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Thread: Ling Cod caught by having Rockfish in their mouth

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    Member ocnfish's Avatar
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    Default Ling Cod caught by having Rockfish in their mouth

    I tried to start a thread on the AK State Troopers thread ... old alaskan pilot says "nojoy" ... beyond my rank or privilidge.

    In another thread I brought up this topic.

    If you keep a Ling attached to a Rockfish ... don't talk about it at the docks ... State reg says you can use parts of the dead sportfish but not the whole live fish. Fish & Game officer told me this ... not trying to hijack thread or be the computer cop but I think this is good info.. This was all I could find on AK Sport Fish site.

    Use of sport-caught fish as bait: (1) Whitefish, herring, and other species for which no seasonal or harvest limits are specified in 5 AAC 47 - 5 AAC 75, as well as the head, tail, fins, and viscera of legally taken sport fish, may be used for bait or other purposes. (2) Herring and other species of fish for which no seasonal or harvest limits are specified in 5 AAC 47 - 5 AAC 75 may be used as live bait, except that live fish may not be used as bait for sport fishing in fresh water. (3) Live bait may be possessed, transported, or released only in the salt waters or the regulatory area in which it was taken.

    Do I have it wrong? I always thought that if you used a live sportfish to catch another sportfish you were in violation of the law. Perhaps not?

  2. #2

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    I do think you have it wrong. You didn't catch a rock fish then reposition or add a hook and then send it back down as bait in hopes of hooking up with a big ling. You simply hooked a fish and in the process of reeling it in, it was hit by a ling or halibut or whatever. In my eyes, these are two distinctly different things..the former has a specific practice and intent attached to it. The latter is simply a stroke of luck lacking any intent and that equates to a double dinner if you are fortunate enough to boat both fish. I do believe, though, that the rock fish, no matter how mangled it may have become due to the ling or halibut or whatever strike, is now part of your rock fish limit.

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    Member Frostbitten's Avatar
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    If you hook a rockfish, but instead of reeling it in right away, you let it swim around for a while, then a ling grabs it and you feel in both fish......still a legal way to fish for lings?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frostbitten View Post
    If you hook a rockfish, but instead of reeling it in right away, you let it swim around for a while, then a ling grabs it and you feel in both fish......still a legal way to fish for lings?
    That's interesting..I would think that action would demonstrate intent to use the rock fish as bait, albeit hard to prove in court. I've caught several lings while dutifully reeling in rock fish, but I have never hooked a rock fish and fiddled around in hopes that Moby would happen by and chomp it. I need to call ADFG on another matter and will add this to the quiz list.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frostbitten View Post
    If you hook a rockfish, but instead of reeling it in right away, you let it swim around for a while, then a ling grabs it and you feel in both fish......still a legal way to fish for lings?
    Nope. Checked it out a few years ago and that was the answer.

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    Member ak_cowboy's Avatar
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    That reg says you can't use live bait in fresh water. I don't see salt water mentioned anywhere.

    sent from my igloo

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    Quote Originally Posted by ak_cowboy View Post
    That reg says you can't use live bait in fresh water. I don't see salt water mentioned anywhere.

    sent from my igloo
    Read part one of the regulation. Last I checked, there was a limit to rockfish.

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    Thanks OCNFISH for bring this up in a different thread. This has become the hot topic at work in the last few days. My best argument is this. The Ling Cod usually is not caught on the hook itself but merely just hanging onto the rockfishes body. So when someone is reeling a rockfish in then suddenly feels extra weight, i usually grab the gaff. Now if there happens to be a ling attached to the rockfish just sitting there. I will the "Snag" Him with my Gaff. The fish would then be my limit since i am the one who "snagged him". if it happens again, well i will just hand the gaff over to a person with zero lings for the day.

    There you have it, joes theory on the Ling caught by rockfish grey area, i hope you all have enjoyed...

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    Member ocnfish's Avatar
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    This is where in the reg that I get concerned about breaking the law ...

    "as well as the head, tail, fins, and viscera of legally taken sport fish, may be used for bait or other purposes"

    This implys to me that the whole fish and not just certian parts from a legally caught sport fish is NOT legal.

    Which brings up the question of Salmon Shark fishing with whole dead Pink Salmon?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ocnfish View Post
    This is where in the reg that I get concerned about breaking the law ...

    "as well as the head, tail, fins, and viscera of legally taken sport fish, may be used for bait or other purposes"

    This implys to me that the whole fish and not just certian parts from a legally caught sport fish is NOT legal.

    Which brings up the question of Salmon Shark fishing with whole dead Pink Salmon?
    You can use commercially caught fish for bait for salmon shark. So if you buy it off a comm boat its bait. But I would keep the receipt

    Sent while hiding from the boss

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    Quote Originally Posted by ocnfish View Post
    This is where in the reg that I get concerned about breaking the law ...

