Page 1 of 10 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 199

Thread: Katmai Grizz

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    690

    Exclamation Katmai Grizz

    Well, it's happening to us finally. What has been going on in the lower 48 for years is finally creeping into popularity up here. Hunter Bashing. Just take a look at the youtube.com vid that was posted yesterday and you'll see how much we're liked.

    I'll start the personal opinion barfing with this: that video should never have been made and should never have been uploaded to the internet. It shows a biased view of hunting and invites hatred and judgement against us that enjoy the outdoors and the bounty it holds. I beleive that there should be legislation that deters the vidography of hunters without their consent. Channel 2 aired the story last night and was at least cool enough to denote that the hunters didn't like the idea of being filmed and threatened to sue if they aired it; well I hope that they do it and they win... Those guys were within the law completely and now have a bull's eye on their backs thanks to channel 2.
    "He who is slow to anger is better than the mighty, and he who rules his spirit is better than he who takes a city." ~ Proverbs 16:32

  2. #2

    Default Don't Shoot

    If I knew I was going to be video taped, I would not have continued pursuing the bear. Not knowing how the tape was going to be used, I'd walk away and hunt another day. Doesn't matter if they were in the right. Footage like this will go a long to be used against us and to probably stop hunting in Katmai. We have to be smarter than the anti's and greenies. It will undoubtedly be shown on many mainstream channels and be used to portray hunters as a group of blood thirsty neanderthals. Its the way of the world.

  3. #3

    Default Link?

    Couldn't find it. Can you post the link.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  4. #4
    Member sheep man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    wasilla, gods country
    Posts
    527

    Default

    Look at today daily news,there a link there to the clip,,,,,not good guys

  5. #5
    New member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    BC
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Where can I view the clip??

  6. #6

    Default Ktuu

    Go to ktuu.com and watch the story. It's sad that such a liberal media is entrenched in this state. The story was not objective, and actually stated that the hunt took place in Katmai National Park. Also, could those hunters not hike their lazy a%ses more than 100 yards from a TV crews camp to shoot a small sow? A lot of hunters out there just seem to step in it. There was nothing stated in the story about boars eating young, and that shooting them can actually increase overall population. I guess it's kind of hard to make that point when they have video of a sow being shot though.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  7. #7
    Member homerdave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    homer, alaska
    Posts
    3,922

    Angry hey, you know what...

    if the BOG had listened to the arguments for closing that area to bear hunting that video would never have been shot.
    though not "illegal" (which seems to be all many care about) shooting a bear that is flat-out used to humans is cowardly and unethical.
    can you imagine being assured by your guide that the bears "won't run away and are not afraid"? would you shoot a bear you knew was, for all practical purposes, tame?
    the "archery hunter" who shot that bear shames us all, and in supporting the shooting we shame ourselves further.
    Alaska Board of Game 2015 tour... "Kicking the can down the road"
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters.org/

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Valley trash.....and proud of it.
    Posts
    813

    Default

    Yeah and cowtailing to the anti's also shames us. I didnt see the clip, I dont watch the news (sick of all the liberal crap).

    As a hunter nowadays, its starting to be a lose/lose situation IMO. Everybody is so worried about making the anti's mad and in the long run, they will win.

    Ethics is a pretty broad subject, but legal is usually pretty clear cut. Would I hunt a so called tame bear, no. others would.

    I could care less if a anti taped me, if they put it on the net in a negative way as propaganda, I would take legal action. I got my standards and I know whats legal. I'm also proud of hunting and not embarrassed if someone sees me doing it.

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    470

    Default the root of the problem

    Quote Originally Posted by homerdave View Post
    shooting a bear that is flat-out used to humans is cowardly and unethical.
    ...would you shoot a bear you knew was, for all practical purposes, tame?
    Perhaps we (not just hunters but all outdoors enthusiasts) should be a little less concerned about shooting bears that are habituated to humans and more about the activites that allowed the bears to become habituated.
    Everything that lives and moves will be food for you.
    Genesis 9:3

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Bethel
    Posts
    432

    Default Hunter harassment?

    I think these guys should slap a large hunter harassment suit on those camera men. They were filming the hunt which could easily be seen as "interfearing" with the hunt. It is also a safety issue. What if the men did not know the camera men where there? or if they did could not take a shot because they are there? I see it has harassment, and a potentially dangerous situation for the cameramen. It should be illegal what they did, in my opinion.

    On the flip side, my wife watched it with me and when i flew off the handle at what i saw she didn't even flinch, so it might not have had as bad of an effect as most of us are thinking.

  11. #11
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Sitka, AK
    Posts
    142

    Default

    I just got done watching the video myself on adn.com. I'm not saying I would hunt those bears, for my own reasons, but it is legal. It sucks that the anti's have this to use.

    Channel 2 has never been a fan of hunting from my experience over the years. They camera crew put themselves in the position to film the hunt when it opened on October 1st. Near as I can see it, that's all they wanted to film, then turn around and throw a fit over the hunt. It's too bad that hunting, whether you agree with this particular hunt or not, is coming down to this.

  12. #12
    Member homerdave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    homer, alaska
    Posts
    3,922

    Thumbs down there is just no reason to hunt bears everywhere!!!

    do you think hunters have an exclusive right to the states bears? our constitution says that the wildlife of the state belongs to the people.
    as near as i can tell thet means non-hunters too. i see no reason that the bears at katmai should be hunted.
    if you look at the harvest composition of the hunt area you would see that it has been younger and more bears consistently over the last several years.
    the bear viewing industry brings a whole lot more money to the kenai then killing them does, and the bears get to be viewed again and again.
    not only does it look bad, it is piss-poor management of a valuable resource.
    Alaska Board of Game 2015 tour... "Kicking the can down the road"
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters.org/

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    All-I-SAW, AK.
    Posts
    1,036

    Default This is stupid...

    I don't buy into it... That bear was in the "area" of their camp...It sounds to me that it was there fishing and doing what bears do. It was probably curious as to something new in it's area and it checked it out, but was it a problem? If it were, then why didn't they shoot it sooner? The camp was in the same proximity of the bear and it's activities. Then it gets worded into that the bear was "hanging around their camp and they shot a "habituated" or "tame" bear"..Oh BS!

    That Day fella is not a biologist for F&G and he doesn't work for the park service, therefore is just snivelling. Did he ever wonder that maybe all of his and whoever elses flying activity in and out of there could have possibly ran a bear or two off and his paying bear watchers didn't get their experience?

    The bio's have spoken, it's a legal hunt, let it go! If anyone interfered with my legal hunt, I too would tell them to get bent or get sued. But I sure wouldn't stop because they don't "LIKE" what I'm doing OR because they "FEEL" that what I'm doing is wrong OR because they "THINK" that this hunt is bad. This is just another attempt by the anti's and their ilk. They'll never understand game management and if they do, they'll keep throwing a blind eye at it and keep re-wording it to more BS like usual...

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Valley trash.....and proud of it.
    Posts
    813

    Default

    Dave, I for one do not agree with the katmai hunt. I was more than happy with keeping it a bear viewing area, but it isnt up to us. Yeah you can speak your piece at BOG meetings but they dont care about the average joe.

    Bottom line is the BOG opened the hunt legally. I dont plan on ever hunting it, but I wont slam another hunter who does cuz its legal.

    So far everybody expressed there side of there own ethics and people arent focusing on the legality of these guys. Geez, maybe I should go watch the clip, my curiousity is going now.

  15. #15
    Member homerdave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    homer, alaska
    Posts
    3,922

    Default when the bio's spoke...

    the BOG didn't listen.
    the area biologist does not support the level of harvest currently going on.
    Alaska Board of Game 2015 tour... "Kicking the can down the road"
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters.org/

  16. #16

    Default Who Pays

    Quote Originally Posted by homerdave View Post
    do you think hunters have an exclusive right to the states bears? our constitution says that the wildlife of the state belongs to the people.
    as near as i can tell thet means non-hunters too. i see no reason that the bears at katmai should be hunted.
    if you look at the harvest composition of the hunt area you would see that it has been younger and more bears consistently over the last several years.
    the bear viewing industry brings a whole lot more money to the kenai then killing them does, and the bears get to be viewed again and again.
    not only does it look bad, it is piss-poor management of a valuable resource.
    I'm just curious. How does the management of the game get funded? Do the non hunting "users" pay their fair share? I'm not making this an argument that hunters have an exclusive right, just wondering what the answer is. Where does the bear viewing bring money to the Kenai? Not saying it doesn't, but where does that money go vs. the money hunters bring in. Where is the data to back up your claim that viewing brings in more money than hunting? That's a lot of bear viewers just to pay the same as one guided hunt.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  17. #17
    Member homerdave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    homer, alaska
    Posts
    3,922

    Default funding question

    there have been a number of proposals that would have a "viewing fee" or "wildlife stamp" thet would allow non-hunters to fund wildlife management. ultimately these proposals have all been shot down by organised hunting groups because they don't want non-hunters to have any say in management, and want to be able to play the "we pay for all management card".
    there are some other funds that come into play in katmai because it is federal, but generally speaking wildlife management funds come from hunting and fishing ... but non-hunters are willing to contribute of the means are made available.
    Alaska Board of Game 2015 tour... "Kicking the can down the road"
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters.org/

  18. #18
    Member bushrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Now residing in Fairbanks from the bush
    Posts
    4,363

    Default

    This is a problem on many levels. First, it's clear that we've got areas in the state now in which certain bear populations are habituated to the presence of humans. Is that a good thing overall for the bears? Probably not. But in areas where bears are habituated to humans, should we "hunt" them as shown in that video? Should we call that "hunting"? I saw no fear whatsoever from bears or humans in that video, and the hunters shown were very close to a number of bears. Then, a "bowhunter" sticks the bear some place (we can't see if it was a good shot or not) only to have the guide immediately follow up with two or three (?...it was buffering right then so I'm not sure of how many shots) rounds from a rifle to "really" kill the bear. So that's what bowhunting has become? Cuz it's legal it's okay?

    I agree that filming someone else hunting, and publishing their faces on the news/internet without their consent is plain wrong (it's also illegal) and I'd pursue any legal options against those who filmed and published this. According to the ADN article though, since the hunters were successful, the Troopers really couldn't explore the harrassment charge against the videographer. Also, long lenses and expensive camera equipment can get good shots from a long ways away, and we don't know how close the cameraman was. Another thing; on federal lands, usually one must have a permit to film any "commercial" video, so I'd like to know if the news station that was out there filming, as well as the privateer, had or was required to have a permit from Katmai to film (?). So yeah...explore those options.

    But still, we come back to the question: What will others think about "hunting" upon viewing this or reading about it? What will they think of these "hunters"? And what will they think when other hunters "defend" this?

    I won't defend it. No way. (and I predict many bowhunters will not like what they see either.) Bottom line is that the Board of Game has been pressured to allow hunting in the Preserve, and we now have a scene of what kind of "hunting" that is. It was a legal hunt, yes. Many of us are not happy with what we saw though. We need to make better long-term decisions on what we as a group advocate for that weigh the benefits to hunters against the risks to the tradition and future of hunting, as well as decisions that are best for the wildlife populations on the whole. This was a can of worms from the get go. Just like the push to open the Kamishak special use area to hunting was. It will come back to bite us.

  19. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by homerdave View Post
    there have been a number of proposals that would have a "viewing fee" or "wildlife stamp" thet would allow non-hunters to fund wildlife management. ultimately these proposals have all been shot down by organised hunting groups because they don't want non-hunters to have any say in management, and want to be able to play the "we pay for all management card".
    there are some other funds that come into play in katmai because it is federal, but generally speaking wildlife management funds come from hunting and fishing ... but non-hunters are willing to contribute of the means are made available.
    What specific groups have opposed user fees for non-hunters? How do you know non-hunters are willing to contribute if the means are made available? In my experience, they don't want to fund any management that includes hunting. Do you think this is why some oppose them having a large say in how wildlife is managed? A lot of conjecture stated as fact in your responses.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Valley trash.....and proud of it.
    Posts
    813

    Default

    Mark, what you stated goes back to ethics, since everybody has different ethics, how do you police that? I know alot of guys that do stuff that I wouldnt do just cuz its legal. I wont hunt with them cuz of my beliefs but they are following the law.

    I watched the video and it does like a chicken**** hunt but it is legal. I couldnt bring myself to do what this guy did.

    Dave, if the BOG didnt listen to the people or biologists, looks like a certain profession might have reared its ugly head again.

    Looks like another debate between ethics and legality (where there is no answer) has started up again.

Page 1 of 10 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •