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Thread: "BUCK SHOT" education requested.......PLEASE Nothing double aught, Please.

  1. #1

    Default "BUCK SHOT" education requested.......PLEASE Nothing double aught, Please.

    I am begging you please DON"T post stuff about the magic of the "Classic" Double Aught Buck shot.

    I have done extensive reaserch on "000-Buck shot".

    But I don't know much about the sub-"00-Buck shot". I am looking for essays, or reference data, or information on different smaller Buckshot. As to the range (Read Distance) and general standard intended application.

    The Guage is "NOT" very relevent to the requested information, as I can use mental extrapulations, for the guage differences.

    My primary interest is the relative relationship (as to application) of different sub-"00 Buckshot", as relevent to each other, and also there range.

    Thank You.........

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    Default "BUCK SHOT" education requested.......PLEASE Nothing double aught, Please.

    Well I'm no expert but I'm curious if you can expand on the idea that gauge is not relevant to shot size?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Member hodgeman's Avatar
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    Check out "Box of Truth" #3..penetration testing of buckshot.
    "I do not deal in hypotheticals. The world, as it is, is vexing enough..." Col. Stonehill, True Grit

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    Member akgun&ammo's Avatar
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    #4 buck seems to be the go to for police, 00 and 000 standardized for the military....

    so, the question to you is... what data are you looking for?

    Federal, Winchester, Fiochi, all have great data on their websites...

    good luck in your search
    Chris

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    Quote Originally Posted by limon32 View Post
    Well I'm no expert but I'm curious if you can expand on the idea that gauge is not relevant to shot size?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    It is not until you consider a slug in a particular gauge. "00" buck is the same diameter whether loaded for use in a 20ga or a 10ga, as is #4, #7 or BB, etc., shot size is shot size, regardless of the gauge of the shotgun. In case you are unaware, the gauge of a shotgun is determined by the number of round balls (spheres) of lead in a given diameter to equal a pound of weight; 1 pound of lead are divided into 12 balls of lead of equal size, the diameter of one of those balls would be a 12ga bore diameter.

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    Answer:......this type information....."akgun&ammo;1470979]#4 buck seems to be the go to for police, 00 and 000 standardized for the military....

    Just looking for a better understanding of the "Theory" of different size Buckshot. I have a good depth of understanding of the relative merits of rifle cartridges, and there applications. I would like to learn more about Buck Shot theory as to useful range, and size relative to the mass, and skin thickness for different size animals.


    Quote Originally Posted by akgun&ammo View Post
    so, the question to you is... what data are you looking for? Chris

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    The smaller the buckshot the better the chance of a shot hitting the target in exchange for doing less damage. A one ounce load of any shot with say 3 1/4 drams of powder with fire all loads the same distance. With standard loads all guages will shoot say 6shot to the same yardage,its the number of pellets involved that is different not fpe/fps per pellet.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Thanks, I understand that. What I want is a book written by someone who has used Buck Shot on leopards, wild boar, deer, elk, bear, coyote, wolves, and fifty other animals. I want to learn why I would use #4 on a leopard at 5 feet, but use 000 Buck on a leopard at 20 yards.

    I want the depth of knowledge for understanding Buck Shot size choice........like I have from 60 years of harvesting, or observing clients harvest game with a centerfire rifle or handgun.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    The smaller the buckshot the better the chance of a shot hitting the target in exchange for doing less damage. A one ounce load of any shot with say 3 1/4 drams of powder with fire all loads the same distance. With standard loads all guages will shoot say 6shot to the same yardage,its the number of pellets involved that is different not fpe/fps per pellet.

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    Member Steve_O's Avatar
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    I personally would rather use #4 buckshot in a wooded area due to the better chance for at least enough shot getting through the brush and hitting the intended target. I used #4 all the time hunting whitetails in Arkansas growing up. It's large enough to be leathal and enough shot to spread out for better hit ratio. Everytime I used "00 buck" I missed more than I hit. When I changed to #4 at my Grand Fathers suggestion I noticed an immediate difference. Of course I'm sure buck fever in a 12 year old probably had something to do with it too.
    A little personal use data,
    Hope this helps.

    Steve

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    Yes.....thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_O View Post
    I personally would rather use #4 buckshot in a wooded area due to the better chance for at least enough shot getting through the brush and hitting the intended target. I used #4 all the time hunting whitetails in Arkansas growing up. It's large enough to be leathal and enough shot to spread out for better hit ratio. Everytime I used "00 buck" I missed more than I hit. When I changed to #4 at my Grand Fathers suggestion I noticed an immediate difference. Of course I'm sure buck fever in a 12 year old probably had something to do with it too.
    A little personal use data,
    Hope this helps.

