Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: 182 TW Conversion

  1. #1
    Member BARTFRNCS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Anchorage, Alaska
    Posts
    47

    Default 182 TW Conversion

    Anyone here had this done? Looking at it for a 59 182. What are the real costs? Really looking for the gotchas.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    3,293

    Default

    A 182 with manual flaps is a spectacular performer as it is. What do you expect to gain?

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Wasilla, AK
    Posts
    262

    Default

    I considered it about ten years ago. Fortunately I was talked out of it and bought a 180 instead. I don't remember how much the cost was but when I compared the cost of the 182 plus conversion it was more than a 180. The resale value was less as well.

  4. #4
    Member Float Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kachemak Bay Alaska
    Posts
    4,218

    Default

    As mentioned a 182 with healthy tires is a good performer. And if it has a float kit, there are a lot more lakes than land-able gravel bars.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  5. #5
    Member BARTFRNCS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Anchorage, Alaska
    Posts
    47

    Default

    It is my understanding that the nose gear is very weak in older 182s? Float, how big are we talking about tire wise? Just looks like an option when a 59 180 with no corrosion and a float kit is some serious change. I would have a hard time justifying 100k to 130k to land off airport.(Why I don't own a super cub)

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    3,293

    Default

    Put an Airglas nose fork on and you can go big on the mains and use an 850 on the nose. 850x10s on the mains with an 850x6 on the nose will get you into most places Cubs go. A good friend drives just such a beast and it's impressive. With the big fork and an 850x6 you can use Bushwheels on the mains, too.

  7. #7
    Member AK-HUNT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Valley
    Posts
    1,029

    Default

    Here's a "Gotcha" you were asking for: You can't use 180 stc's. Its still a 182 on the certificate. (skis/floats/tailwheels......)

    Theres an outfit here that has used the hell out of 182's for years and used them hard. I don't think I take my 180 anywhere I wouldn't take a 182. We need the 180 for skis. If I were wheels/floats only then a 182 would be fine and a 206 better.

    If ya want a 180, buy the 180 though. They're great.
    100-130K for a 180?? Not buying it. There are 4 decent ones on Alaskaslist for $85k and under. And a $60k cub the other day.

  8. #8
    Member Float Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kachemak Bay Alaska
    Posts
    4,218

    Default

    If ya want a 180, buy the 180 though. They're great.
    As usual AK-Hunt hit the nail on the head. That is for sure.

    I am currently leaning that way myself. Depending on what the bank says.
    So far the couple that are in my price range either are too close to TBO for commercial work or timed out by being more than 12 years since a major. But for personal use that would not be a deal breaker.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    3,293

    Default

    TBO for commercial work? Part 121 or 135? I didn't think flight school operators were governed by those parts. Isn't your flight school operating a part 91 aircraft?

  10. #10
    Member Float Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kachemak Bay Alaska
    Posts
    4,218

    Default

    A hand prop Cub has to be 91. But I am considering an additional 135 opportunity.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  11. #11
    Member Sierra Hotel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Chugiak
    Posts
    637

    Default

    If you're looking to convert a 182 to TW - the economics aren't there, at least in my little world. Adding a float kit to a 182 alone is a $25K "opportunity", and I think it's Seaplanes West that has the STC. And that's before you buy the floats . . . $38K for a new set of Aerocets . . .

    Just checked, they do - this from their website:

    Complete Airframe Float Package Installed: 19,200.00
    Kit is 10,500.00 shipped.
    An economical variation of the same Float Kit: 2,000.00 less, (this kit modifies your original engine mount - adapted for floatplane operations, our new mount is not includedhere)
    EDO floats: Basic 182 attaching gear $4,200

    I'd love to add the float kit - with the PPonk engine my '58 has the hp to be a good performer on floats - I just can't stomach the $25K to put it on floats . . . .

