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Thread: Weighted sockeye fly

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    Default Weighted sockeye fly

    So I know it is a common topic to discuss hook size, circle hooks, fly color, and so forth when it comes to kenai sockeye flys. My questions is what about weight. If I understand correctly we can fish up to to a 1/4 oz fly. Do I want to tie flies as close to that number as possible? I have read that this helps in not snagging and obviously helps getting the fly down faster. What are your thoughts? Heavier better or not? Thanks!

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    The goal is to get the leader down.... that's what it takes to be successful at flossing reds.

    1/4 oz is WAY heavy.

    Weighting your fly to 1/4 oz will result in a HUGE amount of downtime retying flies lost to the bottom.
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    As I recall our flossing days, our best bet was a bare, 2/0 hook on a four-foot leader behind the appropriate weight for the water. Anything on the hook—feathers, bucktail, yarn, etc.—only makes it harder to get the hook down.

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    I use a 3-4 ft leader with a 2/0 or 3/0 gamakatsu with a small bit of yarn and one plastic bead. No weight up there. I went all last season on the kenai without foul hooking a fish. The drift come into play here as well but I've found with a longer or shorter leader or the weight in the wrong spot (too close to the hook) foul hooks are gonna happen more often.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
    As I recall our flossing days, our best bet was a bare, 2/0 hook on a four-foot leader behind the appropriate weight for the water. Anything on the hook—feathers, bucktail, yarn, etc.—only makes it harder to get the hook down.
    So is it just at the Russian that it needs to be a fly (technically)? Is a bare hook is legal for flossing in the lower Kenai?

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    Quote Originally Posted by traveler View Post
    So is it just at the Russian that it needs to be a fly (technically)? Is a bare hook is legal for flossing in the lower Kenai?
    I don't think a bare hook is legal. It has to have some sort of "attractant" on it. Yarn qualifies as such.
    Makin fur fins and feathers fly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by traveler View Post
    So is it just at the Russian that it needs to be a fly (technically)? Is a bare hook is legal for flossing in the lower Kenai?
    The regs say the following under Kenai River gear restrictions "In flowing waters, beads fished ahead of flies, lures, or bare hooks must be fixed within 2" of the hook or be free sliding on the entire length of the line or leader."

    The way i read this is that "IF" i use a bead, it must be fixed ahead... blah, blah, blah. I see no restrictions on using a bare hook.

    In the section on the Russian River there is an additional requirement that "Only one unbaited, single hook, artificial lure is allowed year around. The gap between point and shank must be 3/8" or less." The bold emphasis is bold in the reg book - not added by me.

    So to answer your question, i believe that it is legal to use a bare hook in the Lower Kenai River. If you're fishing the Russian River you must use an artificial lure with a 3/8" gap or less. If anyone knows better, please post it up because i've been fishing the Lower Kenai for years with a bare hook.
    English is an odd language. It can understood through tough thorough thought, though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aces-n-eights View Post
    The regs say the following under Kenai River gear restrictions "In flowing waters, beads fished ahead of flies, lures, or bare hooks must be fixed within 2" of the hook or be free sliding on the entire length of the line or leader."

    The way i read this is that "IF" i use a bead, it must be fixed ahead... blah, blah, blah. I see no restrictions on using a bare hook.

    In the section on the Russian River there is an additional requirement that "Only one unbaited, single hook, artificial lure is allowed year around. The gap between point and shank must be 3/8" or less." The bold emphasis is bold in the reg book - not added by me.

    So to answer your question, i believe that it is legal to use a bare hook in the Lower Kenai River. If you're fishing the Russian River you must use an artificial lure with a 3/8" gap or less. If anyone knows better, please post it up because i've been fishing the Lower Kenai for years with a bare hook.
    I believe that means if you are using a BEAD above a bare hook it must be attached or free to move.

    Im having trouble locating the reference in the regs but Im pretty sure there is a statement in there somewhere that defines what constitutes a "lure" and its not supposed to be only a bare hook.

    Im sure someone knows exactly where its at or can interject with the proper reference here.
    Makin fur fins and feathers fly.

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    Without regard for the hook size question on those waters, here are some practical experiences with weighted flies for reds-

    If you're flossing- putting a shot above the fly and leading the leader through the fish's mouth, fuggedabout the weighted fly. Your fly beyond the shot is going to be dingling along on the bottom below the fish.

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    I usually just adjust my weight using split shot. If the water is really fast, I add more weight until I get down to where the fish are. If the water is real slow, I might take off the split shot altogether. Just depends on the spot I'm fishing in. But I think you really got to get the fly right in front of their faces to get a hook up. At least that is my experience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
    As I recall our flossing days, our best bet was a bare, 2/0 hook on a four-foot leader behind the appropriate weight for the water. Anything on the hook—feathers, bucktail, yarn, etc.—only makes it harder to get the hook down.
    I agree with this, i was using a bare hook on a river recently flossin reds and i was slayin them, shoulder to shoulder fishing then i was accused of cheating by using a bare hook, some of the other fishermen told me it was illegal though i was still hooking them in the mouth. Is this a legal means of fishing? I did not see anything against it in the regs.

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    It's not necessarily the fly you need to get in their face.... ONLY the leader. The more you can keep that leader perpendicular to the flow and down at fish level just off the bottom, the greater the odds of threading your way between breathing jaws..... FISH ON!
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
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    Ok well my bad, i should of read some previous posts as the bare hook issue was already discussed, i believe it is legal, i talked to a fish and game dude also and he said that there is no clear definition of it being illegal in the regs

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    It's not necessarily the fly you need to get in their face.... ONLY the leader. The more you can keep that leader perpendicular to the flow and down at fish level just off the bottom, the greater the odds of threading your way between breathing jaws..... FISH ON!
    THIS! +1. I learned this technique from an old timer down on the kasilof. He was slaying some fish and we got to talking and he showed us his rig and technique. No looking back.

    I accomplish this by slowly pulling the entire rig back towards me from start to finish on the drift. I turn a little side ways, back upstream, cast out about 25 degrees up stream and start pulling the rod tip towards me so that when I finish the drift its almost inline with me.

    It probably sounds complicated but its really not and it works like a charm. Keeping that leader straight ends up in lots of hook ups and fair hooked fish at that.
    Makin fur fins and feathers fly.

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    yup. i turn my body facing down river at an angle then move the rod towards the bank as the fly drifts down.

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    Default Weighted sockeye fly

    Weighted flies for flossing takes away from the success of flossing.

    Flossers/liners/ fish Dentists got Sooooooooo good in NY they enacted a leader law. No moving weight allowed and the leader couldn't be longer than four feet.

    I knew guys who would run leaders as long as their noodle rods.

    When I was younger (and didn't know any better , hey I just wanted to fight fish) I would floss fish with a sliding weight and a leader at least five feet long. Then again in some of our creeks and rivers we could see the fish.

    I have since grown up and go after fish that bite. Unless it's slow and I see a red on the Russian then it is game on! Just kidding.

    Also, circle hooks aren't designed for flossing. Just use a short shank egg style or octopus hook.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CTobias

    Also, circle hooks aren't designed for flossing.
    Says who?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    It worked for you. Congrats. Doesn't mean it will work for everyone. It is still snagging, and I was merely pointing out techniques I used when I didn't know any better.

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    No disrespect, but going to circles would go a LONG ways toward cleaning up a fishery that maims a lot of unharvested fish. Yes a flossery IS a snaggery.... and like you, I would much rather fish over biters than NON-biters. Give me a day backtrolling pinks over flossing reds ANY day!
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
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