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Thread: Crushed Shoulder?

  1. #1
    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Default Crushed Shoulder?

    I was shooting my 358win this weekend and one case did not want to chamber. Upon inspection it was clear I had deformed the shoulder while loading. So, my question is should I just pull the bullet and pitch the case or should I pull the bullet and re-size for use again?
    I was thinking that perhaps this type of stress on the shoulder may cause it to weaken and collapse again easier and would be much different than say re-sizing a 308 case to 358 for the first time.
    Any thoughts?

    I have had this happen before with other calibers and just pitched the cases, however for the sake of discussion I thought I would throw this out for discussion as a possible safety issue if re-used....
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    I anneal and resize. If you don't anneal, yeah, it will weaken the case. If resizing and firing results in a wrinkle, I'm stuck with it and don't trust it. Toss the case. Depends on the case and degree of crushing, but I bet I average more than 3/4 of the cases saved. My experience with the 358 and others with small shoulders sezz your prospects for salvage are very good.

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Hi BB, I have never annealed so do you do that first then resize or the other way around on a damaged case?
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

  4. #4

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    Anneal first. I anneal cases periodically as a matter of course- Neck and shoulders only. It sure extends case life.

    Somewhere back in the annals of this site, Murphy spelled out his techniques which were new to me in spite of years doing it "my own way." Worth digging back for it with a search. It's so good it really needs to be a sticky for the reloading section.

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    I viewed a few you tubes today and several used a torch, a drill with a socket large enough to hold the case you desire, and simply ran the drill slow rotating the case while holding it over the flame then when the case turned blue they dropped it into a container of water. Looked pretty slick to me!
    Ill give it a go after I pull the bullet and dump the powder!
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    Before pulling the bullet, you could try to run the case with the bullet intact back into your FL sizer die with the decapping pin removed. Depending on the length of the bullet, you might be able to squeeze the shoulder back to the right OD to chamber. I'm guessing that your bullet seating die was a bit to low when you seated that round and pushed a slight bulge out at the bottom of the shoulders.

    Just a thought, that might salvage the round without dumping the powder.

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    A long time back, I had my dies set incorrectly and had the shoulder pushed back to the point that the rounds would not chamber. I pulled the bullets, resized the cases and reloaded them. They work just fine, but it marked these cases and used them for 'practice' only. No reason to chuck the case, just not use them for hunting.

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkwarthog View Post
    Before pulling the bullet, you could try to run the case with the bullet intact back into your FL sizer die with the decapping pin removed. Depending on the length of the bullet, you might be able to squeeze the shoulder back to the right OD to chamber. I'm guessing that your bullet seating die was a bit to low when you seated that round and pushed a slight bulge out at the bottom of the shoulders.

    Just a thought, that might salvage the round without dumping the powder.
    That is exactly what I did when switching bullets. Thankfully I only did one! Thanks for the tip to try resizing without the decapper. Always things to learn new for sure...
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

  9. #9

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    Be careful as the neck enters the neck of the die. Usually the bullet PLUS the neck walls are too large for that area. You think your shoulder is crushed now, watch what happens if you try to shove the neck into too small a space.

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    IT ALL DEPENDS, on why the shoulder was crushed in the first place.

    If too much lube, fire form it out.

    If your Seating Die is adjusted for crimp/too much, correct that.

    That's all I can think of right now, but shouldn't you determine WHY, HOW, the shoulder was crushed, before attempting a remedy?

    Just Askin.
    Smitty of the North
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    IT ALL DEPENDS, on why the shoulder was crushed in the first place.

    If too much lube, fire form it out.

    If your Seating Die is adjusted for crimp/too much, correct that.

    That's all I can think of right now, but shouldn't you determine WHY, HOW, the shoulder was crushed, before attempting a remedy?

    Just Askin.
    Smitty of the North
    Good question Smitty,
    I am pretty sure I ran a bullet in and it put on a moderate crimp - then I decided it was not seated as deep as I wanted and tried to seat it deeper if memory serves me... I loaded several after that and they turned out fine. This round will not chamber so fire forming it is not possible..
    Lube was OK.... I switched from RN to SP bullets and in a rush skipped a step or two!
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smokey View Post
    Good question Smitty,
    I am pretty sure I ran a bullet in and it put on a moderate crimp - then I decided it was not seated as deep as I wanted and tried to seat it deeper if memory serves me... I loaded several after that and they turned out fine. This round will not chamber so fire forming it is not possible..
    Lube was OK.... I switched from RN to SP bullets and in a rush skipped a step or two!
    I'm just speculating here, as I can't see the case, but if it won't chamber because the shoulder has been expanded from the seating die adjusted for too much on the crimping shoulder, you gotta resize the case. If it's crushed, as in neck pushed down, then it may need fireforming after sizing. If it's really bad, I'd chuck it, or give it to EKC.

    You probably already know that if case length is not uniform, crimping isn't either. Therefore some could be fine, and the longer ones a problem.

    Crimping is good, or can be, but if you do it, it's critical, and nowadays most people recommend it be done as a separate operation.

    I probably wouldn't crimp a 358, so the BODY of my seating die would be adjusted down to where the crimp shoulder is touching the end of a sized and ready to load empty case. THEN, backed off to where it is NOT touching. So it won't cause problems.

    I'm quite capable of seating and crimping at the same time, and don't mind doing it, however, it's much easier to use a Lee Factory Crimping Die.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
    Has it ever occurred to you, that Nothing ever occurs to God? Adrien Rodgers.
    You can't out-give God.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    I'm just speculating here, as I can't see the case, but if it won't chamber because the shoulder has been expanded from the seating die adjusted for too much on the crimping shoulder, you gotta resize the case. If it's crushed, as in neck pushed down, then it may need fireforming after sizing. If it's really bad, I'd chuck it, or give it to EKC.

    You probably already know that if case length is not uniform, crimping isn't either. Therefore some could be fine, and the longer ones a problem.

    Crimping is good, or can be, but if you do it, it's critical, and nowadays most people recommend it be done as a separate operation.

    I probably wouldn't crimp a 358, so the BODY of my seating die would be adjusted down to where the crimp shoulder is touching the end of a sized and ready to load empty case. THEN, backed off to where it is NOT touching. So it won't cause problems.

    I'm quite capable of seating and crimping at the same time, and don't mind doing it, however, it's much easier to use a Lee Factory Crimping Die.

    Smitty of the North
    Hmmm give it to EKC, now that's a head scratcher for sure, I haven't pulled a slick one on that wily rascal in a spell - thanks for the I-de-ar!


    I have a Lee Crimp die and use it for the 358 stuff when I have hvy charges and pretty full cases that may require compacting loads. This time I did not reset die properly after switching bullet types and got an Ooops for my neglect...
    I may slip it in EKC's pocket next time were together and let him run a few circles like a demented squirrel trying to figure out where it came from as that would be a hoot for sure...
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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