Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 29

Thread: night sights vs. surefire light

  1. #1
    Member alaskamace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    AK
    Posts
    84

    Question night sights vs. surefire light

    Which would you consider a more useful addition to a self-defense handgun? A set of night sights, or a Surefire type combat flashlight?

  2. #2
    Member alaskamace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    AK
    Posts
    84

    Default night sights

    I was also curious as to what brand of night sights you might use/recommend. This would be for a Glock.

  3. #3
    Member AK_Stick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla AK (for now)
    Posts
    165

    Default

    why not both?


    I personally don't like flashlights for home defense, which is a tad ironic, being that there is a surefire on my go to gun (AR-15).

    I have good enough night vision to ID a target in my house in the dark, so my CCW pistols have just night sights.

    I have Tru-dot's on my glock's and Meprolights on my 1911.

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Knik-Fairview, Alaska
    Posts
    927

    Default

    You will always find controversy when you ask the "Do you want to see your target and BE seen by your target, or do you want to have worse visibility so your target WON'T see you?" question. Personally, I think a quality set of night sights combined with a good non-gun mounted flashlight is best.

    I have Trijicon night sights on my Kahr PM9 and had them on a G17 as well. They are a quality product that work well in all lighting conditions. My wife's XD has Heinie Figure 8 tritium sights on it, and I think I like them better after having tried them ...and would probably recommend them above the Trijicons. They seem more visible and lining up the two dots, one on top of the other, seems easier/faster.

    That said, I'd recommend having a flashlight as well, but I think it's a bad idea to put it on your gun like all the combat magazines show (which are trying to sell handguns with accessory rails and all that goes on them.) Put a laser sight on the accessory rail, not a flashlight. A flashlight shows the perp where to aim ...you'll see him just as you see the blast from his gun. Visibility should be really great ('til the lights go out.) The main reason you will hear for having a light on the gun itself is you can use a 2-handed grip ...for stability and accuracy. It's good to keep in mind that many experts argue against insisting on two hands for every shot and say that you should learn to shoot with one hand ...strong hand and weak hand first, then once you gain proficiency with one-handed shooting that you should follow with learning a 2-handed grip. Use it at the mall when you spot some guy holding up the clerk at some store and he's not looking at you. Field experience does not back up the idea of a 2-handed grip being superior when it comes to PERSONAL protection. The reason is because real life personal protection situations are usually very short and you often don't have time for getting off more than one shot, let alone aiming with two hands for stability and accuracy. Most situations occur so close that a 2-handed shot is just not optimal anyway. If you insist on a 2-handed shot like those steeped in tradition insist on, then go ahead and put a flashlight on the gun. Use 2 hands, and then only shoot when you don't mind being a target. If you are willing to train and learn how to shoot with one hand, weak and strong, then don't put a light on the gun. Shoot with one hand and hold that light off to the side so that when the perp shoots at it, he hits something other than you. Not having the light on the gun means you can move the light without moving the gun. Buy a combat light with a momentary-on button (goes off when you release pressure) and don't leave the light on ...a blink and a move is what you need. If the guy is visible and you ID'd him with the light, then use those night sights not the flashlight (if you have any time.)

    Ok everyone, flame away and have a good time at it.

    Brian

  5. #5
    Member alaskamace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    AK
    Posts
    84

    Default xs sights

    Does anyone use the XS 24/7 sights? The design would appear to me to allow quicker target acquisition than with the traditional three-dot system.

  6. #6
    Member KRS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    362

    Default

    Glowing sights can be seen by you.... and an intruder.

    Learn to point the weapon without them and you'll be better off.

    Surefires are great, but they only work if they are in your hand, if the batteries work, if the bulb isn't broken..... you get the idea.

    KRS

  7. #7
    Member AK_Stick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla AK (for now)
    Posts
    165

    Default

    I highly doubt night sights can be seen by someone infront of them. I know mine are not bright enough to be seen.

  8. #8
    Member Big Al's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Palmer,Alaska
    Posts
    1,737

    Default

    I think anyone that wants to use a handgun indoors for home defense needs to reconsider the whole approach to home defence. Bullets don't just stop when you want them to. Most handguns can easily penetrate every sheetrock wall from one end of the house to another.

    I recommend a shotgun loaded with number 8 or 9 shot, with the strongest spot light you can find. The ability to blind an opponent is invaluable, racking a 12 ga. shotgun is priceless.

