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Thread: Angle compensating rangefinders

  1. #1
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    Default Angle compensating rangefinders

    Hey fellow archers. Do me a favor and head to the Optics forum and give me some feedback on Angle Compensating Rangefinders, will ya?

  2. #2

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    why Greg? We both know the answer here. It's all dictated by the horizontal distance regardless of how up or down the target is. Someone finally found a way to make a gizmo take that into account and give you the true range.

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    Default State The Obvious

    Trady, I am looking for input from end users, not the theory. Ya big galoot! Go over to optics and tell me all you know there, that is if all of your homework is done. Quit fooling around and get that boat done before summer catches you by the short hairs.
    There are some interesting reviews on the net, some good, and some not so good. I posted in Optics because, well, it seemed kind of sort of like an eyeball type question.
    G

  4. #4

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    now I have to ask, why would I bother with it? I dont need a ranger finder, so hence I dont use one

    Gluing up the last outer gunnel tonight...then sand then varnish and done, this weekend maybe?

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    Default not holding my breath

    You fibber. Better prove up on your prediction! This weekend. Like maybe you mean a weekend in June? Hey, I am heading to Homer to watch the boy ski. He had a great race in Valdez. Hope he pulls another couple together for Junior Nationals.
    Maybe you should get a rangefinder. You don't practice enough, you are going to need one.

  6. #6

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    I dont practice enough? Hell I dont even have any sight pins smarty pants lmao. I shoot most days in the house so there

    Got the last gunnel glued up. Got some sanding, another coat of epoxy over the gunnels to seal them, light sand and varnish...June, I hope not to be here in June.

  7. #7
    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    I could go over to optics, but I am going to limit my experience with actually shooting a bow.

    Last year I shot NFAA Outdoor Nationals in Darrington Washington. This field course is extremely hilly. They were selling a guide to the range that included OptiLogic measured distances for a fund raiser. I bought one of these guides to support the cause. Throughout the course I continuously found errors in angle compensating range finder distances vs. using my personal normal range finder and an angle finder...especially on long shots. There was enough error that I would have lost valuable points in competition if I had used an Opti-Logic range finder vs. using my cut chart and my other tools.

    Now, for real life hunting conditions. If you use an angle compensating rangefinder out to real life bowhunting distances you are probably going to be just fine. In target archery we are dealing with an inch of accuracy at 50 yards to keep some of us happy. In the field that area can stretch to 10" of accuracy on a moose..or 5" on a sheep.

    An example. Sheep hunting you are presented with a shot on a HUGE ram. He is 50 yards away downhill on a 45deg slope.. (a shot I would never take). The OptiLogic rangefinder is going to give you a shot distance of 35.3 yards. Using my angle finder and my cut chart for my bow I am going to shoot at him for 34.5 yards. Really no big deal since most of us can hold plus or minus a yard of accuracy with a pin sight at that distance anyway. The difference in those shots is only going to be .75" in the perfect world. Now, if that ram was uphill 45 deg the difference between the OptiLogic and my bow is a yard the other direction. Once again, no big deal.

    Like all range finders and bowhunting you should sight in using the range finder you are going to use. If you are going to use an OptiLogic or Leupold angle compensating range finder get out there and practice with it...ON HILLS. In competition spanning over 20 years now I have only shot a couple shots at 45deg downhill and it's amazingly difficult. What most people consider a steep hill is often only 25 degrees. Expert, black diamond, ski slopes start at 35deg. If you've ever skiied on a black diamond you can understand how steep that really is.

    Knowing the distance is only 10% of the battle. Knowing how to shoot on hills is the other 90%.

  8. #8

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    Let's see...40 yards of slope distance, 25 degrees down the hill.... 90 degrees + 25 degrees = 115 degree zenith angle. The sine of 115 degrees is, wait... ,hang on..., 0.906. So .906 * 40 = 36.24 yard shot (horizontal distance)... (108.72 feet out and 55.9 feet down = 120 foot hypotenuse)

    Hold for a 36 yard shot the bottom of his chest in the heart/lung zone and let it fly. Collect my game.

    "I'd like to thank the members of the Academy, and Mrs McPeat, my high school trig teacher..."



  9. #9
    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    eggzachery...

    You can do that all in one step with an OptiLogic or Leupold angle compensating range finder In reality, if you practice on hills enough, you get a pretty good feel for scrubbing distance. They just aren't accurate enough for me past 60 yards on a Field course

    On a 3D competition course where range finders are not legal I will often judge the horizontal distance to a tree next to the target. Then I will look at the hill. If my brain says "man that's steep" I will scrub a yard for a 20 yard shot, two yards for a 30 yarder, 3 for a 30 yarder, 4 for a 40 yarder, or 5 for a 50yarder (maximum distance allowed on most courses). If my brain says "aww..that's not much of a hill" I will scrub far less. I do the same thing when I am hunting, but I know the distance because I use a range finder.

    So, do I need to start a thread about off camber downhill shots and where your arrow will end up if your bow isn't verticle? Once again, if you don't practice on hills you will be quite surprised at the problems they create.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKDoug View Post
    eggzachery...

    You can do that all in one step with an OptiLogic or Leupold angle compensating range finder In reality, if you practice on hills enough, you get a pretty good feel for scrubbing distance. They just aren't accurate enough for me past 60 yards on a Field course

    On a 3D competition course where range finders are not legal I will often judge the horizontal distance to a tree next to the target. Then I will look at the hill. If my brain says "man that's steep" I will scrub a yard for a 20 yard shot, two yards for a 30 yarder, 3 for a 30 yarder, 4 for a 40 yarder, or 5 for a 50yarder (maximum distance allowed on most courses). If my brain says "aww..that's not much of a hill" I will scrub far less. I do the same thing when I am hunting, but I know the distance because I use a range finder.

    So, do I need to start a thread about off camber downhill shots and where your arrow will end up if your bow isn't verticle? Once again, if you don't practice on hills you will be quite surprised at the problems they create.
    I grew up whackin' whitetail from tree stands. Whitetails are famous for "ducking the string" in the <20-yard game of bowhunting the thick stuff.

    This makes it a little tricky to dope a 12 yard shot from 35' in a tree (I used to smoke...).

    I bought a pendulum sight after hunting with one pin for a few years. I dialed in in to a frog hair on hay bales in the back yard.
    The first morning of archery season found me confidently drawing down on a nice fat nanny under a white oak tree. Zot!
    Clean miss! Didn't even bother the deer. She kept feeding.
    Try it again. Zot! Another clean miss under the deer! The deer ain't liking this too much, so she bounds into some cover and blows a couple times.
    &#37;&@#!

    But those acorns are good. An hour passes. The same solitary doe comes tippin' back out. Ears swiveling...
    I'm a little put off that I seem to be shooting low, so I hold about a foot higher for my third arrow at the same deer and let it fly...

    The arrow flew about a foot over the deer's back and scared the daylights out of her. She took off crashing and blowing through the cutover to the next county. She's probably still running and blowing, for all I know....

    I spent the rest of my quiver dialing in the pin I still had on the sight. I probably still have the pendulum sight around somewhere, collecting dust.

    The thing I had taught myself from shooting a single pin from a treestand was to shoot through the target, not at it. Your instinct takes care of the rest.

    "A weapon is only a tool. It is a hard heart that kills..." -- GySgt Hartman
    "My arrows are made of desire" -- J. Hendrix

    When your heart's thumpin from the anxiety of a shot on a big game animal, best advice for steep uphill or downhill is to "Hold a little low and let 'er go" when sights and instinct says you're lined up.



    As for the 3-d range, pretty much any 50 yd+ shots are gonna be on large animal targets - moose, wapiti, frontal bear. I always just hold off my 40 yard pin. If you're looking for a way to consistently hit the 12 ring at 60 yards, it's beyond the scope of "hunting related". Very few people have any business attempting to slay a big game animal at ranges where 1/2 yard of distance misjudgement can mean the difference between a good shot and a crippled loss....

    Let's assume this guy is legal game where you're hunting, your freezer's empty, your tag's unfilled, the season ends in an hour or two, and you guess him to be about 60 yards out with a 10 mph wind R to L...
    Where do you hold?






  11. #11
    Moderator Daveinthebush's Avatar
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    Default Well you asked

    You hold out. He is slightly quartering towards you, part of the vitals are covered by leg bones, alert and at 60 yards. I would pass on the shot until he was broadside and at least relaxed. Then I would have to re-evaluate the situation.

    Vietnam - June 70 - Feb. 72
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  12. #12

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    60, he lives for a long long time! Even perfectly broadside or quartering away with the near leg forward.....just to dog gone far to make a dumb mistake on my part to "fill the freezer" in the bottom of the 9th...next year, is another year that I'd go into without regrets!

  13. #13

    Default Bacon in the pan? - NOT...

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveinthebush View Post
    You hold out. He is slightly quartering towards you, part of the vitals are covered by leg bones, alert and at 60 yards. I would pass on the shot until he was broadside and at least relaxed. Then I would have to re-evaluate the situation.

    Exactly what I would have to say Dave and TradBow..
    It just about has to be perfect to even consider a shot at those ranges. It's wide open, plain as day. But his hackles are up. He's a little suspicious.

    The sweet spot's so small, i doubt I'd "feel" the shot. The stakes are too high to rush it and wound the animal so he can't be recovered.
    Better to wait till he comes closer, or at least quarters away and shows about 3X as much lung to drive a broadhead through.


    Thanks for playing along. I think this is one of the dangers of rangefinders - giving people the idea that bowhunting is a 58.84 yard sport. It's not. It's the same 10-30 yard sport here as it is in a Montana creek bottom or Texas oakmont.
    If you need a special tool to dope your shot on a game animal, it's time to reconsider because, at the range most of us should be letting go, the adjustments for even steep slopes are real simple - hold a little low.

    3-D is mucho different. At the level where 60 yard shots are encountered, it's about a serious enough challenge to differentiate very good archers, not much about hunting. We may be able to smoke that shot on a range, but how many of us would take it on game?


  14. #14
    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishmael View Post
    Let's assume this guy is legal game where you're hunting, your freezer's empty, your tag's unfilled, the season ends in an hour or two, and you guess him to be about 60 yards out with a 10 mph wind R to L...
    Where do you hold?






    My freezers empty huh? I'll hold the stock of a rifle thanks
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

  15. #15
    Member AKDoug's Avatar
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    No shot on that one unless I can sneak closer...or a few grunts get him to come to me.

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