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Thread: The HANGBACK revisited...

  1. #541
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark knapp View Post
    I'm pretty sure I could demonstrate on all of the pictures that the Doc showed us (except one, I can't see clearly on that one) that a portion of the hook was inside the fishes mouth when it was hooked.
    I hate to parse words (sorry, I'm still laughing after having read what iof wrote about not parsing words, while parsing words) but it seems to me that you are trying to say that a hook was in, or could have maybe been in the mouth, that that is the same thing as being hooked in the mouth. I don't see how having a hook, or a portion of a hook, in the mouth is the same as being hooked in the mouth.
    "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

  2. #542

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    Quote Originally Posted by Funstastic View Post
    I would consider "punched in the mouth" an example of informal English. I understand statutes are written in formal English, so I would consider "in the mouth", formal English.
    Still Wrong. Here is a cut and paste from over a month ago...amazingly!

    • 09-30-2018
      extrema

      Definition of In

      1a—used as a function word to indicate inclusion, location, or position within limits i
      in
      the lake
      wounded in the leg
      in the summer

      b: INTO sense 1went in the house

      2—used as a function word to indicate means, medium, or instrumentality
      written in pencil
      bound in leather


      3a—used as a function word to indicate limitation, qualification, or circumstance alike in some respectsleft in a hurry
      b: INTO sense 2a
      broke in pieces


      4—used as a function word to indicate purpose
      said in reply


      5—used as a function word to indicate the larger member of a ratio
      one in six is eligible


      The term "in the mouth" uses the word "in" as a function word, not as an idiom.















    • 09-30-2018
      extrema



      Originally Posted by Funstastic

      "In the mouth" is ordinarily NOT understood to mean "on the mouth" or "outside the mouth" or "near the mouth". "In the mouth" ordinarily means inside, enclosed, or surrounded by the mouth, as defined by common English dictionaries.



      That is an idiom. Legislative language does not use idioms.



      "Beating a dead horse" is an idiom.
      "Hit in the mouth (arm, stomach, nose, etc.)" is not an idiom. It is legitimate phraseology readily understood, apparently, on both sides of the pond:
      https://forum.thefreedictionary.com/...e-stomach.aspx


  3. #543
    Member 4merguide's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by extrema View Post
    Still Wrong. Here is a cut and paste from over a month ago...amazingly!09-30-201
    b: INTO sense 1went in the house

    And I'd be willing to guess that most folks grab (hook) the doorknob to get "in" the house?
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

  4. #544
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwackkillncrew View Post
    According to fish and game it’s not snagging. The beach in Seward is where you snag


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    If thinking flipping isn’t snagging helps people sleep at night carry on.
    I personally flip for reds and have for years, but I am not deluding myself into thinking it’s fair chase or sports fishing, it’s putting tasty fish in the freezer.
    Snagging in Seward is quite a way to put fish away also.

  5. #545
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4merguide View Post
    I understand, you understand, and probably MOST here understand as well, but tell it to F&G as they obviously don't think it's snagging, or tens of thousands of people would be getting ticketed on a yearly basis.

    Again, as told by another LEO

    Then I asked "if the lips are part of the mouth and the hook was hooked on the outside of the lips, is that "in the mouth"? He said "Sir I can't narrow it down anymore for you, if its in the back, if it's in the tail, in the eye or in the gills under the head it's not in the mouth. The wildlife trooper at the seen will have the discretion. I personally would not site someone if the hook was in the lips on the outside of the mouth, but if I see someone ripping a hook through the water intentionally trying to snag a fish and it snags the fish anywhere than inside the mouth they are probably going to get sited."

    Believe me, I don't even like it when I see people practicing the Kenai rip at the end of their drift, because that, to me, is a form of snagging. But F&G must believe that just letting your hook drift downriver and into the mouth of a fish is an acceptable method of "fishing" and NOT snagging. Flossing does not show literal intention to snag a fish elsewhere than the mouth, which, of course, is what constitutes snagging.
    A fish hooked anywhere other than the mouth is not snagged, it is foul hooked.
    A snag is a accidental hook up with a projection.
    So if your a fish swimming along get a line in your mouth and then a projection hooks you, you have been snagged “in the mouth”.
    Your a fish attempting to eat something thats tasty looking and you get hooked and eaten thats life, cause there is always a bigger fish.

  6. #546
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patsfan54 View Post
    I hate to parse words (sorry, I'm still laughing after having read what iof wrote about not parsing words, while parsing words) but it seems to me that you are trying to say that a hook was in, or could have maybe been in the mouth, that that is the same thing as being hooked in the mouth. I don't see how having a hook, or a portion of a hook, in the mouth is the same as being hooked in the mouth.
    Because, a mouth is a piece of anatomy not just a vessel. If I can get punched "in the mouth" without the fist being "inside my mouth" then a fish can be hooked "in the mouth" without the hook actually being inside of the mouth. A fish can be hooked in the eye, the tail or the back and only a portion of the hook is in the eye, tail or back. The hook is never "inside" the eye, tail or back, and it sure didn't hook it from the inside out. The same is true for the mouth. I fish can be hooked in the mouth without the hook being "inside the mouth".

    With that, it seems we have come to an impasse. I can't state my position any clearer than I have. Unless something new comes up I will leave it to you guys. You are certainly free to do as you wish, I will do the same.

    I wish you all well.

  7. #547
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    Quote Originally Posted by Funstastic View Post
    You're not qualified to know what's easily understood and demonstrated in court, especially if you think a dentary is a dentury and a hyoid is a hoid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Patsfan54 View Post
    It's all about knowing salmon anatomy, you know like how fish have leeps and mooths!
    We have all written with spelling errors. To me when someone attacks another person for his spelling errors it only means they are having trouble finding fault in what he said and resort to attacking him for how he said it. You guys are better than that.

    We have again reached an impasse, I can't state my positions any clearer than I have, I will (again) leave it to you guys.

    Have fun, I wish you the best. You guys fish the way you want and I will do the same. I'm glad we don't fish together, it seems like it would get noisy.

    The best, Mark

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    Quote Originally Posted by mark knapp View Post
    Have fun, I wish you the best. You guys fish the way you want and I will do the same. I'm glad we don't fish together, it seems like it would get noisy.

    The best, Mark
    I fish in the salt, too many people on the land. That and the crazy rules like no snagging and snagging only if you snag correctly in the mouth. Radio blasting and talking loudly doesn't hurt fishing when the fish are that deep! Thanks for the conversation Mark, wish more people could disagree in an agreeable manner.
    "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

  10. #550
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patsfan54 View Post
    I fish in the salt, too many people on the land. That and the crazy rules like no snagging and snagging only if you snag correctly in the mouth. Radio blasting and talking loudly doesn't hurt fishing when the fish are that deep! Thanks for the conversation Mark, wish more people could disagree in an agreeable manner.
    He'll be back, it's to hard to resist the click bait! Lol

  11. #551
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenaibow fan View Post
    He'll be back, it's to hard to resist the click bait! Lol
    I will not.

  12. #552
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark knapp View Post
    You guys are better than that.
    We'll have to agree to disagree on that point.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
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  13. #553
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark knapp View Post
    We have all written with spelling errors. To me when someone attacks another person for his spelling errors it only means they are having trouble finding fault in what he said and resort to attacking him for how he said it. You guys are better than that.
    You see Mark, it goes much deeper than spelling errors. Anatomy is a very detailed and very specific science, one that if a person is knowledgeable of they would not make multiple errors multiple times with such simplistic spelling. When a person represents themselves as a person who knows everything but makes such simple spelling mistakes, it illustrates the fact that they are full of it.

    You are a new contributor here, as I was once not long ago, you will suss it all out on your own. Some people try to engage in conversations, others...well not so much. I have found plenty of fault in much of what has been said throughout this entire thread, spelling is the least of it. Speaking for myself, I was trying to inject a moment of levity when I purposely misspelled leeps and mooths. Dealing with snarky comments like the one before this, might help you understand why levity helps. Please don't let that keep you from posting here.
    "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

  14. #554
    Member redleader's Avatar
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    I fully support Doc in his efforts in technics that help avoid mortally wounding by hooking from outside in and see it as useful where size limits or wild fish must be released.
    Redleader standing by

  15. #555
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    He has had to have “caught” a few in the eyeball. There’s no way he hasn’t. If the hook goes through the eye and into the mouth does that count?


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  16. #556
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    Imagine a person fishing in Alexander Creek - trying to catch northern pike by sporting means. Pike comes out of the water to strike a topwater lure, but misses and hooks itself in the head, fin, tail, etc. Sadly, this fish is not legally hooked and must be released, even though it was a willful biter. But wait, it mustn't be released alive. The foul-hooked pike must be returned to the water dead.

  17. #557
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    Quote Originally Posted by FairbanksFlies View Post
    Imagine a person fishing in Alexander Creek - trying to catch northern pike by sporting means. Pike comes out of the water to strike a topwater lure, but misses and hooks itself in the head, fin, tail, etc. Sadly, this fish is not legally hooked and must be released, even though it was a willful biter. But wait, it mustn't be released alive. The foul-hooked pike must be returned to the water dead.
    I think there are several reasons for this. First, Pike in Alexander are an invasive species that ADFG is trying to eradicate - thus no catch limits and the regulation of no live fish can be released back into the water. Second, there are many sport fisherman that want a Pike sport fishery, so now legally hooked fish and sport fishing regs come into play. Then we have the major reason - there are other species like King Salmon in the same waters that would be negatively effected if ADFG made snagging Pike legal - every snagged Pike could simply be called a "willful biter", and every hook that finds a King could simply be justified as trying to snag one of those Pike. Bottom line, making an exception for your scenario really opens up a can of worms, mainly for protecting Kings as Alexander Creek Kings are listed as a Stock of Management Concern.

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