Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 70

Thread: June 15... opening day for subsistence Kenai kings!

  1. #1
    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Aberdeen WA
    Posts
    4,516

    Default June 15... opening day for subsistence Kenai kings!

    Yep, you heard it right... the rod and reel subsistence fishery for kings opens on June 15. Two per day and four in possession, bait allowed with an annual limit of 10 per head of household plus 2 per dependent.

    Slot limit rules apply as does the reg for no fish out of water.

    And yes, you may use a guide .

    I gets better on July 1 when the combined dipnet/rod-n-reel fishery opens, giving users the opportunity to harvest their entire allowed annual household bag in ONE day. One head of household in a family of five could conceivably take 18 kings in one day!

    If four of them were to jump in a guide boat, they could take as many as 72 kings in one day!

    My the times they are a changin'.....


    Anybody wanna change their zip code?

    Edited at request of member - correct date info contained in this post.
    Last edited by Brian M; 06-08-2007 at 22:16. Reason: requested by fNp
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

  2. #2
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Marshall
    Posts
    1,975

    Default Looked up zip code Apartied...

    On the WWW. & could only find the stifling South African government brutal subjegation of non whites, based on the fact that white South Africans thought they were Superior to coloreds...but I cannot believe that zip code Apartide exsists in Alaska...

  3. #3
    Member sayak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Central peninsula, between the K-rivers
    Posts
    5,788

    Default Or even...

    Quote Originally Posted by gogoalie View Post
    On the WWW. & could only find the stifling South African government brutal subjegation of non whites, based on the fact that white South Africans thought they were Superior to coloreds...but I cannot believe that zip code Apartide exsists in Alaska...
    ... blood quantum apartheit for that matter

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    5,518

    Default lets get real doc

    O.K. there are 300 guides on the Kenai or more. They each take 8 people a day out for 30 days. That means the limits allow 2400 hundred fish per day to be harvested or 72000 for the season. God we should close the fishery as that would wipe out the whole run.

    Doc you figures are just as bad for the new fishery. You know that to catch a chinook requires 16-32 hours of fishing time. That is in the prime chinook areas. The subsistence fishery is upstream and not prime area.

    So lets cut out this type of hype. Would you like to make a bet on how many subsistence fish will be caught. Send me a PM and you and I will pick a number - at the end of the season the person closest to the number wins. Lets see if you pick the high numbers you suggest with something on the line. I doubt it but I am willing to see.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Soldotna AK
    Posts
    506

    Default subsistence

    Was wondering just how many Rainbow’s are going to be killed while the netting/fishing is going on. I am sure there is a bag limit. It might not be prime time for the King of the river but the poor Rainbow may not Fair so well. I would think the trophy Rainbow fishing will come to its end. oooo-well there’s always the Naknek. F&G may have there work cut out for them just controlling all the red necks & mine is so red that i am going NORTH….

  6. #6
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Thumbs down Hatemongering?

    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    Yep, you heard it right... the rod and reel subsistence fishery for kings opens on June 16. Two per day and four in possession, bait allowed with an annual limit of 10 per head of household plus 2 per dependent.

    Slot limit rules apply as does the reg for no fish out of water.

    And yes, you may use a guide .

    I gets better on July 1 when the combined dipnet/rod-n-reel fishery opens, giving users the opportunity to harvest their entire allowed annual household bag in ONE day. One head of household in a family of five could conceivably take 18 kings in one day!

    If four of them were to jump in a guide boat, they could take as many as 72 kings in one day!

    My the times they are a changin'.....


    Anybody wanna change their zip code?
    Four of "them"? And who might "they" be? Your rant reminds me of the garbage I heard directed against African-Americans in the South after the Federal courts imposed segregation.

    Just what we need. . . more hate, more envy, more divisiveness. .


  7. #7
    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Eagle River, AK
    Posts
    13,391

    Default

    I don't know how to feel about this. The Kenai needs less pressure, not more. Yet at the same time, I'd rather see a local family filling their freezer with a few Kenai kings than see yet another 4 pages of non-residents hoisting their 75 lb. fire-engine red kings on the pages of Fish Alaska magazine. What is a more noble use of our fish and game resources?

  8. #8
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Thumbs down Noble?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    I don't know how to feel about this. The Kenai needs less pressure, not more. Yet at the same time, I'd rather see a local family filling their freezer with a few Kenai kings than see yet another 4 pages of non-residents hoisting their 75 lb. fire-engine red kings on the pages of Fish Alaska magazine. What is a more noble use of our fish and game resources?
    Noble? What has "noble" to do with the Kenai River gong-show? No, no, no. . . it's about "size matters," photo ops, thrills, excitement, fun, money, and such. But "noble"? Not a chance. . .


  9. #9

    Thumbs down Hyperbole!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    O.K. there are 300 guides on the Kenai or more. They each take 8 people a day out for 30 days. That means the limits allow 2400 hundred fish per day to be harvested or 72000 for the season. God we should close the fishery as that would wipe out the whole run.

    Doc you figures are just as bad for the new fishery. You know that to catch a chinook requires 16-32 hours of fishing time. That is in the prime chinook areas. The subsistence fishery is upstream and not prime area.

    So lets cut out this type of hype. Would you like to make a bet on how many subsistence fish will be caught. Send me a PM and you and I will pick a number - at the end of the season the person closest to the number wins. Lets see if you pick the high numbers you suggest with something on the line. I doubt it but I am willing to see.
    OK... I try to avoid these threads, simply because as an obvious guide, my thoughts/concerns are usually discredited as "special interest", "commercial only interest", and so on... but some of these comments really rocked my boat (sorry for the pun, it just happened).

    Let my start by saying, that I don't take 8 people out per day, nor do I fish 30 days on either the first or second run of kings. The first run, from mid-May to the end of June, guides cannot work on Sundays or Mondays and the fish numbers are such that there simply is not much demand for guided fishing until the last few weeks of June. It doesn't take long to see that there is not a line at the launches, nor a shortage of parking during the early run. It is very rare that you find a guide working the Kenai River 30 days during the early run. Those who are very busy will be working the Kasilof or trolling in the salt.

    With the second run (July 1-31), again the Kenai is closed to guides on Sundays and Mondays, leaving only 20 potential work days for the guide. I would like to meet the guide who can limit out even 4 clients per day for all of each run! Though technically, the numbers you throw out are mathematically accurate, they are physically and practically impossible! Since you brought up the potential (though impractical/impossible) limit for the guide, what is the limit for the commercial gill netter? THERE IS NO LIMIT!!!

    Now don't get me wrong. I am not anti-commerical fisherman. Indeed, I spent many of my younger years working both beach sites and drift boats picking fish. I have high regard for the work, danger and tradition/life style of the commercial fisherman. In fact, my son is currently working on a commercial boat. There is no beef here.


    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    I don't know how to feel about this. The Kenai needs less pressure, not more. Yet at the same time, I'd rather see a local family filling their freezer with a few Kenai kings than see yet another 4 pages of non-residents hoisting their 75 lb. fire-engine red kings on the pages of Fish Alaska magazine. What is a more noble use of our fish and game resources?
    Brian, I agree with the premise of your statement. However, you want to see a "tomato-fest", just wait and see what kind of fish are drug off of the spawning beds whith this "subsistence fishery".

  10. #10
    Member BlueMoose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Rifle River MI
    Posts
    1,835

    Default I should Not do this however

    Bottom Line: limited space, increase human population, over regulated, and mis-managed I think that about sums it up.

    I do not guide nor do I often fish on the Kenai. I have a guide who is part of my business who does work on the Kenai as well as the Kasilof so I guess I am part of the Problem and part of the Solution depending on how one looks at it.

    All participants using the systems have an agenda be it good or bad, healthy for the system or darn abusive. We can only hope to sort it out to be beneficial to us all however based on current State and Federal regs, commercial interest, subsistance interest as well as Guide Associations I feel we are heading down a road that will be difficult to re-build once it washes out.

    I hate to go here again however sooner or later it will crash based on Limited Space, Limited Resource, Over Population, and Mis-Management.

    Tight Lines!

  11. #11
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Thumbs down More divisiveness. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskanfishguides View Post
    Brian, I agree with the premise of your statement. However, you want to see a "tomato-fest", just wait and see what kind of fish are drug off of the spawning beds whith this "subsistence fishery".
    How can such an accusation be justified? Until if and when it happens, such prescient finger-pointing is little more than false witness. . . more divisiveness . . .


  12. #12
    Member bushrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Now residing in Fairbanks from the bush
    Posts
    4,363

    Default Francis, you continue...

    ...to not surprise me.

    Disappointed, again.

  13. #13
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Default There goes the neighborhood. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by bushrat View Post
    Disappointed, again.
    Save the disappointment, bushrat, it's simply a fact of life that some understand "sportfishing" in terms of "me first," "size matters," "making money," and "property values."

    Trailer-park fishing?


  14. #14

    Default Could this be divisive?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
    Save the disappointment, bushrat, it's simply a fact of life that some understand "sportfishing" in terms of "me first," "size matters," "making money," and "property values."

    Trailer-park fishing?

    OK, Marcus...

    Could this be the pot calling the kettle black?????? You too are being "prescient finger-pointing ...[and potentially a] false witness". You have absolutely no idea what my motives or values are and are prejuduced in your responses toward guides and sportfishers of all sorts.

    As a matter of fact, this week, on two separate guide trips, the clients were not at all focused on self, size or even catching, rather both trips were saying that they wanted to experience the Kenai River, have great fellowship, see eagles soaring, watch the kingfishers fly in and out of the nests, and if they caught a fish, well that would be great. Neither party had the ability to have this experience except through the services of a guide.

    So, John, I have to say that every user group/user has value and I dare say different motives. And to imply that every Kenai King Salmon fisher fits into the box "me first," "size matters," "making money," and "property values" is just wrong, stereotyping, and simply prejudiced.

  15. #15
    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Aberdeen WA
    Posts
    4,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus View Post


    Trailer-park fishing?

    Big bait, big fish....
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    5,518

    Default example of hyperbole

    Alaskanfishguides - you missed my point but that was probably my fault. Doc was ranting about 1000 chinook allocated - I was trying to make the point that most fisheries have more allocation than fish if one uses the extreme figures. The actual harvest is less for obvious reasons. I did not intent to imply that guides have 8 clients a day and can fish everyday with those clients. However, that is your potential if you could do it. So reality and potential are not the same and Doc stating the 1000 chinook figure was hyperbole. I think you help make my point so thanks for response.

    Also, there is no gill netting for subsistence in the Kenai River - I saw one post like that.

    I guess that does it for me - Doc you still have not told me how many chinook you think the subsistence fishery will take.

  17. #17
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Thumbs up Thanks. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskanfishguides View Post
    OK, Marcus...
    Could this be the pot calling the kettle black??????So, John, I have to say that every user group/user has value and I dare say different motives. And to imply that every Kenai King Salmon fisher fits into the box "me first," "size matters," "making money," and "property values" is just wrong, stereotyping, and simply prejudiced.
    Guilty as charged, and I apologize for my prejudiced stereotyping.

    That said, try to understand that there's enough "trailer park" fishing in terms of "me first," "size matters," "making money," and "property values" to prompt my error. Hey, one guy on these forums even confessed to being a sportfishing advocate in order to protect his property value.

    Last Sunday morning, I was standing at the boat launch at lower Skilak and watched two fully-loaded guide boats head for the Kenai.

    A few minutes later, a guy and his son launched. As they were loading up, I asked, "Going out to stink up the frying pan?" The father replied that while he thought it was legal to keep a dollie this time of year, dollies were hard to catch. He and his boy were going out to "release a few rainbows."

    What do you reckon the guided anglers were targeting? When does rainbow season open up on the river just below Skilak?

    Anyway, thanks for the reprimand, I deserved it. Just because much—maybe most?—of what goes on on the Kenai is trailer-park fishing doesn't mean all of it is. My apoligies. . .


  18. #18
    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Aberdeen WA
    Posts
    4,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    I guess that does it for me - Doc you still have not told me how many chinook you think the subsistence fishery will take.
    Sorry, nerka... my knee jerk repsonse is to always consider the worst-case scenario first.

    How many will they take? Who knows. And when? Again who knows. What portion in the ER? What portion in the LR?

    It's a new fishery that the participants have yet to figure out. Catch rates will be lower until they do. So I doubt the whole quota would be exploited in the first season.... but with enough effort, it could. Not likely, but it could.

    With resourceful folks and human nature being what it is, it's not hard to imagine that 1000-fish quota being expended in the not too distant future. I've brought nearly 50 kings to hand in my best week... and that's just one boat.

    They've got a lot more boats and a lot more days, plus they get more liberal methods and means... collectively, 1000 kings should be a slam dunk.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

  19. #19

    Default

    I heard they are allowed to use multiple hooks as well.

    I think the 16-32 hours per fish caught is BS. If I don't have a king in the boat in a few hours I surprised. I know guides in the lower river that do average a 75% catch rate for their clients during July.

    I don't agree with the subsitance rules implemented, becasue two 45-50 lb kings is more than enough King salmon to feed a small family for a while, not to mention all the reds available.

    Talk about discrmination at it's finest. Just becasue you live in Ninilchik, you can come to my backyard and use multiple hooks to catch 10 kings. It's a joke.

  20. #20
    New member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    5,639

    Thumbs down More strife. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    How many will they take? [. . .]They've got a lot more boats and a lot more days, plus they get more liberal methods and means...
    Please take the prejudiced, "us-against-them," divisive jingoism elsewhere. The fishery, like segregation, is a Federally-mandated done-deal, and "they" and "them" trash-talk accomplishes nothing now except more discord, more envy, more hatred, more divisiveness, more strife.

    Please leave that garbage in Washington. . .



Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •