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Thread: Sturgeon, Wilde and the State appeal decisions on waterway rights

  1. #21

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    Here's a recent article regarding the topic.....

    http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/...rcraft/410176/

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    Certainly, an interesting case. Skeptical of the characterization of it however, and not ready to take sides. Please clarify: The point of this case revolves around the NPS regulation prohibiting the use of hovercraft, no? How does a prohibition of hovercraft constitute a "loss of access" (outside the specific context of hovercraft on the Nation River within Yukon-Charlie)? A broader loss of access doesn't seem to be the legal argument here. The argument seems to be specific to hovercraft(?), and only on the Nation River(?). So if there is any loss of access, it would only be loss of access via hovercraft on the Nation River within Yukon-Charley. No?
    If you think this will only effect someone with a hovercraft.....guess again.

    The NPS just released draft regs for non-federal oil and gas rights within national park units. In the preamble of the regulations it cites the 9th circuit decision in Sturgeon v Masica as the reason that 103(c) of ANILCA does not apply in Alaska park units. That means if the regs are adopted and Sturgeon does not win at the Supreme Court,then oil and gas development on thousands of acres of Native Corporation lands would be subject to NPS regulations even though it is private lands. This makes Sturgeon an even bigger deal and might mean other ANCSA corporations may lend support to his efforts.

    NPS with stretch the 9th circuit decision as far as they can.



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  3. #23
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    I had lost track of this case. Thanks for the update. I wish Sturgeon and Alaska the best of luck.

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  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKBassking View Post
    I had lost track of this case. Thanks for the update. I wish Sturgeon and Alaska the best of luck.
    Thanks for the wishes but he could use all of our help financially. You can make tax deductible donation to the Alaska Wildlife Conservation Fund. Visit http://www.alaskaoutdoorcouncil.org for the details.
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  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post

    I don't believe any "environmentalists" are a party to this action(?). Please provide citation.
    So if you don't think the environmentalists wackos favor the NPS in the case think again. Check this out.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/edward...b_8317146.html

    God forbid we can no longer mow down our moose....
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  6. #26
    Member Armed_alaskan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halibutgrove View Post
    So if you don't think the environmentalists wackos favor the NPS in the case think again. Check this out.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/edward...b_8317146.html

    God forbid we can no longer mow down our moose....
    As posted by the left wing agenda

    Keep your fingers crossed that the U.S. Supreme Court resists undermining the natural integrity of our national parks and federally designated wilderness areas.
    That is because the highest tribunal in the land has agreed to hear on appeal a case, which if reversed, could conceivably wreak havoc on protected wilderness. Hence, let's trust that a majority of the justices uphold the unanimous lower court ruling. The Ninth Circuit Court held that the National Park Service (NPS) had the authority to bar a plaintiff hunter from using his hover craft to mow down moose on a state-owned section of the Nation River. That was because the state segment was inside the Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve in Alaska.
    NPS justified the ban on the grounds that the hover craft use was incompatible with the purpose and wilderness values of the surrounding National Preserve. The agency cited federal statutory language to legitimize its control over activity on a state inholding. Frankly, acceding to the hunter's petition would be turning a wilderness preserve into a shooting gallery--at least one hopes the Supreme Court will see it that way.
    Undaunted by his lower court defeat, John Sturgeon, the hunter, continues to argue that the NPS regulation does not apply because the six mile portion of the river in question, though smack dab in the middle of the Preserve, is owned by the state of Alaska. Alaskan authorities agreed. They were not happy taking a backseat to the federal government in controlling state-owned territory and joined Sturgeon's lawsuit. Collaboration is not so surprising from a state routinely partial to hunters because of the revenue involved.
    Lurking in the background of this case (Sturgeon vs. Masica et al.) is the larger issue of the limits on state and private property rights when they clash with federal legal restraints in behalf of the national interest.
    If Sturgeon were to get his way, the owners of numerous inholdings in the country's national parks and wilderness areas could cite his judicial success as precedent for their own disruptive projects. Why not allow large scale construction, an air strip, commercial mining operation or other activities totally out of character with surrounding federal lands set aside as wilderness?
    States specializing in commercial harvesting of natural resources and thus, opposed to prohibitions on development of their inholdings in national wilderness, might be emboldened to defy federal restrictions.
    The lower court would have none this, but concurrence by the Supreme Court in dismissing Sturgeon's complaint is no foregone conclusion. A conservative majority has often been partial to states' rights arguments and sided with commercial interests in disputes with Washington.
    The balance between individual rights and collective rights can be a delicate exercise and is on trial in the Sturgeon case. To strike that proper balance, the Supreme Court will have to accept the following premise. When preservation of the nation's unique wilderness heritage is at stake, disruptive commercial activities in the midst of the protected area are out of bounds, even on state and/or privately owned inholdings.

  7. #27
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    Keep your fingers crossed that the U.S. Supreme Court resists undermining the natural integrity of our national parks and federally designated wilderness areas.
    The guy you plagiarized this quote from couldn't have said it better himself!

    Then again, apparently he could have...
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
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  8. #28
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    QUOTE..." The Ninth Circuit Court held that the National Park Service (NPS) had the authority to bar a plaintiff hunter from using his hover craft to mow down moose on a state-owned section of the Nation River." UNQUOTE

    Really? Mow down moose? Sounds like the ramblings of minnesota's state bird.
    Your sarcasm is way, waaaayyyyyyyy more sarcastic than mine!
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  9. #29
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    More loony ramblings.... " When preservation of the nation's unique wilderness heritage is at stake, disruptive commercial activities in the midst of the protected area are out of bounds, even on state and/or privately owned inholdings."
    What hogwash! Our nations lands historically have provided opportunities of many now frowned upon activities that include(d) mining, fishing, hunting, cattle grazing and other uses. Furthermore, restricting/forbidding use of "private" property amounts to seizure of property without due process forbidden in our (now unused) Constitution.
    This is the new interpretation by beaurocraps to lock up as much as they possibly can get away with.
    Your sarcasm is way, waaaayyyyyyyy more sarcastic than mine!
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  10. #30
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cod View Post
    More loony ramblings....
    boy howdy!
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
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  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    The guy you plagiarized this quote from couldn't have said it better himself!

    Then again, apparently he could have...
    And you think you're so smart,,,,,Not....

    As posted by the left wing agenda

    Keep your fingers crossed that the U.S. Supreme Court resists undermining the natural integrity of our national parks and federally designated wilderness areas.
    That is because the highest tribunal in the land has agreed to hear on appeal a case, which if reversed, could conceivably wreak havoc on protected wilderness. Hence, let's trust that a majority of the justices uphold the unanimous lower court ruling. The Ninth Circuit Court held that the National Park Service (NPS) had the authority to bar a plaintiff hunter from using his hover craft to mow down moose on a state-owned section of the Nation River. That was because the state segment was inside the Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve in Alaska.
    NPS justified the ban on the grounds that the hover craft use was incompatible with the purpose and wilderness values of the surrounding National Preserve. The agency cited federal statutory language to legitimize its control over activity on a state inholding. Frankly, acceding to the hunter's petition would be turning a wilderness preserve into a shooting gallery--at least one hopes the Supreme Court will see it that way.
    Undaunted by his lower court defeat, John Sturgeon, the hunter, continues to argue that the NPS regulation does not apply because the six mile portion of the river in question, though smack dab in the middle of the Preserve, is owned by the state of Alaska. Alaskan authorities agreed. They were not happy taking a backseat to the federal government in controlling state-owned territory and joined Sturgeon's lawsuit. Collaboration is not so surprising from a state routinely partial to hunters because of the revenue involved.
    Lurking in the background of this case (Sturgeon vs. Masica et al.) is the larger issue of the limits on state and private property rights when they clash with federal legal restraints in behalf of the national interest.
    If Sturgeon were to get his way, the owners of numerous inholdings in the country's national parks and wilderness areas could cite his judicial success as precedent for their own disruptive projects. Why not allow large scale construction, an air strip, commercial mining operation or other activities totally out of character with surrounding federal lands set aside as wilderness?
    States specializing in commercial harvesting of natural resources and thus, opposed to prohibitions on development of their inholdings in national wilderness, might be emboldened to defy federal restrictions.
    The lower court would have none this, but concurrence by the Supreme Court in dismissing Sturgeon's complaint is no foregone conclusion. A conservative majority has often been partial to states' rights arguments and sided with commercial interests in disputes with Washington.
    The balance between individual rights and collective rights can be a delicate exercise and is on trial in the Sturgeon case. To strike that proper balance, the Supreme Court will have to accept the following premise. When preservation of the nation's unique wilderness heritage is at stake, disruptive commercial activities in the midst of the protected area are out of bounds, even on state and/or privately owned inholdings.

  12. #32
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    And you think you're so smart,,,,,Not....
    I know how to use quotation marks and provide proper citation when I cut and paste something from a publication... You?
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
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  13. #33
    Member Armed_alaskan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    I know how to use quotation marks and provide proper citation when I cut and paste something from a publication... You?
    You're just being a "D" you don't care about this site, you care about your 1 min of fame,,,take a hike lefty.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    You're just being a "D" you don't care about this site, you care about your 1 min of fame,,,take a hike lefty.
    Odd, I see that IOT is a paid member. You're here as an unpaid member.....

    And you opt to degrade him?

    Irony is everywhere.
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
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  15. #35
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    You're just being a "D" you don't care about this site, you care about your 1 min of fame,,,take a hike lefty.
    Let's tick through your accusations, shall we?

    "D" (Democrat?): Nope. FAIL
    "don't care about this site": Incorrect. FAIL
    "1 min of fame": I choose to remain anonymous (not conducive to fame). FAIL
    "lefty": perhaps you're thinking of my father(?). He was left handed; not me. FAIL

    Notice any trend here?

    Here's an idea; you try not to make assumptions about me, and I'll try not to assume you're just a mouth breather.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
    #Resist

  16. #36
    Member Armed_alaskan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaHippie View Post
    Odd, I see that IOT is a paid member. You're here as an unpaid member.....

    And you opt to degrade him?

    Irony is everywhere.
    Yup you're another one of those types (of posters), thinks because someone pays money is the only one with the right to an opinion. Typical left wing agenda at work....again....

  17. #37
    Member Armed_alaskan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    Let's tick through your accusations, shall we?

    "D" (Democrat?): Nope. FAIL
    "don't care about this site": Incorrect. FAIL
    "1 min of fame": I choose to remain anonymous (not conducive to fame). FAIL
    "lefty": perhaps you're thinking of my father(?). He was left handed; not me. FAIL

    Notice any trend here?

    Here's an idea; you try not to make assumptions about me, and I'll try not to assume you're just a mouth breather.
    You failed on all accounts, since you think your posts rule they don't, you're just another rude poster.

  18. #38
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    Boy, someone sure seems like she needs a hug....
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

  19. #39
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    Yup you're another one of those types (of posters), thinks because someone pays money is the only one with the right to an opinion. Typical left wing agenda at work....again....
    Do you see the world as black and white, right and left? Do you believe that anything you don't/can't/won't understand, or that which doesn't fit your closed minded, myopic view is "typical left wing agenda"? Do you understand irony?
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
    #Resist

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armed_alaskan View Post
    You failed on all accounts, since you think your posts rule they don't, you're just another rude poster.
    Seriously though, you are the one who is coming off as pretty rude. Telling him to take a hike because your frustrated he is educated enough to understand plagiarism (even if it's minor) and called you out on it.

    Man keep that hate and fear to yourself the negativity is killing me reading some of your posts lately.

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