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Thread: Score one for the sheep!

  1. #1
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    Default Score one for the sheep!

    This has been a long time coming. I don't know about you guys but I want my grand kids to have the opportunity to bring sheep meat home to their families. If we expect there to be a harvestable surplus of sheep in the future, then something's got to give.
    Give the sheep a break, we all know aerial spotting gives the hunter an extremely unfair advantage that only contributes to falling sheep numbers.

    http://www.adn.com/article/20150529/...p-spotting-ban

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    Member Mkay's Avatar
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    Got no dog in this hunt cause I'm too out of shape to hunt sheep, but... predict zero convictions if any charges are ever made. Unenforcable.
    My child was inmate of the month at Mat-Su pre-trial Correctional facility.

  3. #3

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    You mean score one for out of state guided hunters. So many people are mis informed on who his will affect. This BOG has continued to ignore Alaska Resident sheep hunters.

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    Well i for one am glad that the prevailing way of plane spotting sheep in alaska which has filled the record book but is unethical and hurt sheep populations will now be illegal. At least we as hunters are defining we stand for which is fair chase. Why does a bow hunting sportsman need to support plane spotting mr frost?
    “I come home with an honestly earned feeling that something good has taken place. It makes no difference whether I got anything, it has to do with how the day was spent. “ Fred Bear

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    I don't see it as a score for anybody but the sheep! I think that was the intention here. We're trying to preserve a harvestable surplus of animals for the future. Our priority right now shouldn't be making people happy, it should be lessening pressure on the sheep. That's the idea here, everybody wants more sheep right? I know I do, my son does and so do my nieces and nephews and their kids. You do, the transporter does, the guide does, the taxidermist, skin sewer, horn carvers do, and dontcha ya bet out of state smash-and-grabbers do! Hunter success is one of the few contributing factors affecting our sheep numbers. It's also one thing that we have some control over. We can't control bad weather, icing, sickness etc. We can limit permits,close down units, and make hunters work a little harder for it though. It might not save all the sheep but you bet yer hind end a few more rams are going to live this year because of it. The odds are stacked against these critters right now, so how can a responsible hunter expect to enjoy all the spoils and success their accustomed too? We've gotta help these animals folks and everybody with a vested interest is going to have to suck it up and take a hit for the next several years and hopefully these animals numbers will start to rebound. Enforceable? Heck yeah, I've been seeing air jockeys run sheep in the high country for decades in late July/early August whilst out scouting on foot. Lotsa folks I know have experienced the same. Drives us regular poor guys on foot nuts. Tail numbers are easy to read in this day and age of decent optics and super high resolution digi cams and remember, just when you think no one is watching, they probably are.

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    From my experience outside of this forum, it seems to me most of the common man demographic ie (poor guys without planes or cash for flight time) are in support of this measure. Many of those with expensive planes who are heavily invested financially, and are accustomed to the spoils of aerial spotting are the dissenters. I could be wrong though but that's the feeling I'm getting when I talk with folks around the state.

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    Member Hunt&FishAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullcephous View Post
    From my experience outside of this forum, it seems to me most of the common man demographic ie (poor guys without planes or cash for flight time) are in support of this measure. Many of those with expensive planes who are heavily invested financially, and are accustomed to the spoils of aerial spotting are the dissenters. I could be wrong though but that's the feeling I'm getting when I talk with folks around the state.
    i for one am happy for it. It shouldn't be legal. I've never used a plane to scout. Nor do I ever
    Plan to. This brings it back to a level playing field so to speak. (edited)
    Last edited by Michael Strahan; 05-30-2015 at 10:18.



    Release Lake Trout

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    In case anybody didn't notice, we've already talked about this at great length months ago......
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4merguide View Post
    In case anybody didn't notice, we've already talked about this at great length months ago......

    Gotta make sure that dead horse never comes back to life

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    I am just fine with no arial spotting, definately takes away some of the ethics of hunting. However, is it a sheep population decline that is trying to be turned around? I am not sure I understand how taking of mature Rams will hurt a population? The ewes make or break pooulations unless there is so few Rams ewes can not get bread, but that seems like it would be unlikely. I would think other factors such as lamb survival and such would be more of an issue. I probably need to read more population studies though, just my thoughts

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    Sheep subcommittee is 2 to 1 guide.
    Yeah, score again for the sheep?!
    Great for residents.
    And all the angling from SCI and other org's buried deep in the process like ticks.
    Yep all good for residents and sheep?.

    May wanna take just a few minutes from the forum and actually watch the BOG actions as this stuff unfolds.
    None of this is good for the resident, gents.

  12. #12

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    So are the non-residents gonna kill more sheep now cause aerial spotting is now illegal?

    Just can't see how this will be bad for the sheep.

    Will it be good for residents with planes, nope not at all. Will the guides benefit sure. But I just don't see more sheep being taken because spotting from planes which means good for the sheep IMO.

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    I must be missing something here. How does this benefit guides and out of state hunters? Please educate me AK-Hunt. No aerial spotting should affect all user groups equally. Nobody should be out pinning down rams from their plane. Do it the old fashioned way. Get out to a spot where you think you might cross paths with rams. Lace up yer boots and head up the hill and go hunt! What fun is it heading up the hill knowing exactly what lies over the next ridge? Wheres the sense of adventure gone?? What the heck has this world come to. Some folks think they are entitled to a big doggone curly twister every year, and if they have to buy wings and take to the air like an eagle they'll do it. Laying claim to critters via air is cheap. I can only predict that with advances in current technology, we are not far off from some type of google earth-like live video feed of the earth. That ought to be awesome for hunting.

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    Good luck enforcing it...

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    Support our sheep by shooting wolves and bears that take advantage of the sheep being weaker after a rough winter. As stated above the population won't increase without ewes and lambs. The number of ewes and lambs has declined hurting the population. Last I checked hunters don't kill ewes and lambs. We shoot rams. It's predators and weather. Sure stopping spotting from planes will keep a few big rams out there longer but I don't see that helping the population. You want more sheep notch more bear and wolf tags while out sheep hunting.

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by sambuck12 View Post
    Support our sheep by shooting wolves and bears that take advantage of the sheep being weaker after a rough winter. As stated above the population won't increase without ewes and lambs. The number of ewes and lambs has declined hurting the population. Last I checked hunters don't kill ewes and lambs. We shoot rams. It's predators and weather. Sure stopping spotting from planes will keep a few big rams out there longer but I don't see that helping the population. You want more sheep notch more bear and wolf tags while out sheep hunting.
    Well heck lets just go to any ram then.

  17. #17
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    Anyone who honestly feels this will change harvest numbers is mistaken, IMO. It is too hard to enforce.
    What it will do is turn hunter against hunter. Anyone who suspects he saw a plane spotting and someone hunting after that will be turning them in, or trying to. Probably make a little more money for the Sat phone providers. Probably cost a little more money for the troopers to respond to all the calls of spotting.
    We already have a bad res vs. guide/non res problem. Now we will have airplane user vs. non airplane user.
    Hey.........maybe everyone will be so busy watching for airplanes spotting sheep that there really will be a decrease in harvest!!
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
    I have less friends now!!

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullcephous View Post
    This has been a long time coming. I don't know about you guys but I want my grand kids to have the opportunity to bring sheep meat home to their families. If we expect there to be a harvestable surplus of sheep in the future, then something's got to give.
    Give the sheep a break, we all know aerial spotting gives the hunter an extremely unfair advantage that only contributes to falling sheep numbers.

    http://www.adn.com/article/20150529/...p-spotting-ban
    This is total BS. Lets be honest. This is about a regulation supported by big game guide and Alaska Board of Game Vice Chairman Nate Turner benefiting directly from this proposal restricting and containing Alaskan bush pilots from competing with his $17,500 sheep clients in killing their 'trophies' If this was about sheep conservation they'd limit the number of big game guides who pre-scout locations for their clients with a high success rate of kills. Am I against guides? No, but be honest, they're out there beating the brush so they can hook their clients up. Their bound to have higher success rates.

    Aerial spotting for sheep is not about 'finding' sheep, its about finding legal rams. Anyone worth their salt as a sheep hunter already knows where sheep are, or least should be. Another point: the flight restriction (which is all but impossible to enforce Lol) is for Aug 10 to close. Again, any experienced sheep hunter is already in the field days before the opener. They've already spotted their attended targets.

    To quote Nate Turners position: Using planes to spot for game violates Turner’s hunting ethics because the practice goes against what he considers fair chase. He said he decided the state game board should take action to stop others from spotting after he read the game board-commissioned sheep hunter survey that University of Alaska Fairbanks professor Todd Brinkman conducted last year. The survey showed aerial spotters disproportionately bothered ground-based hunters, he said.

    “When you ask someone how they feel about an airplane flying over when they’re hunting, it doesn’t bother them very much. You ask them about an airplane landing nearby and someone hunting, it doesn’t trouble them too much,” Turner said. “When you ask them about an airplane circling around on a mountainside, the majority of those surveyed were against it,” Turner said.

    Now, I'm no rocket scientist but...Nate Turner indeed uses airplanes to access sheep hunting grounds. SO, its OK for him and his clients but not for Alaskan residents who live year round to access the same grounds and scout for sheep as he does (oh and you know he does).

    This is not a personal attack on Nate Turner, I'm simply calling him out on his 'conflict of interests' as a BOG member and big game guide. This regulation benefits him personally and he knows it. Do I believe its unethical to aerial spot any game animal and then land atop and kill it? Yes. But that's why we have same day airborne. What this regulation WILL do is increase the number of sub-legal rams taken by desperate hunters. And that includes guides.
    Alaska Outdoors Television ~ Outdoor Channel

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    Default Score one for the sheep!

    This was not very well thought out in my opinion. I fly but I don't care to sheep hunt. My airplane will land about anywhere and has big tires just like a "rich doctor and lawyer from Anchorage" (which I am not) super cub. I suppose I should be prepared to defend myself if I want to fly over and look at them now. That's a sad state of affairs, folks.

  20. #20
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    They'll continue to look (scout) for rams while going in or returning with clients. What? They're NOT gonna look while flying in/out of drop/pick up points? They'll just have tunnel vision to the strip?
    Or "I wanted to go this way, but a cloud was in my way making things too dangerous, so I had to fly ALL THE WAY around the mtn to drop off my big $$ clients"..
    You know, "incidental observations" while flying for the customers.
    I've NO dog in this fight or debate...
    IMHO, This regulation will be all but impossible to enforce..

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