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Thread: Mouth of the Russian River

  1. #1
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    Default Mouth of the Russian River

    We were fishing the Russian this weekend and the # of fish in the Russian river was very low. We walked down to the confluence and there were people shoulder to shoulder across the mouth of the river. They were the only people hooking fish, I would say catching but they were so close together nobody would move when someone got a fish on. No wonder there are no fish in the river. We need to get some type of regulation that keeps people from plugging that river. If the all stayed on the edge of the river everyone would catch more fish. 1 guy steps out 1 foot, the next 3, then 5 ....

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    Default Agree

    Blocking the river mouth is just stupid. There ought to be a law.

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    Member alaskachuck's Avatar
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    I have been watching clowns stand accross the mouth of the russian since 1978. Why the dont ban it, it beyond me. I was there all weekend myself as as i worked down the river from red salmon on saturday I saw maybe 50 reds total. Caught alot of nice bows though. Made it to the mouth (circus) and saw it blocked off and went towards the ferry about 200 yards below the mouth. Fish was slow caught 2 but very few fish caught except at the border crossing (aka mouth blockers) It was so thick with people it was hard to cross the river. Nice day chasing bows but it should be 100 bucks everytime someone blocks the mouth
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    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    Isn't harrassing fish illegal? I'd think impeding them from going upstream would count as harrassing. Meanwhile the troopers are writing speeding tickets and the USFS rangers are yelling at people for stringer violations
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

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    Moderator Daveinthebush's Avatar
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    Default What

    Quote Originally Posted by ak_powder_monkey View Post
    Isn't harrassing fish illegal? I'd think impeding them from going upstream would count as harrassing.
    And yanking them out of the stream by their lips isn't harassment? Just wondering.

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    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daveinthebush View Post
    And yanking them out of the stream by their lips isn't harassment? Just wondering.
    No thats sport fishing
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by ak_powder_monkey View Post
    Isn't harrassing fish illegal? I'd think impeding them from going upstream would count as harrassing. Meanwhile the troopers are writing speeding tickets and the USFS rangers are yelling at people for stringer violations
    How is a person standing in a stream impeding fish passage? Its the sum of all the anglers that may discourage fish from moving up, but to write a citation to each person is rediculous and would never stand up in court. Looking at the weir counts, it appears that fish are managing to get by the crowd at the mouth. It's not a biological issue, just a social issue between people who like to fish the clear waters and those who prefer to remain at the confluence. Flooding the clear waters with fish to make for good fishing there probably wouldn't help harvesting more fish. Early-run fish are different from late-run fish in that they hold in the sanctuary area before moving into the clear waters. If the escapement is doing fine, then the sanctuary is the best place to increase the harvest and help stay within the escapement goal.

    You could also end up a habitat issue if the masses moved into the clear waters.

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    Member AKBighorn's Avatar
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    So if they were to recieve a citation then anyone that stands in any river should also recieve one. Because multiple people are there standing close to each other combat fishing and that doesn't suit your taste then it should be illegal. Come on. I don't fish the Russian anymore because of all the people but just because you don't care for what someone else is doing doesn't mean they need a ticket. You guys crack me up.

    If you can't beat them you may as well join them After all, they are the ones catching all the fish.

  9. #9
    Member SoggyMountain's Avatar
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    I don't think you'll stop folks, but you might see if the river management would post a few reminders for people about general conduct. Not ticketable stuff, that's addressed in the regs. Just items for consideration.

    These suggestions could be posted on both sides of the ferry landings, and at or around the restrooms in the parking lots. Similar to "dispose of your fish in deep running water." Yes, there will be folks who turn a blind eye, but there are plenty of people like myself that understand, agree, and maybe just didn't think about it in the first place.

    Note to fishermen: "Crowding the mouth of the stream inhibits the nature of the fish, keeps others from enjoying basic opportunity, and ultimately makes you look like a stingy monger." Please use consideration when choosing your ground."

    I'd respond to something like that.

  10. #10

    Default

    It is pretty pathetic...I haven`t even fished it since 82 due to the lame crowds. There are easy reds in other locals but everyone has to flock to the mouth between runs...sad. I have virtually stopped fishing for salmon just because of the amounts of people everywhere...now I just fly-out or wheel-in to locations where noone would normally bother to go. Costs more to be a life-long resident than it does to be a tourist.

  11. #11

    Default Fish are making it just fine

    I fished the river yesterday, and I have to say, the fish win.
    They are making it up just fine, people are getting some all the way up, and I saw fish in every hole. People are shoulder to shoulder, but when the bite is on they are having fun. Be happy, if the mob wasn't there maybe they would move into your secret hole!

    I have a question though. I walked all the way up to the falls and there were tons and tons of fresh carcasses. (more than it would seem people were catching). Didn't they legally allow netting by a particular tribe at the falls this year? Could this be what it was, or were people just catching more fish than I was witnessing?
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  12. #12
    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akkona View Post
    How is a person standing in a stream impeding fish passage? Its the sum of all the anglers that may discourage fish from moving up, but to write a citation to each person is rediculous and would never stand up in court. Looking at the weir counts, it appears that fish are managing to get by the crowd at the mouth. It's not a biological issue, just a social issue between people who like to fish the clear waters and those who prefer to remain at the confluence. Flooding the clear waters with fish to make for good fishing there probably wouldn't help harvesting more fish. Early-run fish are different from late-run fish in that they hold in the sanctuary area before moving into the clear waters. If the escapement is doing fine, then the sanctuary is the best place to increase the harvest and help stay within the escapement goal.

    You could also end up a habitat issue if the masses moved into the clear waters.
    Chasing them back to the bottom of a hole would be harassment, standing there wouldn't.

    I think above the sanctuary should be fly fishing only where fly fishing only actually means fly fishing (line propells the fly) let the masses have the mouth
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

  13. #13

    Default You are a bait fisherman Powder Monkey!

    Quote Originally Posted by ak_powder_monkey View Post
    Chasing them back to the bottom of a hole would be harassment, standing there wouldn't.

    I think above the sanctuary should be fly fishing only where fly fishing only actually means fly fishing (line propells the fly) let the masses have the mouth
    You are a bait fisherman as are all fly-fishermen.

    Definitions of bait on the Web:


    ...anything that serves as an enticement
    lure, entice, or entrap with bait
    something used to lure victims into danger ...

    I would say that fly-fishermen are more bait fishermen than people using vibraxes.

    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

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    Quote Originally Posted by akkona View Post
    How is a person standing in a stream impeding fish passage? Its the sum of all the anglers that may discourage fish from moving up, but to write a citation to each person is rediculous and would never stand up in court. Looking at the weir counts, it appears that fish are managing to get by the crowd at the mouth. It's not a biological issue, just a social issue between people who like to fish the clear waters and those who prefer to remain at the confluence. Flooding the clear waters with fish to make for good fishing there probably wouldn't help harvesting more fish. Early-run fish are different from late-run fish in that they hold in the sanctuary area before moving into the clear waters. If the escapement is doing fine, then the sanctuary is the best place to increase the harvest and help stay within the escapement goal.

    You could also end up a habitat issue if the masses moved into the clear waters.
    Please enlighten the readers of this post by explaining some of your background and education concerning the harvest of Russian River Sockeye salmon.

  15. #15
    Member akpredator's Avatar
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    They should just close the mouth of the russian like they close the sanctuary except just leave the mouth closed
    LOVE MY LITTLE SKULL CLEANERS

  16. #16

    Default Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by akpredator View Post
    They should just close the mouth of the russian like they close the sanctuary except just leave the mouth closed
    Honestly, why?
    The fish are going up just fine, and the bank-maggots have been covering the mouth for weeks. Last year that was true and numbers going through the counter were HUGE! What's the problem? You guys think you can stop the fish without a huge net? Try it! You can't stop them, the fish win, end of story.
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  17. #17
    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Default Over Regulated

    I was down there this past weekend and Monday. It had been 15 years since my last visit and probability is going to be another 15 before I go back. Talk about rude inpatient people!

    I have actually seen fish swim up the Russian behind fisherman as they are trying to choke them off.

    The best place I fished was just off the cleaning tables upriver from the ferry. We took 17 fish out of there Monday, but it took ALL day. We waited (patiently) for 4 hours for the spot to open up, so later when these outsiders attempted to muscle their way in, we were not very forgiving. The fish tend to hold up there before the final mad dash to the Russian and beyond.

    I am glad I got my boat back. Besides all the people, rude behavior, and stuff I started to get upset at the USFWS harassing everyone. Between yelling at you because your bags and gear is on their restoration fence to the law enforcement guy making us pull out all our gear out of our vehicle to check to see how many fish we had, they can keep that piece of sh*edited* hole. It ain't worth it anymore.

    Here are a few questions:

    1. What is the legal definition of high water line?

    2. Does the USFWS have jurisdiction BELOW the high water line?

    3. Does the USFWS have jurisdiction to cite you or legally check your limit when your fish are pulled out of a navigable waterway?

    It has always been my opinion that the Feds do NOT have jurisdiction over state land. A navigable water way and its high water marks are state land.

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  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKBassking View Post
    I was down there this past weekend and Monday. It had been 15 years since my last visit and probability is going to be another 15 before I go back. Talk about rude inpatient people!

    I have actually seen fish swim up the Russian behind fisherman as they are trying to choke them off.

    The best place I fished was just off the cleaning tables upriver from the ferry. We took 17 fish out of there Monday, but it took ALL day. We waited (patiently) for 4 hours for the spot to open up, so later when these outsiders attempted to muscle their way in, we were not very forgiving. The fish tend to hold up there before the final mad dash to the Russian and beyond.

    I am glad I got my boat back. Besides all the people, rude behavior, and stuff I started to get upset at the USFWS harassing everyone. Between yelling at you because your bags and gear is on their restoration fence to the law enforcement guy making us pull out all our gear out of our vehicle to check to see how many fish we had, they can keep that piece of sh*edited* hole. It ain't worth it anymore.

    Here are a few questions:

    1. What is the legal definition of high water line?

    2. Does the USFWS have jurisdiction BELOW the high water line?

    3. Does the USFWS have jurisdiction to cite you or legally check your limit when your fish are pulled out of a navigable waterway?

    It has always been my opinion that the Feds do NOT have jurisdiction over state land. A navigable water way and its high water marks are state land.
    That sucks man, too bad you had that much trouble.
    I was always afraid to go there because of stories like yours, and as I drifted by in the drift boat I couldn't believe my eyes, but last year was my first time, and I have had fun every time since, and everyone I have brought there has had a good time. Last night was no exception, we caught fish, saw bears, met some cool people. Enjoyed it completely. It's too bad the fish cops and aggressive crowders had to try and ruin your trip.
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

  19. #19
    Member stewjacobson's Avatar
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    Good morning, All,
    Long time reader, but newbie poster. My cousin (from FLA) and I (from AZ) have fished the Kenai for kings, reds, silvers, bows on three trips since 2002 and will be back in 2 weeks (heart pounding starting).
    We have also visited the confluence several times and noticed that the folks get farther and farther into the river. I have been told that the fish coming upriver want to stay closer to the shore as it expends more energy farther out in the current and they don't have that much to waste. If I am at the head of the line I try to stay about 2-5 feet off the bank and if I am at the tail, well, you know where I am as the line snakes farther and farther. Am I correct in this assumption? If I am at the end, where should I be? Don't say "stay home" or "different river". Maybe walk upriver several yards and then closer to the bank. Then someone will fill in the space.
    We base out of Soldotna and fish the rivers and accesses within an hour's drive or so. We have brought home beautiful salmon, pictures and memories.
    I will post some photos. A large rainbow here is (I am ashamed to say) 14". We just don't have the water like AK.
    Thanks,
    Stewart

  20. #20
    Member Alaska Gray's Avatar
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    They will never ban the shoulder to shoulder (blocking the russian)
    I stay away from that mess.. If I can't find no reds in the river I know then people are lined up shoulder to shoulder across the mouth.... Can never figure that out.
    Living the Alaskan Dream
    Gary Keller
    Anchorage, AK

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