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Thread: Board of Game - Info on Sheep Proposals

  1. #1
    Member Yellowknife's Avatar
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    Default Board of Game - Info on Sheep Proposals

    Noticed a document posted on the BOG website recently. Basically, they are giving fair warning that they will be looking hard at all sheep proposals this year. Looks like they will also be holding some public information sessions prior to the main BOG meeting and will be looking at the Northern region proposals in Feb at the Wasilla meeting.

    I can't link directly, but it's the first document on the this page:

    http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm...gameboard.main

    Also, the 2015 proposals for SE, S. Central, and Western AK are out.

    Yk

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    Member mtnclimber's Avatar
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    Thanks for taking the time to post that YK.

    Seems like it could be a very interesting year for sheep and sheep hunters. A lot of interesting things will be considered it sounds like.

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    Member Hoyt's Avatar
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    I agree. Some of those are pretty interesting.
    "If I could shoot a game bird and still not hurt it, the way I can take a trout on a fly and release it, I doubt if I would kill another one." George Bird Evans

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    Member MatSuDano's Avatar
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    • Earlier seasons for residents
    • Shorter seasons for nonresidents
    • Drawing permits required for nonresidents
    • Reduce permits for nonresidents
    • Resident only hunts
    • Limit nonresidents hunting with a next-of-kin relative


    Think they may be on to something here. Likey
    Last edited by MatSuDano; 08-28-2014 at 14:23. Reason: sp

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    Member Bambistew's Avatar
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    The list is a summary of items that were tabled last BOG session. They likely will take no action on most all of them, but will have to do something.

    The best thing to do, is go to the meeting and get informed, then write a brief letter/email or present at the BOG meeting this spring. Get involved!

    My take away from the BOG meeting last winter... The BOG believes a draw (for everyone) is the best measure for managing sheep hunters and sheep. If you don't like that idea, better let them know, and back it up with why, what would be better and include some facts.

    I'm very interested to see the results of the survey. I honestly don't think anyone really knows what the main "issue" is. Every sheep hunter I talk to says something different, I have a feeling the survey results will show the same. Maybe we all just need to suck it up?

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    75% of SE draw tags go to SE resident.Sure hope the fall brown bear goes in effect.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Member Steve Springer's Avatar
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    Starting earlier for residents doesn't make sense to me, it too warm and buggy, hell if anything just delay the start of non-residents like they do for moose and other game. Dido what Bambistew said. Go to the meetings, get informed, talk to others and do some reading and then write in with your 2 cents. I took the survey and can't wait for the results, as I found it not that useful, I could have took it 3 times and answered it 3 different ways, could have been put together better IMO.

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    Member Bambistew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    75% of SE draw tags go to SE resident.Sure hope the fall brown bear goes in effect.
    Not really sure what this has to do with sheep proposals? If sheep go on a draw, we all lose.

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    Member tlingitwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bambistew View Post
    Not really sure what this has to do with sheep proposals? If sheep go on a draw, we all lose.
    Don't necessary agree. When demand exceeds supply changes must be made. Certainly don't want to see a draw system for residents, fully support one for the non-residents. This state is far, far to accommodative to non-resident hunting IMHO.
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    Member polardds's Avatar
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    Bambi has it right. The Commercial operators who cater more to Nonresidents are organized and know who to talk to to make changes to protect their interests.

    Even when the residents try to form groups to promote resident interests the commercial guys try to come in and twist those organizations. ie Alaska FNAWS


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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bambistew View Post
    Not really sure what this has to do with sheep proposals? If sheep go on a draw, we all lose.
    Well like the OP stated it also has other proposals for other parts of the state for even bigger picture.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    If the state goes to statewide draw only for sheep, then they need to allow for more choices on permit applications, say, you get 6 choices then, versus the 3 only allowed for sheep now. Keep the statewide draw only going just until populations can show some rebound, good lamb production, etc.

    If a statewide draw only went into effect, 6 choices for a draw permit on a sheep would give everyone a fair shake at getting a permit.

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    Charterboat Operator Abel's Avatar
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    Please correct me if wrong. But if everyone (sheep guys) can put in for 3 tags each, they all have the same odds, so that's fair right?

    I'm no math expert, but if you double the number of tags we can put in for, but keep permit numbers the same, everyone's probably going to put in for the max, well most of us will. So your odds aren't going to get any better, maybe a little bit, becasue not everyone will put in for 6 tags, but not much better.


    Quote Originally Posted by jwfishak View Post
    If the state goes to statewide draw only for sheep, then they need to allow for more choices on permit applications, say, you get 6 choices then, versus the 3 only allowed for sheep now. Keep the statewide draw only going just until populations can show some rebound, good lamb production, etc.

    If a statewide draw only went into effect, 6 choices for a draw permit on a sheep would give everyone a fair shake at getting a permit.
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  14. #14

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    It's all bull****. It should all start with limiting non-residents to 10% of the available harvest and putting them on a draw. Then, and only then, if that doesn't work, make it a draw for all. Too many residents are ready to sell their souls to the devil before limiting non resident hunting. Backward ass thinking is slowly ruining hunting for all ALASKANS.

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    Member oakman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by northway View Post
    It's all bull****. It should all start with limiting non-residents to 10% of the available harvest and putting them on a draw. Then, and only then, if that doesn't work, make it a draw for all. Too many residents are ready to sell their souls to the devil before limiting non resident hunting. Backward ass thinking is slowly ruining hunting for all ALASKANS.
    EXACTLY my thoughts...Make guided residents 100% draw and limit their numbers. Before any resident opportunities are limited, the non-residents need to be limited.

    Another thought is to limit the number of guides or nail them down to specific areas. Don't let them wipe out an area in a few years and then move on. Things seem to be pretty stable in the areas that the feds manage like this. I think the guides would like not having to compete with each other as well.

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    Member mtnclimber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakman View Post
    EXACTLY my thoughts...Make guided residents 100% draw and limit their numbers. Before any resident opportunities are limited, the non-residents need to be limited.
    YES. It doesn't make sense for residents to be punished for guides activities.

    Id love to see sheep go the same direction that unit 13 moose has gone.

  17. #17
    Member Frostbitten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnclimber View Post
    YES. It doesn't make sense for residents to be punished for guides activities.

    Id love to see sheep go the same direction that unit 13 moose has gone.
    I dont know about that...unit 13 moose are in trouble! Just imagine how many sheep will be killed if a "community hunt" for sheep were instituted. Absolute carnage

  18. #18
    Member mtnclimber's Avatar
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    Well, i meant the whole open to resident and draw for non-res thing. that was the first example i could think of off the top of my head.

    that community hunt is a whole nother story!

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    Member Bambistew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by northway View Post
    It's all bull****. It should all start with limiting non-residents to 10% of the available harvest and putting them on a draw. Then, and only then, if that doesn't work, make it a draw for all. Too many residents are ready to sell their souls to the devil before limiting non resident hunting. Backward ass thinking is slowly ruining hunting for all ALASKANS.
    Agree 100%.

    Same goes for the residents that want us to go to a 1 sheep in 4 years. ADFG has looked into this in the past, its a rare group that kills more than one sheep in 4 years already. Such a limit does nothing to improve hunting for residents, and has ZERO limitations on NR. Why the heck would we want to limit ourselves before limiting NR?

    One thing to consider. Residents have a statewide harvest rate of about 22-25% to include draw permits, etc. Guided NR are around 80% and NR account for around 42% of all sheep killed, and 22% of all hunters. Cut them back to 10% of all hunters, and we end up with an increase of 20+% more rams instantly... seems like a no brainier.

    BOG is worried that putting a limit on NR will mean more residents will want to hunt, and they won't solve any of the crowding issues that so many complain about. I don't see that happening. The guys who want to sheep hunt, are sheep hunting now. The ones that may try it due to limited pressure, are doubtful to cause any real harm to the sheep population on any sort of regular basis. In order to get to the same total harvest we have today we'd have to increase resident sheep hunter numbers by 30-40%. Considering that sheep hunter numbers have declined by 50% in the last 20 years, 1/5 of our sheep hunt areas are now in a draw... I don's see much of an increase happening.

    I don't mind a few hunters, and the guys that complain about seeing other hunters need to realize that there is only so much ground to go around... Would you rather have it all to your self once or twice in your lifetime (Tok, DCUA, Chugache) or share it with your fellow hunters and get to go sheep hunting every year? Odds are you're not going to kill a sheep every year. Sheep hunting is tough, finding a legal ram is tougher, and being in the right place at the right time is even more so. Why don't as many hunters complain about moose? The harvest rate is similar?

  20. #20
    Member SkinnyD's Avatar
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    The state corporate income tax rate is between 1% and 9.4% depending on how much the company makes. Suppose a guiding outfit makes $300,000 in a year... only a fraction of that amount ($30,000 or so) will go to the state. So then why does the state continue to prop up this industry? It makes no money off guides. Why not just charge nonresidents the guide-standard $15,000 for a sheep tag and drop the guide requirement? The state could make as much from two hunters as it could from a company in an entire year.
    Passing up shots on mergansers since 1992.


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