Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 68

Thread: drawing and preference points

  1. #1

    Default drawing and preference points

    Guys, it looks to be some changes in the works and some type of preference point system will come into effect. Was wondering what you all think about it. I am against it personally, but our advisory committee discussed a win/win situation.

    We feel that a preference point system should be set up, but not in full effect. The reason why is that if we set up a system, you can pretty much eliminate our kids from ever drawing and basically making all drawing hunts a once in a lifetime chance. I really don't think anyone of us wants that. Can you imagine only drawing one TMA a tag in your life? There is no reason to set up a system that eliminates all hope.

    Here is what we propose:

    A preference point system set up that takes into account 25% of available permits for that species. The other 75% of the allowable permits would still be an "open" drawing giving everyone an equal chance. For example, in the TMA where 100 permits are drawn, 25 of those would be allocated to the preference point system and the other 75 are available for all to apply for.

    If we go to a full blown preference point system, we will all be screwed forever. Our kids will be the ones to suffer the most. Don't we all want to have some permits available for all to put in for?

    Also, for preference point hunts, you can only choose one hunt per species with those points. That would give you 2 choices for any of the open draw permits available.

    Let's here what you think. I know a lot gripe about the current draw system, but a full preference point system will have even more of you griping later on down the road. Our kids may have to keep putting in for 20-30 years before even getting close.

  2. #2

    Default

    northway, are people going to be able to buy preference points or do hunters have to earn them?

  3. #3
    Member alaskanmoosehunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Next to my trashy neighbor
    Posts
    362

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45 View Post
    northway, are people going to be able to buy preference points or do hunters have to earn them?


    That would be a horrible system with $$$$ vs time!!!

    Only the rich would be able to hunt and I could see outside intrest groups (peta, ect.) and local members purchasing a license and prefence points just to sit on top of a tag and not use them.


    I think we are in for a rude awakening..........Either way!
    Combat Vet by choice! Defender of this great nation and people (Which unfortunately also includes the stupid and the ignorant.)

    http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:_R_ZqAiK-e_U0M:<a href=http://hometeamsonline.com/photos/hockey/ARCTICLIONS/Ice_Puppies_Logo_Light_with_shading.jpg target=_blank rel=nofollow>http://hometeamsonline.com/photos/ho...th_shading.jpg</a>

    Support Youth Hockey!
    http://www.hometeamsonline.com/teams...Y&s=hockey&t=c

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Coffman Cove, POW, Alaska
    Posts
    753

    Talking Sorry, No win/win

    The random draw is the ONLY true way to make the drawing equitable for everyone in the state - your kids, the old timers, the military folks, us overweight office workers, etc. The system is fine now and needs no tweaking. I think the advisory committees statewide should realize this as the only rational choice and not get influenced by a bunch of whiners who don't get their Tok tag after 4 years of trying. It all boils down to statistics folks, play the odds. You will get tags. Spend the $ and play the odds. Let's not let emotion outweigh rational thought. But then again I got three more tags this year

    Gooch

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Coffman Cove, POW, Alaska
    Posts
    753

    Default Sorry the smiley face was supposed to be after the last sentence

    Sorry about that...

  6. #6
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    I am Valley trash.
    Posts
    589

    Default my 2 cents

    I am also not a big fan of the preference point system and would rather not go to one. The reason we are/will go to a point system in the future is that it is easier for the Department of Commercial Fish and Human Management (ADCF&HM) to mange us humans then to do their job and manage GAME.

    Yes there are several different proposals out to choose between and I don’t think any will pass this year. I just became part of the MATSU AC and they have Tony Russ working on a point system proposal. Much like the one mentioned here but the percentages are reversed. I think it is #25, maybe #16. I am too lazy to go find my book.

    ADCF&HM (aka ADF&G) was at one of our meeting they mentioned that they would like to get a committee together to go over the point system program. They would like to take one that is working in the lower-48 then have to reinvent the wheel.

    I understand we have more hunting pressure then before and this will only continue since the world population growth is out-of-control, but this in only part of it. If the ADCF&HM would change the way they tmanage our game and start doing what we are paying them to do, we wouldn’t be talking about a point system program. This will not happen until we/us Alaska hunters start demanding that they do their jobs or lose them. We need leadership change in the ADCF&HM.

    The only positive point I see in going to draw state is that we can limit the amount of non-resident hunters. I truly don’t have a big issue with non-resident hunters; my beef is with the non-resident guides. Many mention that we don’t have enough guides in Alaska to handle the load; I think this is a bunch of BS! If I were a big game guide and an Alaskan resident I would go on a “Hire an Alaskan Guide First” campaign.

    If we go to a point system I would like to see if we can somehow word it so our resident guides would be considered first then if we need to seek an out-of-state guide we could do so.

    Sorry I got off topic, but I believe they must be looked at, at the same time.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    fairbanks alaska
    Posts
    207

    Default great state of alaska

    ...is sounding more like the lower 48. too bad for us. no point in griping if drawings with preference points are already on the way. so as they say "be careful what you ask for, you might just get it". but i'll play along, when can we start buying our own private ranges and get some fences up?

  8. #8
    Member jkb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Big Lake
    Posts
    1,466

    Default

    IMO the only hunt worth having preference points is Delta Bison and Kodiak Bear. There are no other hunts that could not be done with regular harvest tickets just not a easy.

  9. #9
    New member akhunter02's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    682

    Default points points points

    Do the math people, a point system is not going to get you a TOK permit any faster, infact you have a better chance in drawing the permit within 20 years than you would if it where a point system.. It all comes down to numbers which dont lie. Most will never hunt or live for that matter long enough to draw under a point system

    We shouldnt even be considering a point system until there is a cap on the number of permits that can go to non residents.

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    the Break Away Republic of Eagle River
    Posts
    513

    Default

    Dead set against ANY type of points system.

    Period

  11. #11
    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Big Lake
    Posts
    8,457

    Default

    a point system for delta or kodiak wouldn't help at all, then we'd have 4000 people when the same number of pref points. random draw is fair, gotta admit that. we don't like it just cause we don't get what we want fast enough...i have a four year old here at the house that'd like preference points on the TV and gameboy.

    Non res aren't the problem either....the problem is ALASKA IS GROWING!!! anyone figure this out yet...? four wheelers are a dime a dozen, boats are everywhere and more and more people own planes and there are more and more transporters. Back to the board of more money, more chance at getting to game. Sure we all want to drive up and wail on a buff, or knock back a 40" ram and be home before work on monday...but realisticly, it'll all end up going drawing.
    can't have more hunters and less game/country and more opportunities unless we make some sacrifices.
    Www.blackriverhunting.com
    Master guide 212

  12. #12
    Member jkb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Big Lake
    Posts
    1,466

    Default

    what I was trying to say is the areas that are drawing now don't have any better oppurtunitys than regular harvest areas. The difference is a certain number of people are funneled in to them. Take the 14 c sheep hunts they are sending 24 people after rams and ewes and the ewe only hunts add even more in to each drainage plus the bow hunts in Oct. There might be 5-10 full curl rams in each drainage. Trust me when there is a drawing permit you get close to 100 percent participation. In other words its as crowded as anywhere else. If we are going to get worried about somthing, how about ADF&g making drawing hunts a true once in a lifetime chance you can't get somewhere else.

  13. #13
    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Eagle River, AK
    Posts
    13,393

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jkb View Post
    There might be 5-10 full curl rams in each drainage. Trust me when there is a drawing permit you get close to 100 percent participation. In other words its as crowded as anywhere else.
    That hasn't been my experience. I've been on three 14C hunts (my permits and my mothers), and we've never seen another hunter in the field. (Wait...that's not quite true. When I headed up Pioneer Peak two days before the season opener there were two other groups, but I went down and tried Peter's Creek instead and was all alone.) When we hunted the early Ship Creek hunt we went in three days early. We sat underneath three full curl rams (on the same mountain, let alone the same drainage) and never saw another person.

    F&G stats show pretty clearly that drawing permit participation isn't anywhere close to 100&#37;. Likewise, they also show that there are usually far more than 5-10 legal rams per drainage when they have the time/funding to fly 14C. (There are packets you can pick up in the Anchorage F&G office to verify this with a year-by-year count.)

  14. #14

    Default drawing

    I don't want any preference points system either, basically was inferred that F&G may implement. Trying to find something that will hurt us the least.

  15. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cutter View Post
    Dead set against ANY type of points system.

    Period

    Ditto for me!

  16. #16
    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Eagle River, AK
    Posts
    13,393

    Default

    For those that would like to see a preference point system in place, I think you'll find a lot more sympathy for your cause the day after the winter drawing results come out.

    "What?! I didn't win my TMA permit?? I DESERVE one of those permits! We need preference points!!!"

    (Feel free to insert the terms "spring drawing" and "Delta bison" in the above statements.)


  17. #17

    Default kind of funny...

    Most people seem to favor a system after the draw, but now can't seem to find too many interested in preference points??? I would like it to stay exactly the way it is, even if I don't draw a TMA permit!

  18. #18
    Member tccak71's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    2,174

    Default

    Northway,

    I don't like prefernce points/system at all (Gooch nailed it), but your group's idea inflicts the least amount of damage. 25%/75% would be better than the ADF&G proposal on the table for a preference system.

    AK45: what do you mean by buying points? Paying for the points for a specific draw without the intention to hunt or declaring you're not going to hunt?

    Tim

  19. #19

    Default Don't like it either

    But if it is going to happen, lets inflict the least amount of damage. I guess the thing that I don't get is will it be preference points for all hunts? That in my mind would be ridiculous. I really think the way our draw is right now if fine, but sounds like all the complaining is going to lead to a drastic change which I believe will hurt us all.

  20. #20
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    I am Valley trash.
    Posts
    589

    Default Points

    There are two movements that are making us lean towards going to a draw. One is ADCF&HM doesn't want to manage game and would rather manage humans and this is the way to do it. Second is our desire to limit the non-resident hunters, in order to do this we have to set a limit and when we do it will affect both the resident and non-resident hunters.

    There are several proprosal out that are attempting to limit the non-resident hunters and I doubt they pass, but it is the start and next year there will be 3, year after that 6 etc... until it passes.

    Unless we come up with a way to manage our resources we will have a point system. If you are not wanting a point system, then come up with something new. Other than that I would be looking at a few of the state and see how they are doing it, because we will be using one of them.

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •