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Thread: TSX Hunting load

  1. #1

    Default TSX Hunting load

    I decided to develop a new 257WBY load and since it is not for targets but for hunting, I wanted to be able to take longer shots with a flat trajectory. So for the last three days I have been working up loads. I decided that I would take any group with my 100gr TSX under a 1/2" as long as I was over 3690fps. I thought it would be great if I could be some where over 3700fps but was not sure that I could get there and be under an 1/2". I used IMR4350, IMR7828, RL-22, RL-25, and Norma MRP. Now I had high expectation for IMR7828, RL-25 and RL-22. I also knew that I could not get velocity out of the IMR4350 but tried it anyway. Now I was able to get under a 1/2" out of all of the powders except MRP but these groups were in the 3645-3674fps range except IMR4350 which was a lot slower. So I loaded hotter charges still with no over max pressure signs as I measure the base of the case and the extreme expansion was .004". Well everything seemed to fall apart and RL-22, RL-25, IMR7828 and IMR4350 accuracy was over an inch and one group over 2 inches. I did not have any confidence in MRP as far as accuracy because in all the years I have used it, I have found that only about 10% of the time does it give me the accuracy I want, but also I knew that MRP would give me high velocities as it does all most all the time. Well, I was surprised to say the least. MRP gave under a half-inch and did it at and average of 3712fps for the three shots with a deviation of only 8fps. I think it could have even been better but I was shooting another rifle to allow my 257WBY between groups to cool. I was shooting a group of 240gr Woodliegh bullets getting 2721fps with the best group being 1 1/4" out of my 30-06 Ackley Imp just before I shot the .458" group using MRP. I am using a 6-18x40mm Buckmaster SF BDC.




    OAL was 3.171"

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  2. #2

    Default

    I am excited about this load. If I sight 2" high at 100yds I am dead on at 300yds and -5" at 380yds. If I sight it 3" high at 100yds I am dead on at 360yds -5" at 425yds and -10" at 475 and -14" at 506yds. So center hold with 3" high at 100yds lets me kill deer size out to 475 and at 480yds hold on top shoulders and kill deer size out to 550 of course if there is little wind. If I use my BDC which I will be testing it soon, I sight in .75" high at 100yds dead on at 200yds and at 300yds use my first circle and so on out to 600yds. What is so cool is the Energy
    0 3059
    100 2635
    200 2267
    300 1944
    400 1662
    500 1413
    600 1195
    Still over 1000 pounds at 600 yds for a .25 cal. Just to cool
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
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  3. #3
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    Default

    Beartooth, I was wondering if you mis-typed a decimal point with your case head expansion of .004. Most would consider a value of .004 to be an extremely high pressure load. Usually around .0005 is considered max.

    My perferred load for the 100TSX is H1000. It performs very well and I chose it over the others for its temperature tolerance. I hunt different places and I don't have to worry so much about duplicating the temperature conditions. In august I'll use it for high elevation Ibex in Mongolia and mid sept for antelope in southern New Mexico. Last year it was coues in sonora and goat in Alaska.

    With my load I am averaging around 3596fps and .00085 head expansion. I think this is overdoing it a bit but then again it is only barrel and cartridge life. In working it up I took it to 3763 but I had expansion around .0018 and knew this was too much. With head expansion at this level the primer pocket will expand even more than this value and this exceeds the fit tolerance for primers, the new primers will be loose. I had a mis-fire in Argentina and found it to be a missing primer. I threw away the whole box of brass when I got home. I knew they were loose going in but being cheap I risked it anyway.

    I'd check with Barnes to see if they have ever experienced safe pressures over 3700fps with a TSX. This is attainable with XLCs but they just fly faster with less pressure.

    I check my barrel with a borescope occasionally and the 257Wby has significantly more checking and erosion wear than my standard velocity rifles. The worst is my 300 Ultra.

  4. #4

    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed M View Post
    Beartooth, I was wondering if you mis-typed a decimal point with your case head expansion of .004. Most would consider a value of .004 to be an extremely high pressure load. Usually around .0005 is considered max.

    My perferred load for the 100TSX is H1000. It performs very well and I chose it over the others for its temperature tolerance. I hunt different places and I don't have to worry so much about duplicating the temperature conditions. In august I'll use it for high elevation Ibex in Mongolia and mid sept for antelope in southern New Mexico. Last year it was coues in sonora and goat in Alaska.

    With my load I am averaging around 3596fps and .00085 head expansion. I think this is overdoing it a bit but then again it is only barrel and cartridge life. In working it up I took it to 3763 but I had expansion around .0018 and knew this was too much. With head expansion at this level the primer pocket will expand even more than this value and this exceeds the fit tolerance for primers, the new primers will be loose. I had a mis-fire in Argentina and found it to be a missing primer. I threw away the whole box of brass when I got home. I knew they were loose going in but being cheap I risked it anyway.

    I'd check with Barnes to see if they have ever experienced safe pressures over 3700fps with a TSX. This is attainable with XLCs but they just fly faster with less pressure.

    I check my barrel with a borescope occasionally and the 257Wby has significantly more checking and erosion wear than my standard velocity rifles. The worst is my 300 Ultra.
    Yes I miss a decimal point - sorry, thanks man.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
    THE MIND OF A SCHOLAR
    THE HEART OF A CHILD
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  5. #5

    Default

    What kind of expansion are you getting with the TSX at long range as velocity drops?

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBear View Post
    What kind of expansion are you getting with the TSX at long range as velocity drops?
    Still have over 2500fps at 500 and over 2300fps at 600. I have only hit with this bullet at 426yds, and it was a heart lung shot and pass all the way through tearing the heart up and taking it out the other side. Being well over 1800fps I am sure it will open up. I hope this fall I will find out since there is a chance for a long shot.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
    THE MIND OF A SCHOLAR
    THE HEART OF A CHILD
    THE HIDE OF A RHINOCEROS

  7. #7

    Default 30-06 Ackley velocity

    The weatherby stuff is fascinating but that 240 grain woodleigh at 2721 from a 30-06 AI seems awfully fast. No insult intended but that must be way over pressure or have I missed something?

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 35gibber View Post
    The weatherby stuff is fascinating but that 240 grain woodleigh at 2721 from a 30-06 AI seems awfully fast. No insult intended but that must be way over pressure or have I missed something?
    no you did not miss anything, I did not type the right fps, it is 2617fps and yes it is a stiff load but only .0003 expansion on base. Sorry for the miss print I have really been pushed with job and at the same time trying to shoot. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
    THE MIND OF A SCHOLAR
    THE HEART OF A CHILD
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  9. #9
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    Default

    Beartooth,

    It's easy to see your enthusiasm for this hobby and I'm like you I enjoy the experiments and testing also. But I've got to agree with 35Gibber, the velocity you list for the 240 grain from the 30-06 AI is off any charts I've ever seen. I have loaded for the 30-06 and the various 30-06 Improved for some time. I've loaded for a 30-06 AI since 1978. I have loaded thousands of rounds for that caliber and I will say I have more experience with AI calibers than anyone except Parker himself. I have not loaded the Woodleigh but I've loaded 240 grains of other manufacturers and I have notes of loads that approach 2600 fps that say excessive pressure signs, and this from a 25" barrel. Not to question anything but your chronograph but a close check or reshoot may be in order here. For a two foot screen spacing one inch short can give 5% velocity error.

    RL-22 has been the best powder for me with 200 grains and up for the '06AI, with RL-25 a close second. RL-22 and Norma MRP are now the same powder from the same mill and MRP-2 is RL-25. Any variation in them is just lot to lot variation which is usually very small. Both are excellent powders and well suited for the heavy loads in the '06AI. What is your load for this 240 grain @ 2721 fps?
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  10. #10
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by beartooth View Post
    no you did not miss anything, I did not type the right fps, it is 2617fps and yes it is a stiff load but only .0003 expansion on base. Sorry for the miss print I have really been pushed with job and at the same time trying to shoot. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.

    OK. Belay my last. Yeah it's easy to do.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    OK. Belay my last. Yeah it's easy to do.
    I know I am pushing the limits with the IMR4350 the load vel. is 2548-2617fps. I know I am on the edge and what powders do you suggest to lower my pressurers and still get around or above 2500fps. I am thinking, RL-25 and possible MRP. Got any Ideas??? Buy the way my chrono I checked buy using a friend who was with me at the range and we were with in 6fps of each other. Thanks for any impute.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
    THE MIND OF A SCHOLAR
    THE HEART OF A CHILD
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  12. #12

    Default

    Out of my Kimber 30-06 I was able to move the 240gr with max loads to 2381fps using IMR4350 but I did not use a stiff load I only used a max load. I really think I need to shoot for accuracy and not for top end but really would like the top end to be accurate. Any suggestions or comments would really be appreciated. I really don't want this to be to involved, time is short before hunting season and range time is limited for me. Might try MRP also.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
    THE MIND OF A SCHOLAR
    THE HEART OF A CHILD
    THE HIDE OF A RHINOCEROS

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