    "as well as the head, tail, fins, and viscera of legally taken sport fish, may be used for bait or other purposes"

    This implys to me that the whole fish and not just certian parts from a legally caught sport fish is NOT legal.

    Which brings up the question of Salmon Shark fishing with whole dead Pink Salmon?
    Theres a definition in the regs that states that pink & chum salmon may be used as bait. Page 7, the section is titled "Use of Sport-Caught Fish as Bait". On other types of salmon, only the heads, tails, viscera may be used.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jojomoose View Post
    Thanks OCNFISH for bring this up in a different thread. This has become the hot topic at work in the last few days. My best argument is this. The Ling Cod usually is not caught on the hook itself but merely just hanging onto the rockfishes body. So when someone is reeling a rockfish in then suddenly feels extra weight, i usually grab the gaff. Now if there happens to be a ling attached to the rockfish just sitting there. I will the "Snag" Him with my Gaff. The fish would then be my limit since i am the one who "snagged him". if it happens again, well i will just hand the gaff over to a person with zero lings for the day.

    There you have it, joes theory on the Ling caught by rockfish grey area, i hope you all have enjoyed...
    ...however, just because you are in salt water, doesn't mean snagging is legal. Check page 18 (among others) of the regs.

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    Member Frostbitten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jojomoose View Post
    Thanks OCNFISH for bring this up in a different thread. This has become the hot topic at work in the last few days. My best argument is this. The Ling Cod usually is not caught on the hook itself but merely just hanging onto the rockfishes body. So when someone is reeling a rockfish in then suddenly feels extra weight, i usually grab the gaff. Now if there happens to be a ling attached to the rockfish just sitting there. I will the "Snag" Him with my Gaff. The fish would then be my limit since i am the one who "snagged him". if it happens again, well i will just hand the gaff over to a person with zero lings for the day.

    There you have it, joes theory on the Ling caught by rockfish grey area, i hope you all have enjoyed...
    Additionally, the method you describe doesn't meet the definition of sport caught fish: Sport fishing may be conducted only by use of a single line attached to not more than one plug, spoon, spinner or series of spinners, or two flies or two hooks.

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    When I worked on a charter boat, we would always let the Lings go when they came up with a rock fish. My understanding is that the rock fish has now become live bait and you caught a ling on a sport fish. It doesn't matter if the ling is hooked or not.
    I'll check the snagging definition but Im pretty sure it says "hook" not gaff. fine line there i know

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    Quote Originally Posted by coho slayer View Post
    Read part one of the regulation. Last I checked, there was a limit to rockfish.
    Daily limit, not seasonal.

    Read the fine print it the first section. Where it says "Herring.... other species without a seasonal limit may be used as bait. AS WELL AS fins, heads, etc... "

    "(4)Live bait may be possessed, transported, or released only in the salt waters of the regulatory area in which it was taken " page 4 of the regs.

    sent from my igloo

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    Just read the AKDFG fishing reports - it says it in plain black and white - illegal.

    http://www.alaskaoutdoorjournal.com/...resurrect.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullelkklr View Post
    Just read the AKDFG fishing reports - it says it in plain black and white - illegal.

    http://www.alaskaoutdoorjournal.com/...resurrect.html
    I don't see anything in ur link that states lings can't be caught while attached to a rockfish. I don't see the black and white here.
    And I see that u need a line to sport fish. Makes hole in my theory. But what would a trooper say? That is what I wanna know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jojomoose View Post
    I don't see anything in ur link that states lings can't be caught while attached to a rockfish. I don't see the black and white here.
    And I see that u need a line to sport fish. Makes hole in my theory. But what would a trooper say? That is what I wanna know.
    If you were out in saltwater (let's say you were fishing for lings) and a school of salmon swam by the boat, do you think a trooper would consider it legal to just scoop them up with a net/gaff them?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jojomoose View Post
    I don't see anything in ur link that states lings can't be caught while attached to a rockfish. I don't see the black and white here.
    And I see that u need a line to sport fish. Makes hole in my theory. But what would a trooper say? That is what I wanna know.
    Check out the second bullet item at the top. "It is illegal to use a rockfish for bait while fishing for lingcod. If you catch
    a rockfish and a big lingcod grabs a hold of it the lingcod must be released."

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    Member jojomoose's Avatar
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    I like your argument frost bite. And that does make the most sense to me. Looks like I might have to find something else. Hmmmm what about a snag hook on a "line" keep it handy then hand snag them. If u are in snagable waters. I do forfeit the loss on just gaffing them. But hand line would be legal from what I am seeing. Unless someone had proof u were purposely using rockfish as actual bait.

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