    The OP made mention of the nosewheel on the 182 - it's a well documented issue. Not because of any problem with the nosewheel itself, but because it attaches to the firewall, and has been a source of numerous accidents involving a prop strike. Carry additional power on final, and there is sufficient elevator authority to keep you from "wheel-barrowing" the plane, which is a large source of the nosewheel failures, according to The Cessna Pilot's Association 182 Buyer's Guide.

    I have 8.50's on the mains and a 6" on the nose with a larger fork, and the plane is far more capable than the pilot.

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anchorage
    Posts
    3,293

    Default

    Put it into perspective. Most of us know guys who've ground looped a taildragger. Few will have known anyone who had an unearned nose gear failure. If you need to go into a rock quarry with scattered boulders maybe a Cub on 35s would serve you better. For average operators, including average off airport ops, a Cessna nose dragger works well. The only tricky issue I ever had with my nose dragger was getting a seaplane (long) prop approved on tires. For that the 180 has an advantage.

  13. #13
    New member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    3

    Default

    If you are not going to be on skis or out pioneering new strips. The 182 is a fantastic machine. In and out of 500 feet with half tanks and two people, a great wheel plane. If you need the capabilaties of a 180 pick up a 180 and be happy.

  14. #14
    Member BARTFRNCS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Anchorage, Alaska
    Posts
    47

    Default

    Couple of things come to mind What does a float rating entail training wise? Why aerocets when EDOs are so much cheaper? What about winter?

  15. #15
    Member Float Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kachemak Bay Alaska
    Posts
    4,218

    Default

    There is not a required time for a float-rating in the FARs.
    It is an additional class and/or category rating so it requires a check-ride (including oral) with an FAA designated examiner or an FAA examiner.

    So if you go to a certain place down in the desert where the examiner owns the business, you might get 3 or 4 hours of flight training on a big reservoir which will only give you training on one water condition. Whatever that happens to be that day...
    And you will only training to pass that check-ride.

    OR......... Some place like Vern Kingsford's in Moose Pass, or my little one man outfit,,,, will give you 10 hours in various water conditions and on various lakes.

    In-The-Air-Flying on floats is not all that different from wheels.
    The big difference comes in when you do things like glassy water landings, rough water landings, plow taxi turns in high wind, power-off sailing, power on sailing, step turns in confined areas, and little things like docking and beaching.


    xxxxxxxxxxx

    As for the Aerocet vs Edo question. I have flown both and I like them both in different situations. For a heavy loaded C-206 or even a heavy C-185, I really like Aerocet 3500s. They have lots of floatation, the cables are all inside and the top of the floats is flat and wide like a plastic dock. And they have huge cargo hatches that close flush so your customers do not trip and fall in the water. They go like hell off the water as long as you have a straight path. And they do not leak, at least not much.

    For an older lightweight C-180 on floats I really like EDO 2870s, They are a lot less expensive and they let a C-180 step turn like crazy. If you need to do a 180 degree step turn on glassy water to sling-shot your C-180 out of a one-way only lake exit they are hard to beat. The same goes for blasting around river bends on the step or one float curving landings. Plus 2870s are shorter than say the 2960 models and as a result they seem less prone to drag the heels when you need to apply a high angle departure right after you break free of the water.


    Send me an e-mule and I will send you a free draft of my old seaplane training manual.


    dragonfly@alaska.net
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  16. #16
    Member Float Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kachemak Bay Alaska
    Posts
    4,218

    Default

    As a partial answer to your PM.

    FAA SES practical test Standards:

    Task E: Taxiing and Sailing (ASES)

    References: FAA-H-8083-23; USCG Navigation Rules;
    International−Inland; POH/AFM.
    Objective: To determine that the applicant:
    1. Exhibits satisfactory knowledge of the elements related to
    water taxi and sailing procedures.
    2. Positions the flight controls properly for the existing wind
    conditions.
    3. Plans and follows the most favorable course while taxiing or
    sailing. Considers wind, water current, water conditions,
    and maritime regulations, as appropriate.
    4. Uses the appropriate idle, plow, or step taxi technique.
    5. Uses flight controls, flaps, doors, water rudder, and power
    correctly so as to follow the desired course while sailing.
    6. Prevents and corrects for porpoising and skipping.
    7. Avoids other aircraft, vessels, and hazards.


    Normal Seaplane Takeoff and Climb:
    1. Establish optimum step attitude.
    2. Maintain positive directional control at all times.
    3. Accelerate to and maintain Vy, +10/-5 knots private, +/- 5 knots commercial
    4. Maintain takeoff power until at a safe altitude.

    Common errors, 1. Failure to lift the water rudder. 2. Not pulling the stick all the way back at start of water run. 3. Keeping the stick too far back while trying to get on the step. 4. Digging bow of floats into water with too much forward stick pressure. 5. Failure to recognize and to correct porpoising. 6. Failure to use right rudder to compensate for torque. 7. NOT CLEARING THE AREA BEFORE BEGINNING TAKEOFF RUN.

    Normal Approach and Landing:
    1. Determine and consider wind direction, surface condition, water depth, vessels and debris.
    2. Select most suitable approach path, landing and touchdown area.
    3. Maintains a stabilized approach and maintains recommended approach speed, with gust factor applied. +10/-5 knots private, +/- 5 knots commercial.
    4. Makes smooth, timely and correct control applications during round-out and touch- down.
    5. Remains aware of wind shear and wake turbulence.
    6. Touches down at recommended airspeed and pitch attitude, and beyond and within 200 feet of a specified point for commercial.
    7. Completes post landing checklist.

    Common Errors, 1. Pitch too high on touchdown, causing rear of floats to hit hard and slam nose down. 2. Airspeed too high on landing resulting in a skip. 3. Stalling before contacting the water. 4. Landing with nose down pitch which causes floats to dig into water. 5. Misjudging landing area size and getting into some place you canít get out of again.

    Rough Water Approach and Landing:
    1. Consider wind and surface conditions. Water depth, vessels and debris.
    2. Select suitable approach path and touchdown area.
    3. Establish recommended approach speed, pitch and land configuration.
    4. Maintains stabilized approach at recommended airspeed (or 1.3 Vso) +10/-5 private +/- 5 knots commercial
    5. Makes smooth, timely and correct control applications during round-out and touchdown.
    6. Maintains crosswind correction and directional control throughout approach and landing.
    7. Remains aware of possibility of wind shear and wake turbulence.
    8. Contacts the water in correct pitch attitude and correct touchdown speed, consider- ing the type of rough water.
    9. Maintains positive control after landing. 10.Completes post landing checklist.

    Common Errors: 1. Allowing the plane to stall above the waves and fall into a trough between them. 2. Allowing the nose to drop and digging the floats into the waves. 3. Failure to recover from a bounce off the waves and ending up at stall speed, pitched up over rough water.

    Rough Water takeoff and Climb:

    1. Establish and maintain optimum step attitude.
    2. Maintain positive directional control at all times.
    3. Accelerate to maintain Vy (best rate of climb) +10/-5 private +/-5 commercial.
    4. Maintain takeoff power until a safe maneuvering altitude is reached.

    Common Errors: 1. Allowing plane to stall back into the waves ,by pitching up to soon for the aircraft speed. 2. Allowing the floats to dig in during step phase. 3. Bouncing into the air too soon from a wave top.

    Glassy Water Approach and Landing:
    1. Determine and consider wind direction, surface condition, water depth, vessels and debris.
    2. Selects most suitable approach path, landing and touchdown area.
    3. Establishes recommended approach and landing configuration and airspeed, ad- justs power while maintaining proper attitude.
    4. Maintains a stabilized, SLIGHTLY NOSE-HIGH, approach at recommended airspeed. (50 mph in later phase) +10/-5 knots private +/- 5 knots commercial.
    5. Makes smooth, timely and correct control applications during round-out and touchdown.
    6. Maintains directional control throughout approach and landing.
    7. Completes post landing check list.

    Common Errors: 1. Flying into the water due to depth perception problems. 2. Fixating on the airspeed. 3. Not maintaining a constant descent rate with the throttle. 4. Failure to close the throttle on touchdown 5. Failure to apply small amount of back pressure during touchdown. 6. Not accounting for considerable distance used for Glassy water landings.
    7. Failure to keep the wings level on approach. 8. Failure to use shoreline as a reference for altitude. 9. Failure to recognize another (less glassy) area as a better place to go.


    Glassy Water Takeoff and Climb:
    1. Establish optimum step attitude. 1a. Maintain positive directional control at all times.
    2. Accelerate to and maintain Vy, (55 mph for NC-98445) +10/-5 knots private, +/- 5 knots commercial
    3. Maintain takeoff power until at a safe altitude.

    Common Errors: 1. Failure to establish a positive rate of climb and striking the water again. 2. If attempting the aileron roll onto one float method, rolling too far and striking the wing on the water. 3. Failure to account for the much longer distance needed to takeoff. 4. Failure to select an area with more wind and wave action. 5. Failure to consider roughing up the water to assist takeoff. 6. Not setting a No-Go point to abort the takeoff.

    Crosswind Approach and Landing:
    1. Determine and consider wind direction, surface condition, water depth, vessels and debris.
    2. Select most suitable approach path, landing and touchdown area.
    3. Maintains a stabilized approach and maintains recommended approach speed, with gust factor applied. +10/-5 knots private, +/- 5 knots commercial.
    4. Makes smooth, timely and correct control applications during round-out and touch- down.
    5. Remains aware of wind shear and wake turbulence.
    6. Maintains proper crosswind correction.
    7. Touches down at recommended airspeed and pitch attitude, and beyond and within 200 feet of a specified point for commercial. (400 feet private)
    8. Completes post landing checklist.

    Common Errors: 1. Pitch too high on touchdown, causing rear of floats to hit hard and slam nose down. 2. Airspeed too high on landing resulting in a skip. 3. Stalling before contacting the water. 4. Landing with nose down pitch which causes floats to dig into water. 5. Misjudging landing area size and getting into some place you canít get out of again. 6. Not allowing the upwind float to touchdown first with aileron deflection. 7. Attempting to turn into the wind while still on the step with too much speed, causing the up-wind wing to lift and when added to centrifugal force from turn flips the plane over.

    Crosswind Takeoff and Climb:
    1. Establish optimum step attitude.
    2. Maintain positive directional control at all times.
    3. Accelerate to and maintain Vy, +10/-5 knots private, +/- 5 knots commercial
    4. Maintain takeoff power until at a safe altitude.

    Common errors, 1. Failure to lift the water rudder. 2. Not pulling the stick all the way back at start of water run. 3. Keeping the stick too far back while trying to get on the step. 4. Digging bow of floats into water with too much forward stick pressure. 5. Failure to recognize and to correct porpoising. 6. Failure to use right rudder to compensate for torque. 7. NOT CLEARING THE AREA BEFORE BEGINNING TAKEOFF RUN. 8. Must Recognize Two methods of holding the drift. A. Use the water rudders down to help hold you on a straight course during early phase of takeoff run. Then use aileron to roll into the prevailing wind and opposite rudder. This increases the drag but give a straight course. B. Water rudders up while heading downwind, let the plane start to weathervane and apply power before the 90 degree point. Then allow the plane to curve slightly on the takeoff run by using aileron and limited rudder to reduce drag.

    Confined Area Approach and Landing:
    1. Consider wind and surface conditions. Water depth, vessels and debris.
    2. Select suitable approach path and touchdown area.
    3. Establish recommended approach speed, pitch and land configuration.
    4. Maintains stabilized approach at recommended airspeed 55 mph (or 1.3 Vso) +10/-5 private +/- 5 knots commercial
    5. Makes smooth, timely and correct control applications during round-out and touchdown.
    6. Remains aware of wind shear and wake turbulence.
    7. Maintains proper crosswind correction.
    8. Touches down at recommended airspeed and pitch attitude, and beyond and within 100 feet of a specified point for commercial, 200 for private
    9. Maintains positive post landing control.
    10. Completes post landing checklist.

