Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 38

Thread: Kenai Bank Fishermen& Guide Boat Etiquette -- advice requested

  1. #1

    Default Kenai Bank Fishermen& Guide Boat Etiquette -- advice requested

    My wife and I were fishing the Kenai for reds earlier this week and witnessed some tension arise between a bank fisherman and guide boat captain. Looking for some advice of what the established rules are in this area.

    This is along the section that is 1/2 mile or so downstream and around the bend from the Russian river ferry landing on the Kenai. An area that guide boats frequently take their customers, a low-bank area easy for wading out several yards. This area probably has a name but we don't know it.

    We don't know when this particular bank fisherman arrived, but we are certain guide captain and his customers arrived first and had established themselves along this section before he arrived. A nice section of water that slows a bit, one that my wife and I would have fished had it been open when we arrived.

    At some point, some of the guide's customers got back into his driftboat to eat some food and perhaps rest. This left an opening that this bank fisherman decided to move into. Some words were exchanged were exchanged when he attempted this. The bank fisherman pulled up and left.

    My wife caught up with the bank fisherman when he was leaving. He claimed that he waited 10 minutes before assuming it was ok to fish there. When he tried to fish the opening the guide told him that it was his customer's spot and that he could only fish it until his customer was ready to fish again.

    It should be noted that the opening bank fisherman tried to occupy, was a more desirable spot than any other currently available along that stretch as much of that section was quite full with many anglers, and while the opening had more than enough room for a fisherman, it was also directly adjacent to the captain's guide boat that was anchored closer to shore.

    My wife and I are looking to buy a drift boat next season so we are wanting to know what the written/unwritten rules are for this. Not looking to start a bank fisherman vs guide boat war here, just wanting to know what has already been established as fair for all involved.

    thanks.

  2. #2
    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Aberdeen WA
    Posts
    4,786

    Default

    Communication is key. The intruding angler has nothing to lose by simply and politely asking.

    When that approach is taken, the response will be much more favorable.

    Just ask from the get-go
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    58

    Default

    Just out of respect to those who do not own a boat I will bypass those areas that are accessible by foot. There are plenty of areas to fish down river.
    By the way, rude guides are the norm for the Kenai.

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    2,559

    Default

    The guide doesn't own the river or the fishing spot in spite of what he may think. I would have kept right on fishing.
    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    612

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeRoss View Post
    The guide doesn't own the river or the fishing spot in spite of what he may think. I would have kept right on fishing.
    me too...………… Maybe say something like.
    - I politely waited till you were done and you should politely wait till I'm done

  6. #6

    Default

    Lotsa guide hating going on here! Big surprise!!!
    The real answer to your question is, forget that in the situation you describe that there is a guide and substitute yourself in the guides place as a private angler/boater. How would you feel if another angler took over your spot, while you were taking a break/leak/clean a fish/re-rig/etc? That is your answer as to how you should react in the same situation. I'm a big fan of first come, first serve, and that first person there gets the spot until they voluntarily give it up. And that is the "unspoken" rule where I come from.

  7. #7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan907 View Post
    Just out of respect to those who do not own a boat I will bypass those areas that are accessible by foot. There are plenty of areas to fish down river.
    By the way, rude guides are the norm for the Kenai.
    The OP never said a word about rude. But what is rude is to take someones spot. And dangerous. Flying hooks and sinkers like the one that knocked that girl out at the ferry yesterday. Can't blame someone for not wanting to combat fish with strangers...

    People walk all the way down past the end of the power line channel from the Ferry. Where are there plenty of areas to fish down river for the early run? Snagging holes? There are very very few consistent areas below that point that I know of. So where?

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    Communication is key. The intruding angler has nothing to lose by simply and politely asking.

    When that approach is taken, the response will be much more favorable.

    Just ask from the get-go
    What he said.

    Most conflict arises from someone not asking. You can’t just assume when people are sitting on the bank/boat they are through fishing. I often find when I ask if they are on a break, they’ll politely tell me I can fish there until they’re ready to go again.

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    2,559

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NorcalBob View Post
    Lotsa guide hating going on here! Big surprise!!!
    The real answer to your question is, forget that in the situation you describe that there is a guide and substitute yourself in the guides place as a private angler/boater. How would you feel if another angler took over your spot, while you were taking a break/leak/clean a fish/re-rig/etc? That is your answer as to how you should react in the same situation. I'm a big fan of first come, first serve, and that first person there gets the spot until they voluntarily give it up. And that is the "unspoken" rule where I come from.
    Back in the heydays on the Kasilof fishing for Kings at the mouth of Crooked Creek you would expect someone to be 'in your spot' when you got back from fighting and releasing one. I just crowded myself right back in and hooked another. One time I had 3 guys from Anchorage that were fishing near me. One fellow was pretty friendly and got some tips from my brother and I. The other 2 fellows were less friendly. We were hauling them in. Averaging a King to the bank and released every 10 minutes. Often times one cast, fish on. Anyway these guys crowded in more and more after each fish. It was actually kind of funny. Finally I come back and the 3 of them are shoulder to shoulder in my 'spot' and wouldn't give at all. I laughed and said I'll hook one from back here and flipped my Gooey Bobs out right over them. "Fish On" just like that. We all had a laugh. They didn't even have to get out of my way. I worked the King down towards the gravel bar and then laid into him. A couple runs across the river and had him to the bank. Pulled the needle nose plyers from the tool pocket n my jeans and twisted the hook loose and away he went. Fun times. I even shared some of my gear with those guys. But I have had other experiences there with people that just couldn't get along with anyone. I've seen fights down there. LOL. Shouting matches. Hey, fishing is supposed to be fun. If the people around you are friendly you or they might learn something and everyone has a good time. I sure handed my pole off to a lot of newbies down there after I set the hook. Big thrill for someone to get to fight their first King. If I hooked it and let them fight it, I always released it, since technically it was my fish. But they had fun and some learned to fish right next to me including tourists from other countries. Used to have a Father Son team from Austria that showed up every year. We were pen pals. (before the internet)
    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Big Lake
    Posts
    1,810

    Default

    I fail to see the difference between a boat fisherman or one who walks in. Kenai sockeye fishing IS combat fishing, whether at the Sanctuary or any other place where fish are accessable. As in any other instance where people are (basically) competing, you will see azzwholes and decent people. I don't really see any disrespect or attempt at intimidation. Maybe some, on the guide's part, but he was only trying to protect his client's "spot". And for that matter, what if the bank fisher, after hearing the guide, simply gave him the one finger salute and told him to go pound sand? My guess is that the result wouldn't have made the papers.

  11. #11
    Member Gr is for Greg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Anchorville
    Posts
    657

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    I fail to see the difference between a boat fisherman or one who walks in. Kenai sockeye fishing IS combat fishing, whether at the Sanctuary or any other place where fish are accessable. As in any other instance where people are (basically) competing, you will see azzwholes and decent people. I don't really see any disrespect or attempt at intimidation. Maybe some, on the guide's part, but he was only trying to protect his client's "spot". And for that matter, what if the bank fisher, after hearing the guide, simply gave him the one finger salute and told him to go pound sand? My guess is that the result wouldn't have made the papers.
    I'm with you, Gary. I am all for politeness and giving people space, but when it comes to the Russian River or surrounding area, the polite angler will simply never fish. It would be great if there were a system in which those who came first got as much room as they needed to fish until they voluntarily gave up their spot, at which time whoever has been patiently waiting the longest to fish got dibs on it. Honestly, I would love that. That isn't the way it works, though. I was at the Sanctuary last week, and there was a man standing behind the line of people fishing the run alongside the island. I asked him if he was fishing, and he said he was waiting. "For what?" I asked. "To fish! I've been waiting 3 hours." I walked up and down until I found a spot I could nose in (politely), fished for a couple hours, and eventually left. This poor guy was still waiting.

    I can tell you what I didn't see: an open spot on the river next to someone who was taking a break, and everyone respecting that because it was "their spot". It is combat fishing, and if there's room to fish, someone is going to fish there. You can get angry or upset, or you can just roll with it, even appreciate it for the pandemonious S-show that it is. It is frustrating when you step aside to land a fish and find someone in the spot where you had just been standing, but honestly, that's going to happen, so pack a little extra patience for that scenario when you go someplace like the RR this time of the year. Usually those types break off their leaders pretty quickly anyway, and once they do, step right up to their shoulder and tell them, "I'm just going to keep your spot hot while you retie." -Gr
    My signature is awesome.

  12. #12
    Member kwackkillncrew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    chugiak, ak
    Posts
    1,318

    Default

    there are plenty of spots to fish where there is less pressure...sure it might take some time and effort to get to them but its possible. I have 3-4 holes i fish on the russian and work my way up or down the river until i find one where there is an open spot to fish. went last friday found a spot with 2 people in the area with plenty of room. we all caught fish and left. If some one is there i dont wait for them to catch a fish and then take their spot especially when we both took the effort to move away from the crazies. I would expect the same from other people. I have had people come in and take my exact spot when there was plenty of hole to fish and told them that there is room for both of us and he should just slide down a little. It normally isnt an issue and the people who move in on your spot is generally a tourist who doesnt know better since they have expereinced the combat style stuff. If i walked down and saw a boat in the spot i wanted to fish i would just go down river a little bit especially when you are out of the combat zone.
    I will never be a "Prostaffer" its not that I am not good enough
    but its because I refuse to pimp products for free.

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    2,559

    Default

    At Crooked Creek combat fishing with my brother, I always fished upstream from him. He had a glass eye where his left eye should have been. People crowd each other. When they crowded my brother I waited until he vacated to fight a King and then eased over and told the cheechako, "I'd give that big fellow on your right plenty of room since he doesn't have a left eye." Worked every time.
    Guys would really crowd my young son perhaps thinking they had more right to the river than him. He fished better than most adults and caught tons of Kings there. Got his pic on the cover of a magazine with a 38 pounder he landed there. Anyway there was a guy kept putting his expensive rod right over the top of my kids. Just would not get in sync with everyone else. Well Jason with his club of a rod old Eagle Claw would just yell 'fish on' while yanking up on the rod to set the hook. Fish or no fish. Yeah Mr. fancy Lamiglass didn't care much for that but the problem took care of itself.
    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

  14. #14
    Member kwackkillncrew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    chugiak, ak
    Posts
    1,318

    Default

    yep there are easy ways to take care of things like that. My wife had some guy step with in 5 feet of her on her down stream side and she stopped fishing.I asked the guy if he could give her a little more room so she can finish her swing and he ignored me. i told her to just finish her drift and pull through. as she was and it only took getting her sinker and line wrapped around his waders once for him to decide to move on. The kicker was that she had about 50 feet between her and the next person down the river but we were in the hole he wanted to fish... he says "i caught them in this hole last night" insinuating that he had rights to it.... what ever dude should have beat us to the spot.
    I will never be a "Prostaffer" its not that I am not good enough
    but its because I refuse to pimp products for free.

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    2,559

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kwackkillncrew View Post
    "i caught them in this hole last night" insinuating that he had rights to it.... what ever dude should have beat us to the spot.
    The reason I liked to come back to the same spot at Crooked Creek is because I knew the structure there. Knew where the rocks were I didn't want to trip over. Knew the bottom and where I would feel it. Everything else was a hit and I would set the hook. Had just the right amount of weight for the current there. I could easily move to another spot and catch fish, but I knew this spot well.
    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    1,579

    Default

    So, wouldn’t a break be a voluntarily surrender of my spot? I mean, if I want to keep a spot, I pee in my waders and go hungry.

    Quote Originally Posted by NorcalBob View Post
    Lotsa guide hating going on here! Big surprise!!!
    The real answer to your question is, forget that in the situation you describe that there is a guide and substitute yourself in the guides place as a private angler/boater. How would you feel if another angler took over your spot, while you were taking a break/leak/clean a fish/re-rig/etc? That is your answer as to how you should react in the same situation. I'm a big fan of first come, first serve, and that first person there gets the spot until they voluntarily give it up. And that is the "unspoken" rule where I come from.

  17. #17

    Default

    <<<I mean, if I want to keep a spot, I pee in my waders>>>
    I almost always avoid the combat fishing sox gig. Not my thang. But, if I'm ever fishing next to you, I'm gonna make sure I'm upriver and upwind of you!!!!

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    856

    Default

    I guess the saying "all is fair in love and war" doesn't count for combat fishing? I don't combat fish so would never be presented with this scenario. As an outsider looking in, I would say if nobody was fishing in a public area then it seems like nobody was fishing in the aforementioned public area and it is open to the public, guide or no guide, I always thought it was madmax rules in combat fishing hence the name.
    “I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” Physicist ― Richard Feynman


  19. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    2,559

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NorcalBob View Post
    <<<I mean, if I want to keep a spot, I pee in my waders>>>
    I almost always avoid the combat fishing sox gig. Not my thang. But, if I'm ever fishing next to you, I'm gonna make sure I'm upriver and upwind of you!!!!
    When dipnetting on the beach in Kenai, I keep a gatoraide bottle in my waders. I aint leaving till I get my quota. That outhouse is too far away.
    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

  20. #20

    Default

    This isn't specific to Alaska, but in general when I'm boat fishing I try to give a lot of leeway to shore, wade or dock anglers. They have limited options and I can pull up and go many other places. Most likely that spot isn't the only one holding fish. I probably wouldn't even stop there with a boat if I knew people can walk to it easily.

    Now as for fishing, I try to give ample space for anyone that is fishing. And if you gotta unhook a fish, retie, take a quick leak, whatever done quickly the spot is still yours. Now if you stop to go have some lunch or sit down to take a break. I'll probably ask, but that is more of a courtesy. If you dont get up to start actively fishing again, and I'll probably move into that spot.

    Now as for guides, I've done it, been on trips and competed against some so I've seen all sides of the coin. As a guide, you are very visable and being a jerk will only hurt your business. Words and actions will follow you around, so a little thought to avoid those situations will pay dividends.

    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •