm just asking for common sense and courtesy to prevail so that we can all continue to do the things we enjoy.

  12. #12
    Member Erik in AK's Avatar
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    dws I'm sorry but you're out of line. "...hoping for a highspeed crash. F'em"
    You don't happen to get out to your summer home on the river in a jet boat or an airplane do you? Or, God forbid, an airboat? pot...kettle....black

    the braapers are young mostly, they tweak their machines for performance, sure, but mostly they do it because of peer pressure. They're young and impressionable. Everything they see and read about snowmachining tells them they have to tweak their machine to be cool.
    Of course that doesn't excuse discourtesy or tearing up someone's marked trapline.

    Most will see the folly of their ways as they age. A few won't, but most will. We were all young once and most of us fools, lucky to still be alive.

  13. #13

    Default Usually the case.

    I personally have no plans to join any club. This is as close to a club as I will ever be a part of, and I'll bet there are a lot like me, so lay your guilt trip elsewhere (seems like I've heard it before).
    I think a person has a better chance to make a point when they participate in trying to solve a problem rather than just point them out. I hear it a lot. Complain, complain, complain.... man-up and help out.

    I'm just asking for common sense and courtesy to prevail so that we can all continue to do the things we enjoy.
    What is common sense and courtesy? Who do you expect to notify snowmobilers what right is? I know, let the other guy do it...

    Can't they just stick to the slopes and do their mindless hill climbing and start avalanches to be dug out from?
    Ouch, I wouldn't wish this on anybody or any user group. These comments will only seperate users rather than unite.

    A minority of irresponsible people will end up ruining it for everyone if they are not reined in.
    I agree, so when YOU decide to help with the education process let me know and I'll help out in anyway I can. Then we can sit back with a cold one and complain together.

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    Cool Ignorant

    lstryd-
    Who's @$$ are you kissing? The complainers don't really deserve a response. Some people are just angry!

    Sayak-
    What I'm ***** about is the dealer that sold me my triple pipes assured me that my johnson would lengthen by "many inches" when I installed them...no such luck. It just increased in diameter...

    DWS and Graybeard-
    Why don't you guys just set some strategically placed cable across the trail/river at neck level, I mean, since it's obviously on YOUR private property.

    To all the other haters....quit being so ignorant and self-involved. With all your infinite wisdom, one of you should have figured out that the world doesn't revolve around you.
    Last edited by fullkurl; 01-28-2008 at 20:54. Reason: language

  15. #15
    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Default Don't have the luxury of time

    Quote Originally Posted by Erik in AK View Post
    the braapers are young mostly...Most will see the folly of their ways as they age. A few won't, but most will. We were all young once and most of us fools, lucky to still be alive.
    There was time for us to be fools in the outdoors. People used to be pretty loose in the way they treated the outdoors, but there weren't the numbers of eco-types there are today.

    Consider places where people used to ride the beaches and logging roads on 4-wheelers. Becoming a thing of the past. National parks are already enforcing restrictions on snowmachines. So are national forests such as the Chugach. More restrictions will come, and I wouldn't be surprised if it happens on the Kenai Refuge next. Which machines do you suppose the greenies will use as examples of why there shouldn't be machines in the reserves? It pays to look ahead. You don't need a club for that, but for you who are into that, good for you.

  16. #16
    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    If you buy a house next to the tracks you have no room to complain about the train! Sleds will quiet down with time as more go to 4 stroke. As snowmachine enthusiast (hunters as well) segregating ourselves from others with similar enjoyments is cutting of your nose to spite your face! What are you going to do to stop the "brappers"? Once you crack the door for the enviros you have invited the wolf into the hen house. Would you rather deal with some young dumb kids while you are at your cabin or not have access to your cabin at all?

  17. #17

    Default My point has been made.

    I must thank you SuperDick. You have made my point, better than I could myself.

    Outright complaining and wishing for avalanches to bury riders and wishing for them to have high speed crashes will only divide riders and earn no respect from anyone. In fact it usually will **** someone off enough that they will say and do some really dumb stuff.

    ***** kiss? Huh, I did get a pretty good laugh from that one. Thanks for the humour.

    Educate, educate, educate. A fix will not happen overnight but as organized groups work together to protect our right to ride it will come together. There is room for everyone. There is a time and place for all types of riders. One is not more right than the other.

    COMPLAIN OR HELP.......WHERE DO YOU STAND???????



    One more point... In 1989 I bought a Yamaha Enticer 400 and set out with a bunch of traps. I made new trails and made my sets. Weekend after weekend my traps were set off by snowmobilers looking to explore new areas. That was in 1989. There wasn't many paddle tracks back then and the machines were slower then today. The point is...this is not a new issue.
    Last edited by fullkurl; 01-28-2008 at 21:17. Reason: language

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik in AK View Post
    dws I'm sorry but you're out of line. "...hoping for a highspeed crash. F'em"
    You don't happen to get out to your summer home on the river in a jet boat or an airplane do you? Or, God forbid, an airboat? pot...kettle....black
    Huh? I live on a river and drive my truck to my year around home. AND a high speed crash for them is the same as wiping out on a jet ski only thankfully their machine sinks.

  19. #19
    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Default Quoting myself

    Quote Originally Posted by sayak View Post
    Can't they just stick to the slopes and do their mindless hill climbing and start avalanches to be dug out from?
    Sorry you had to rely on someone else's borderline profanity to have your point made Itsryd.

    As for my statement above, it was poorly worded, and I can see how a person could construe it as a wish that hill climbers get buried. I have no such wish. One of my former students was buried and died in an avalanche in '99 up in Turnagain Pass. A great deal of time, effort, and grief went into trying to dig those guys out, and he wasn't dug out until spring. If a person is going to live dangerously, I guess they should expect that those kinds of things could happen.

    Regarding education; I will be taking my Outdoor Ed class out for a 100 mile, overnight snowmachine trip in February. This is after several weeks of instruction on everything from snowmobile repair and maintenance to trail courtesy, to avalanche and ice safety. Some of these kids come from families who are members of a local club, yet have no real knowledge of what to do if they break down, or get lost. They do know how to go fast though.

  20. #20
    Member fullkurl's Avatar
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    Lets remember that we all ride.

    I'm with Sayak, if we aren't more responsible the sno-gos will be no-gos.

    And hey, if a guy can't vent a bit here among his fraternity of fellow riders, where can he?

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