    Steve

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    Above Ground Level,

    I've looked through a couple of my shotgun books but found nothing really relevant but having used a lot of buckshot over 60 years, I'll give my observations even though I don't know your intended use.

    Only two sizes buckshot are common in most stores....00 & #4. I've used very little 00 and consider it to have very little use as there just isn't enough pattern consistency unless quite close whereas I've used #4 for long range goose hunting extensively as well as for coyotes and fox.....

    Initial velocity has minimal effect at long range.

    Penetration and pattern density is usually greatly increased with copper plated and even more with nickel plated shot.

    #4 buckshot responds to choke tubes much better than 00 in most cases especially for longer ranges. The Patternmaster choke tubes will provide a pattern at extreme ranges that can be incredibly tight and therefore deadly IMO.

  12. #12

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    Thank You.....that is helpful. I long ago went to 000 Buck in my 12 ga. and #4 Buck in my 20 ga. I also like those 3" .410 shells with 5- triple aught pellets.

    Quote Originally Posted by VernAK View Post
    Above Ground Level,

    I've looked through a couple of my shotgun books but found nothing really relevant but having used a lot of buckshot over 60 years, I'll give my observations even though I don't know your intended use.

    Only two sizes buckshot are common in most stores....00 & #4. I've used very little 00 and consider it to have very little use as there just isn't enough pattern consistency unless quite close whereas I've used #4 for long range goose hunting extensively as well as for coyotes and fox.....

    Initial velocity has minimal effect at long range.

    Penetration and pattern density is usually greatly increased with copper plated and even more with nickel plated shot.

    #4 buckshot responds to choke tubes much better than 00 in most cases especially for longer ranges. The Patternmaster choke tubes will provide a pattern at extreme ranges that can be incredibly tight and therefore deadly IMO.

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    Member GrassLakeRon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AGL4now View Post
    Thanks, I understand that. What I want is a book written by someone who has used Buck Shot on leopards, wild boar, deer, elk, bear, coyote, wolves, and fifty other animals. I want to learn why I would use #4 on a leopard at 5 feet, but use 000 Buck on a leopard at 20 yards.

    I want the depth of knowledge for understanding Buck Shot size choice........like I have from 60 years of harvesting, or observing clients harvest game with a centerfire rifle or handgun.
    You must have read "death on the dark continent". 000 buck gives a great pattern using a turkey extra full choke out to 35 yards. Pie plate size. I wonder how long 000 buck has been around compared to #4.
    "Equipped with his five senses, man explores the universe around him and calls the adventure science"

    Edwin Hubble

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    A .410 slug is almost equal to the 32acp when you go to buck it drops some. The great P.H.C. was a camp bar tender and never a licened guide though the outfit was crook for a long time. When allowed slug beats buck every time in the field and a target at fifty yards will prove it. Now for varmit hunting a Carlson dead coyote choke tube a bb's or buck are fine but don't try to add a slug in the mix as choke is way to tight. For protection the little 67 guage is best for clearing the perp out of your truck cab window
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Note the tighter pattern of the copper plated load in the article.

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    Yes.........Good information. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by akgun&ammo View Post

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    Part of the reason(s) for smaller shot sizes holding a pattern better, may be that larger shot deforms more as it travels down a barrel. Deformed shot will be more apt to fly "off course" and throw fliers outside the pattern. Deformation is also why copper (and nickel) plated shot holds a pattern better - less deformation due to the harder (than lead) plating.
    There should be no difference in velocity between a load of #4 buck and 00 (given the same dram loads). Having said that, there will be a difference in hitting power (per individual pellet) due to the weight variation. A #4 buck = .24 diameter; 00 = .33 diameter.
    With all buckshot loads, patterning an individual shot gun is EXTREMELY important. Various chokes should also be tried, if the gun is so equipped, to determine what throws the best patterns at the ranges you expect to shoot.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    At ranges in the article BB's or 2's would be a better choice for fpe on target with full choke.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    I don't know if this still holds true or not, but, years ago I was told that many, if not most of AK's bios, when out in the bush doing studies, carried shotguns loaded with buckshot first then followed by slugs. The theory was to blind a charging bear first with the buckshot and then hammer it with the slugs. Does anybody know what size buckshot they used?
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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