    The last thing I want to do, is be awaken in the middle of the night, not turn on any lights, creep down stairs and blaze away at a family member.

    Maybe that does not sound macho enough for most people, but taking a human life is no small matter either.

  9. #9
    Member KRS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    362

    Default

    I didn't write that night sights can be seen by someone in front of them.

    If you are crawling around your house and expose the rear of your gun towards someone, they will know exactly where you are and where your gun is.... two things you don't want an intruder to know.

    I feel that no night sights is better.

    KRS

  10. #10
    Member AK_Stick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla AK (for now)
    Posts
    165

    Default

    I'll call that BS. I just laid my gun down in a dark room 6 ft away, and could just barely see the sights, at 12 ft, they were invisible. Besides the fact that to see the sights the best, they had to be pointing straight away from me, i.e. infront of my body. at 60 degrees towards you, they're invisible from 6 ft away.

    So to see your night sights, the bad guy would have to be within 6 ft of you, and behind you. I dont know about your house, but it'd be impossible to get within 6 ft of me in my own home, and behind me, before I knew you were there.....

    Now if you dont like em, thats fine, but lets be real here, the chances of someone getting behind you, and seeing your sights, and having the jump on you is minuscule


    And Al, birdshot is miserable for stopping people. Its been proven time and again, that is just isn't up to the task. If it will penetrate deep enough to reliably stop someone, it will go through walls.

  11. #11
    Member KRS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    362

    Default

    I would take every precaution I can, regardless of how miniscule someone else may think it is .... because even a small chance is still a chance. Night sights won't do a bit of good in home defense, but it can give you away. That's what I learned at Gunsite.

    AK_Stick: As for you posting replies to me in someone else's thread.... it's not necessary and it distracts from the thread. If you disagree with another poster, then tell the person who started the thread what your opinion is.

    When I'm posting, I'm posting for Alaskamace, not you.

    KRS

  12. #12
    Member AK_Stick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla AK (for now)
    Posts
    165

    Default

    Well since this is a public forum, and a discussion on the use of night sights, wouldn't this be the appropriate place?

    I mean really, isn't that exactly what the point is? To discuss whatever the topic at hand is?


    And I'm not posting for you, I'm posting for his benefit, because only hits count, and night sights, are just one more tool, to ensure you make a hit. There is not a single disadvantage to having night sights, there are, disadvantages to not having them. If you'd like to make up a BS reason not to use them, suit yourself, and if it holds water, people will defend it, if it doesn't people will tell you so

  13. #13
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    45

    Default

    alaskamace,
    I have night sights and wouldn't be without a quality flashlight. They sit side by side on my nightstand. When I put on my gun, the light goes in my pocket. The 2 go together like peanut butter and jelly. The sights help you get hits but can't help ID the target. Using proper flashlight techniques can negate the need for night sites under certain circumstances. Some situations may dictate to shoot without a flashlight so the night sights are needed. I always tell people that night sights are not absolutely necessary but are nice to have when needed. What I'm trying to say is you really should have both but if I could only get one it would be the flashlight. Just imagine the power is out and its pitch black in your house, you go to investigate a noise thinking there is an intruder and you shoot at something and then find out it was your kid because you didn't ID the potential threat with a light. It's happened. I personally don't care for weapon mounted lights on pistols because it requires you to point your gun at something you may not be willing to destroy when clearing/searching. They do have applications but I prefer other methods.

    My duty and personal carry pistols are Glocks and have trijicon sights, I have one color for the rear and a different color for the front. The Glock factory night sights are now made by trijicon and can be found on the internet for $60 or so but need a special tool to install the front. The trijicons are a little more but screw on. The rears really should be put on with a sight pusher but they could be drifted in if care is taken. I can't speak for other brands. The cheaper Surefire lights can be found for 30-40 $ and are good lights. I think they are the g2 or something like that.

    Training with the night sights and with a flashlight is also important. Shooting a pistol while using a flashlight can be difficult if not practiced. There’s plenty of information on techniques on the internet if you search for it.

    I'm a factory authorized Glock armorer so if you get the factory sights and are in the FBK area I can install them for you, no charge.

    JD

  14. #14

    Default

    I've found the night sights on both my Glock and my 870 quite useful. I'm planning on mounting a light to my shotgun because operating a shotgun with one hand is pretty awkward. As for my handgun, I have the option of several methods using one hand or two with a hand-held light.

  15. #15

    Default No subsitue fo 12ga Buck

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskamace View Post
    Which would you consider a more useful addition to a self-defense handgun? A set of night sights, or a Surefire type combat flashlight?
    The most important addition to a self-defence handgun is a 12ga shotgun.

    If the shotgun is not a option I would choose both.

    If both are not a option the the night sights, I use Trijicon.

    DR B

  16. #16
    Moderator AKmud's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Wasilla, Alaska, United States
    Posts
    3,185

    Default

    Another thread you might find interesting - http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...light=trijicon
    AKmud
    http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j96/AKmud/213700RMK1-1.jpg


    The porcupine is a peacful animal yet God still thought it necessary to give him quills....

  17. #17
    Member JOAT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Soldotna, ALASKA since '78
    Posts
    3,720

    Default

    Between the two, assuming you could only have 1 of them, I would choose the flashlight first, then save up for the sights (or a laser). You need to examine what you're going to be doing. Anyone who thinks they are going to be sneaking around their own house looking for some hidden bad guys, has been watching too many movies. If you suspect an instruder in your house, you don't want to sneak anywhere, you want to take up a defensive position and be loud as heck. Yell out that the Police have been called as you rack your pump shotgun. Give them a warning to leave the house before you start shooting. It is ALWAYS better to avoid a confrontation by outsmarting the criminal and getting them to leave. Chances are most criminals are not willing to attempt a confrontation with an armed citizen and will very quickly depart your house and neighborhood.

    Oh yeah, and the lawyers will decend upon you like flies if you sneak around in the dark and take a shot at an unidentified human shape in your house when you had the ability to set up a defensive position, tell them that they are about to be shot, and dial 9-1-1 while you have your pre-established choke point covered with muzzle and bright light. If the bad guy continues to advance, you have the strong ground and can defend it better than you could trying to sneak around in the dark not knowing what's out there or where.

    Also contrary to the FBI technique is the thought that bad guys will shoot at your flashlight. The chances are less than slim that a bad guy would even know how to aim very well and have the thought to shoot at a light so bright they can't even look directly at it. Go ahead, take a 120 Lumen SureFire light and have someone briefly shine it at you from across a dark room, you won't be able to see anything, let alone try to take aim at the flashlight. If you are holding the flashlight correctly, then your sights are on target and you can end the confrontation much faster than they would be able to even take aim at your light.

  18. #18
    Member Big Al's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Palmer,Alaska
    Posts
    1,737

    Default

    "And Al, birdshot is miserable for stopping people. Its been proven time and again, that is just isn't up to the task. If it will penetrate deep enough to reliably stop someone, it will go through walls."

    A_K Stick

    Your kidding, right?

    I suppose that in the average house with rooms of bigger than 90 ft. you might be right?

    I don't want to ever have to shoot any one again in my life. I think the state requires you to turn in the head and the hide? Right?

  19. #19
    Member AK_Stick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla AK (for now)
    Posts
    165

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Al View Post
    "And Al, birdshot is miserable for stopping people. Its been proven time and again, that is just isn't up to the task. If it will penetrate deep enough to reliably stop someone, it will go through walls."

    A_K Stick

    Your kidding, right?

    I suppose that in the average house with rooms of bigger than 90 ft. you might be right?

    I don't want to ever have to shoot any one again in my life. I think the state requires you to turn in the head and the hide? Right?

    No, I'm serious, birdshot, is crap for stopping people. It may do it, but it wont reliably put people down. Exactly why most units/agencys have moved away from number 4 buck, and gone to 00 and 000. It will make a terrible wound, but won't go deep enough to hit the vital organs reliably.

    what if the guy is wearing heavy clothes? a heavy leather jacket, might stop some or all of your shot. Its winter now, so people are bundling up, you need a round that can get through any thing they wear and stop the threat.

  20. #20
    Member Big Al's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Palmer,Alaska
    Posts
    1,737

    Default

    OK, You'll be ready. I take comfort in that. Why don't you take a little test time and see what kind of pattern you get at say 25 feet with bird shot. I think 25 feet is a fair distance to try as most of your indoor recreational shooting at bandits or your general run of crook. Even cylinder bore, at 25 feet is a nasty tight pattern.

    I don't know when police departments didn't use double O buck at least for the last 50 years I can think of. I just do not believe that you need that large of shot for your general home invasion recreational shooting.

    By the way double O won't hardly penetrate auto glass, if you really think that it will go through multilayers of sheet rock you are incorrect.

    Letting fly with big bore pistol ctgs indoors is a formula for disaster.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •