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Thread: Is the Kultina Lake Road about to be closed?

  1. #1
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    Default Is the Kultina Lake Road about to be closed?

    I just read this on another forum and I am not sure if it is light of BS..It appears that the Walker Administration is is the process of turning over the Kultina Lake access road to Ahtna???





    There is a huge push by Ahtna to Co-Manage all of unit 13, some of 12 and 11. If this is true that is a nasty idea...


    Link:http://mustreadalaska.com/walker-rol...shing-grounds/


    Quotes:

    The Walker Administration is negotiating behind closed doors to cut off public access to one of the most popular and unique fishing, hunting and recreation resources in Alaska, the Klutina Lake area.

    It is a move that is sure to dismay tens of thousands of Alaskans for whom the area is a deeply important part of their outdoor traditions.

    The Klutina Road on the north side of the Richardson Highway runs from near Copper Center to the Klutina Lake area, and uses an historic easement across land owned by Ahtna, Inc.

    Itís a road used since Statehood to access salmon country. Thousands upon thousands of Alaskans have traveled to the shores of Klutina Lake, and brought home mill


    Ahtna wants to downgrade the right-of-way designation from RS-2477 to a lesser 17-B, which would greatly diminish access for Alaskans. A 100-foot right of way would become a 50-foot right of way.

    Drivers could not park, camp, or launch boats in the river. In other words, the State government, which has fought for RS-2477 standards for years and has called the area the textbook case of RS-2477 law, is downgrading the publicís access from a gold standard to tin.



    Walt

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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    For the last few decades, the Brenwick Craig "Road" to Klutina Lake has been administered as a 60 foot wide 17(b) type easement. I know it has been renegotiated several times, the last being a few years back after a stretch of land the easement crossed slid into the river. I guess there is also allegedly a 2477 Right-of Way which the State has been defending/attempting to re-legitimize for many years, and that has been the point of contention. Don't know what the current status of that is, but Ahtna's position has always been to dispute the legitimacy of that alleged 2477 ROW. The article referenced implies that Ahtna wants to "downgrade" to a 17(b) easement, but that isn't really accurate, since the easement is currently administered as a 17(b) easement. So, if the State were to vacate the alleged overlaying 2477 ROW as the article alleges they might, it wouldn't really change anything in practical terms of on the ground access from what currently exists, tho, it would limit future "upgrading" of access under the auspice of a 2477 ROW.
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    I am not sure if that is how I read it.....

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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gulkana Rafting View Post
    I am not sure if that is how I read it.....
    What I wrote wasn't an interpretation of the "mustread" article, which I don't give much credibility. I just gave my understanding, fwiw, of the actual on the ground situation.
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    Member c6 batmobile's Avatar
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    Either way you cut it there can be implications on the access of the land. If its down graded or simply not "upgraded" it sets a precedent that will likely not be reversed. I will give them further grounds to put additional limitations on access to a resource that should be usable by all Alaskans.
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    The state senate has taken notice.....
    http://mustreadalaska.com/senators-lindemuth-fight-win/

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    Thumbs down

    Looks like Walker has his attorney negotiating away our access rights in exchange for a probable campaign contribution from Ahtna for his re-election. Until Lindemuth starts "acting" like our Attorney General, she should never be confirmed beyond the position of "Acting" Attorney General. Or better yet, send her back into private practice. I'm sure that she'd be able to land a cushy job with a native corporation for her current efforts on their behalf.
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    Member c6 batmobile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BluNosDav View Post
    Looks like Walker has his attorney negotiating away our access rights in exchange for a probable campaign contribution from Ahtna for his re-election. Until Lindemuth starts "acting" like our Attorney General, she should never be confirmed beyond the position of "Acting" Attorney General. Or better yet, send her back into private practice. I'm sure that she'd be able to land a cushy job with a native corporation for her current efforts on their behalf.
    Who in their right mind would want Walker back for another term?
    Makin fur fins and feathers fly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    For the last few decades, the Brenwick Craig "Road" to Klutina Lake has been administered as a 60 foot wide 17(b) type easement. I know it has been renegotiated several times, the last being a few years back after a stretch of land the easement crossed slid into the river. I guess there is also allegedly a 2477 Right-of Way which the State has been defending/attempting to re-legitimize for many years, and that has been the point of contention. Don't know what the current status of that is, but Ahtna's position has always been to dispute the legitimacy of that alleged 2477 ROW. The article referenced implies that Ahtna wants to "downgrade" to a 17(b) easement, but that isn't really accurate, since the easement is currently administered as a 17(b) easement. So, if the State were to vacate the alleged overlaying 2477 ROW as the article alleges they might, it wouldn't really change anything in practical terms of on the ground access from what currently exists, tho, it would limit future "upgrading" of access under the auspice of a 2477 ROW.

    The RS2477 is there whether AHTNA believes so or not. It is my understanding that 17(b) easements are 100 foot wide, and that AHTNA is pushing for a 50 foot easement. This is apparently where the governor is going to fold, thus setting a precedent for future 17(b)'s. A 100 foot wide easement on the Klutina Lake road would continue to allow boats to be launched and access would not be affected, but, with a 50 foot wide easement, there wouldn't be public access to the river/lake.
    "The North wind is cold no matter what direction it's blowing"

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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannerAK View Post
    It is my understanding that 17(b) easements are 100 foot wide, and that AHTNA is pushing for a 50 foot easement.
    60' for roads, as is this case in question: https://www.blm.gov/ak/st/en/prog/la...easements.html
    Ahtna's position against 2477 ROW spelled out here: http://www.nativefederation.org/wp-c..._Klutina-2.pdf
    SOA's position spelled out here: http://law.alaska.gov/pdf/opinions/o..._665010201.pdf
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
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    Member fshgde's Avatar
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    It's easy to email the governor on this from state of a.m. homepage. I just did this as I feel access would be severely limited if Ahtna gets its way.

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    Email the Governor, I just did. We all need to.
    https://gov.alaska.gov/contact/email-the-governor/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Predator Control View Post
    Email the Governor, I just did. We all need to.
    https://gov.alaska.gov/contact/email-the-governor/

    LOL - you really think he cares what any of us thinks? I think he has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that he does not. He knows that is best for us all, and he is going to ram it through no matter what we say.

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    If you don't let your opinion be known it's only ahtna that is talking, and that is not good for access. Now if ahtna wants to develop campgrounds parking area on their land and charge that's great for them. But don't force me to pay to travel a right of way .

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    If you remember back in the late 90's Ahtna closed down the road, put up a toll booth and refused access for the state to clear a slide off of the road. This is an ongoing effort to make public water inaccessible to the average user. We do not put our rentals on the Klutina because I have to assume all of my renters have 0 rafting skills and the Klutina requires a certain level of skill that most do not have. I raft it 3-4 times each summer just for fun, love it and lots of fun!

    The folks I feel for are the land owners on the lake. If there are restrictions on what can go up that road or if anyone can use it those poor suckers are in a world of hurt! I have been looking at a cabin on the lake but there is no chance I am willing to buy till this is settled.

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    if it smell's like a rat no matter what you call it , it will be a rat, no matter what you call it, stick up for your rights now,
    not after it is closed, hard to change a rule after it is in place , my 2 cts SID

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    Gulkana, I too would be saddened if we can't access that crazy road. One of my greatest memories, was pushing a 4wd canoe rig to it's limits on that road after heavy rains. 4 hours later, we arrived at the lake during sunset in September, a golden landscape so beautiful that I lack words to describe the breath-taking scenery, overlooking a lake that was longer than the road we traveled.

    I don't think I've ever seen a prettier place. There's not one day that goes by, that I don't think about that place. Electronic locking differentials and a snorkel, next time I attempt it with a 22 Alaskan Freighter Canoe atop.

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