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Thread: AK Ray: Boat Design Help

  1. #1
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    Default AK Ray: Boat Design Help

    AK Ray,
    Would like to touch base with you to discuss waterfowl boat design. Looking to build my own.
    Thank you!

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    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    Go ahead and ask. I minimize my time on the forum these days, will help you out here where others can get the info.

    If you want seriously good input, visit the duck hunters boat page forum. Over there we have stockpiled huge amounts of info and build photos of all kinds of boats used for waterfowl ing.

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    Appreciate the reply and will check the boat page as suggested.

    Trying to sort thought the merits of different designs for my application and I'm in the vertical portion of the learning curve. Have looked at the Gatorboats Duckhunter, hybrids, Kara, devlin's plans, etc. and trying to answer questions regarding their capability and my needs. Brand new to duck boats and waterfowling and trying to do this right the first time.

    Strongly considering a Jon boat with a prop and a few seasons of waterfowling to simply figure out what it is that I do need. As mentioned, this is a new world and a quite exciting one at that.

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    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    First off, what kind of water are you going to hunt?

    Shallow water with weeds calls for flat bottom and some kind of mud motor. You can get by with a variety of hulls and motors, but to take full advantage of the changing conditions - mudd lake low water - you need something that can handle the worst stuff you may encounter.

    You and a dog or two guys and a dog? Or just you?

    Will you ever want to drag it into some place?

    Will you ever want to use it for fishing rivers?

    Having more than one boat is always best. Getting a Jon is a good idea for a starter. Make sure it's a wide one so that its stable for when the dog jumps out.

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    I will be hunting the lakes, rivers and backwaters of Eastern Washington and the Idaho Panhandle. The vast majority of the rivers and backwaters are dam controlled and the water drops throughout the fall and into winter in preparation for spring runoff. Lots of shallow water and milfoil and there will be ice to deal with later in the season.

    I hunt with a dog and would like the ability to take my 14 yo son. If possible, I'd like to be able to take a friend and my son even if that means hauling in a layout boat or boats.

    It may need to get dragged/pushed across shallows in order to get into the next pocket of water to hunt.

    Yes, I would use the boat to fish rivers as well as the same lakes I'll be hunting for bass, pike etc.

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    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    Sounds like good water for a devlin black brant 3. It's a semi displacement hull that flattens out at the stern so that you can plane at 25 to 30 depending on your load. It has just enough rocker left to provide some sea stability in a following sea. It's not as stabile as a true BBSB but pretty nice in most lake conditions.

    With a light motor you can drag it over most stuff as long as the boat has enough water to float.

    It hunts two men nicely, and could handle a third as long as you watched the total weight.

    If you want something just for two people - small people - then the blue bill would work. It would be even easier to haul around in the marsh. Same basic design as the BB3.

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    Don't underestimate the EBADS by four rivers layout boats. If you local and want to see one.. Let me know. Very similar to allot of the older style classical layout boats. Extremely stable and tough as nails.. I researched duckboats for years prior to making this purchase, and believe there is nowhere I can't go.
    President of Alaska Waterfowl Assoc.
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    And God said, let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

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    How does the Black Brant III perform with a mud motor? In order to access many of the hunting areas guys are using mud motors in order to get through the milfoil, mud/sand and ice. I'd love to run an outboard, but I am not certain I can access everything is like to hunt running an outboard.

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    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    The BB3 will work OK with a lite mud motor. That is the problem, as there are limited choices that will not over weight the stern of a BB3 and still get it to perform. A 12 or 14 HP copperhead would be as big as you can go based on weight. You would still need 12 to 14 inches of water for the hull. The forward section goes fairly deep to make the design stable and perform.

    Guys have put 23HP mud buddies on one and it sucked. They just looked at the 25Hp design rating and assumed that a 200 pound motor would function on a boat designed for a 125 pound outboard.

    If you really need a mud motor you need a flat bottom hull to get full performance out of the motor. For a home built boat your best choice is a Duck Hunter. Check out Toller boats. Brad builds a modified version that works very well with short shaft motors. The design is easy to change, and you have to for a mud motor.

    If you are frequently breaking ice you may just want to stick to a metal boat. Fiberglass over wood can work but you are doing yearly maintenance to keep it in good shape.

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    Appreciate the insight, thank you. Lots to consider and lots to learn.

    If only time and money were no object...

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    FL Gator
    I dont know your plans for your motor or how much $$ you have but this year I built a longtail that was based off some of the more popular motors on the market for under $500. However I did have the 11hp motor which was free so the total cost was stil under a $1K. If you have the skills or desire to build a motor PM me and I will give you my plans parts list and any advice/lessons learned. I have mine mounted on a 16 flat and it pushes me along fully loaded with dog, decs, and two guys around 10 mph, empty with two guys 14mph. Good luck Oh and if your building your lay out boat I would be interested in your design.

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    Ray,
    Do you think a 6.5hp Tecumseh scavenger backwater surface drive would work on the marsh boat /layout boat you willed to me a couple yrs ago?

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    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKMarmot View Post
    Ray,
    Do you think a 6.5hp Tecumseh scavenger backwater surface drive would work on the marsh boat /layout boat you willed to me a couple yrs ago?
    That might be kind of heavy for the foamer. But that would depend on the load it was carrying. Back then I was pretty heavy - 260 dressed for hunting - and the back deck would be just awash. So if your less than that a 80 to 100 pound motor would not sink the boat. I'd be real careful turning sharp with a long tail. The foamer may not react the same way as a MoMarsh and tip.

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    Flgator,

    for what it's worth I used to own a duckhunter made of wood glass... It was the most stable boat I have ever hunted out of...had a 25 merc on it... I "6'1'' 350" at the time could put a knee on the brush rail and climb in without getting close to tipping it over... But it was heavy as a whores heart... It would float in ankle deep water... Found out the hard way... I would love to have one made out of aluminum... It would disappear almost anywhere with some brush...

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