    Common Errors: 1. Pitch too high on touchdown, causing rear of floats to hit hard and slam nose down. 2. Airspeed too high (from diving into the area) on landing resulting in a skip. 3. Stalling before contacting the water. 4. Landing with nose down pitch which causes floats to dig into water. 5. Misjudging landing area size and getting into some place you canít get out of again. 6. Excessive maneuvering at low altitude, Touching down in a bank and striking a wing. Scaring the heck out of the DPE.

    Confined Area Takeoff and Climb:
    1. Positions aircraft for maximum utilization of available takeoff area.
    2. Establishes and maintains optimum step attitude.
    3. Maintains step attitude during turning takeoff and corrects for porpoising and skip- ping.
    4. Maintains positive directional control.
    5. Accelerates to and maintains Vx (50 mph in NC-98445) +10-/-5 private, +/- 5 commercial.
    6. Clears specified obstacle by at least 50 feet.
    7. Maintains takeoff power until at a safe maneuvering altitude, then sets climb power.
    8. Accelerates to and maintains Vy (55 mph) after clearing obstacle.
    9. Heads for escape path through low terrain OR Continues spiraling climb at safe air- speed while maintaining vigilance for other traffic and obstacles. (Wind drift figured)

    Common Errors: 1. Failure to use all of the available takeoff area. 2. Failure to get On The Step as soon as possible. 3. Falling Off The Step while turning. 4. Attempting to rotate prematurely and loosing speed. 5. Attempting to pull up out of ground effect to quickly and stalling back into the water. 6. Failure to maintain Vx until the obstacle is cleared. 7. Failure to turn around or away from obstacles. (Or Uncoordinated turns) 8. Failure to retract water rudders which causes more drag. 9. Failure to clear the area and inspect for any floating or submerged obstacles in the water prior to the takeoff run. 10. Failure to establish a personal abort takeoff point. 11. Leaving the Carb Heat on from the previous landing which reduces available horsepower. (this applies to all takeoffs and is a common error)


    Forward Slips to a landing:
    1. Performs adequate survey of the intended landing area. (on any landing)
    2. Determines wind direction and strength.
    3. Selects most suitable approach path and touchdown area.
    4. Establishes slipping attitude at a point from which a landing can be made using the recommended approach and landing configuration and airspeed.
    5. Adjust pitch and power as required.
    6. Maintains desired ground track while in the slip.
    7. Makes a smooth transition from the slip to a normal round-out and touchdown.
    8. Touches down at, or within 400 ft (private) (200 commercial) past the selected touchdown spot.
    9. Maintains directional control on then water. 10. Performs a post landing checklist.

    Common Errors: 1. Nose high slip causing a spin.
    2. Failure to maintain a stabilized slip. 3. Inappropriate removal of the hand from the throttle. 4. Improper procedure during transition from slip to touchdown attitude. 5. Poor directional control after touchdown.

    180 degree Power-Off Accuracy Approach and Landing:
    1. Exhibits knowledge of the elements related to a power-off 180 degree accuracy ap- proach and landing.
    2. Considers the wind conditions, landing surface, obstructions and debris. Selects an appropriate landing area.
    3. Positions the aircraft on a downwind leg, parallel to the landing area and not more than 1000 ft AGL.
    4. Abeam the specified touchdown point, closes the throttle and establishes the ap- propriate glide speed.
    5. Completes final aircraft configuration.
    6. Touches down in a normal landing attitude (depending on water conditions) at or within 200 feet beyond the specified touchdown point (commercial)
    7. Completes the appropriate checklist.

    Common Errors: 1. Failure to establish approach and landing configuration at the proper time. 2. Failure to identify key points in the pattern. 3. Failure to establish a stabilized approach. 4. Failure to consider the effect of wind and landing surface. 5. Improper use of power or trim. 6. Improper procedure during round-out and touchdown. 7. Failure to hold stick back after touchdown. 8. Loss of directional control after touchdown.

    Emergency Approach and Landing:
    1. Exhibits Knowledge of the elements of to an emergency approach and landing.
    2. Analyzes the situation and selects the appropriate course of action.
    3. Establishes and maintains the recommended best glide airspeed +/- 10 knots.
    4. Selects a suitable landing area.
    5. Plans and follows a flight pattern to the selected landing area considering altitude, wind, terrain and obstructions.
    6. Prepare for landing, or goĖaround as specified by the examiner.
    7. Follows the appropriate checklist.

    Common Errors:
    1. Improper airspeed control. 2. Poor judgment in the selection of an emergency landing area. 3. Failure to estimate the wind speed and direction. 4. Failure to fly the most suitable pattern for existing conditions. 5. Failure to accomplish the emergency checklist. 6. Undershooting or overshooting the selected emergency landing area.

    Systems and equipment Malfunctions:
    Exhibits knowledge and remedial action for the following.
    1. Smoke, fire or both during flight or ground operations.
    2. Rough running engine or partial power loss.
    3. Loss of engine oil pressure.
    4. Fuel starvation.
    5. Engine overheat.
    6. Carburetor or induction icing.
    7. Door and window opening in flight.
    8. Inoperative trim.
    9. Water rudder malfunction.
    10. Structural Icing.
    11. Emergency Egress if inverted in the water.
    12. Use of PFD.

    Anchoring:
    1. Selects a suitable area for Anchoring.
    2. Describes the procedure for Anchoring in a lake, river or tidal area.
    3. Describes the number of Anchors and lines to be used to ensure seaplane security.
    4. Describes the hazards to be avoided.
    5. Describes the requirements for anchoring lights.

    Docking and Mooring:
    1. Exhibits knowledge of the elements related to docking and mooring.
    2. Approaches the dock or mooring buoy in the proper direction considering speed, hazards, wind, and water current.
    3. Ensures seaplane security.

    Ramping and Beaching:
    1. Exhibits knowledge of the elements related to ramping and beaching.
    2. Approaches the ramp or beach considering persons and property in the proper atti- tude and direction, at a safe sped, considering water depth, tide, current and wind.
    3. Ramps or beaches and secures the aircraft in a manner that will protect it from harmful effects of wind, waves, and changes in water level.

    AIRPORT AND SEAPLANE BASE OPERATIONS
     A. Radio Communications and ATC Light Signals (ASEL
    and ASES)
     B. Traffic Patterns (ASEL and ASES)
     C. Airport/Seaplane Base, Runway, and Taxiway Signs,
    Markings, and Lighting (ASEL and ASES)

    Task H: Water and Seaplane Characteristics (ASES)
    Reference: FAA-H-8083-23.
    Objective: To determine that the applicant exhibits satisfactory
    knowledge of the elements related to water and
    seaplane characteristics by explaining:
    1. The characteristics of a water surface as affected by
    features, such asó
    a. size and location
    b. protected and unprotected areas.
    c. surface wind.
    d. direction and strength of water current.
    e. floating and partially submerged debris.
    f. sandbars, islands, and shoals.
    g. vessel traffic and wakes.
    h. other features peculiar to the area.
    2. Float and hull construction, and their effect on seaplane
    performance.
    3. Causes of porpoising and skipping, and the pilot action
    required to prevent or correct these occurrences.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  17. #17

    Default



    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

  18. #18

    Default

    Wouldnt convert my 182 to tailwheel. Would have bought a 180 or 185. Airglass is coming out with an stc for nice ski set up soon. Wheels? This is what I have planned.

    I dont own that one but I heard it performs well with those tires

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •