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Thread: Is it time for an "ALASKA Wilderness License" or loose 5 yrs of PFD....???

  1. #1

    Default Is it time for an "ALASKA Wilderness License" or loose 5 yrs of PFD....???

    If we are going to have Alaskans putting full faith and trust in "Cell Phones" & Personal Locator Beacons, Satellight phones, and other equipment for tracking and communicating their time Off-Hwy. Maybe we need a "Basic Wilderness Survival License" to leave the safety of towns and road systems.

    And if you need to be rescued and "DON"T have the basic survival lic. then you loose five years of your Alaska Permenent Fund Dividend to Alaska Search & Rescue.

    Times have changed.......maybe we need a useful mandatory course in Jr. & High Schools that teach survival. If you need to pass a course to hunt with a Bow & Arrow, or operate your boat, or operate aircraft, why should Snowmachines be exempt.

    Was a time that a man would crawl out of the wilderness rather than ask for help, was a time NO One would be caught without everything they needed to survive in the wilderness, both skills and equipment.

    Clearly something needs to change........What passes for an Alaskan Outdoors Man today is not what it was 50 years ago, today we rely on battery powered gadgets to compensate for lack of skills and common sense.

    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Alaskans are have shifted responsability from themself to others for their rescue.

  2. #2

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    Meanwhile last week.......................


    http://gma.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs...opstories.html

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    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Alaskans are have shifted responsability from themself to others for their rescue.
    This applies to far many more than only Alaskans !

    We do not need more bureaucracy, but I would be all for billing the recipients of SAR efforts. That aside, people have the right to go out into the wilderness, fail, and die.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by .338WM View Post
    This applies to far many more than only Alaskans !.................... people have the right to go out into the wilderness, fail, and die.
    YEP.............http://omg.yahoo.com/blogs/celeb-new...171739275.html

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    I think cell phones have led to the pussification of our culture. You can simple call or push a button and here comes the copter without any retribution for stupidity. Just like some businesses are "too big to fail," people feel like they pay taxes and the government should bail them out of emergencies...

    Don't they bill or require a deposit for thrill seekers trying to climb McKinley?

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    Search and rescue is not something new anywhere in the world, even in Alaska. Men risked their lives to save Nome and get serum to them. The Coast Guard has saved hundreds of Alaskans in harrowing conditions. Don Sheldon, Cliff Hudson, Bob Reeve and dozens of other bush pilots searched and rescued people all the time. This all happened before cell phones. Pilots have been mandated to carry ELT's since 1973 and they have saved hundreds of lives. Do pilots with ELT's get a free pass because they are some special class of people? The people that do S&R know the risks and they still sign up for it. I was in the S&R business for a few years and I had zero issues with people calling for help.
    Bunny Boots and Bearcats: Utility Sled Mayhem

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    Quote Originally Posted by tccak71 View Post
    I think cell phones have led to the pussification of our culture. You can simple call or push a button and here comes the copter without any retribution for stupidity.

    I think I just found a good signature line............

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    I should clarify my thoughts about billing for SAR. Our tax base includes these services as per "public safety", but in cases where SAR, or for that matter 911, is not clearly warranted or justifiable, then payment for services or a fine commensurate to the resources expended would be in order, IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AGL4now View Post
    If we are going to have Alaskans putting full faith and trust in "Cell Phones" & Personal Locator Beacons, Satellight phones, and other equipment for tracking and communicating their time Off-Hwy. Maybe we need a "Basic Wilderness Survival License" to leave the safety of towns and road systems.

    And if you need to be rescued and "DON"T have the basic survival lic. then you loose five years of your Alaska Permenent Fund Dividend to Alaska Search & Rescue.

    Times have changed.......maybe we need a useful mandatory course in Jr. & High Schools that teach survival. If you need to pass a course to hunt with a Bow & Arrow, or operate your boat, or operate aircraft, why should Snowmachines be exempt.

    Was a time that a man would crawl out of the wilderness rather than ask for help, was a time NO One would be caught without everything they needed to survive in the wilderness, both skills and equipment.

    Clearly something needs to change........What passes for an Alaskan Outdoors Man today is not what it was 50 years ago, today we rely on battery powered gadgets to compensate for lack of skills and common sense.

    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Alaskans are have shifted responsability from themself to others for their rescue.

    Sounds like a great philosophy in principle, until you are the one by yourself with a broken leg in the wilderness. I guess we ought to just say a prayer and wait for the ravens, huh?

    Reminds me of a saying my father in law has: " Theres no such thing as an atheist in a foxhole"

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by dkwarthog View Post
    Sounds like a great philosophy in principle, until you are the one by yourself with a broken leg in the wilderness. I guess we ought to just say a prayer and wait for the ravens, huh? "
    NO in the 0ld days, you just set the splint on yourself, and walk or crawl home to dinner. But ypou are correct.......I would say a prayer, and eat the Ravens.

  11. #11

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    I can see that there is people that go through life doing every thing perfectly and no bad luck ever happens to this type of person. This type of person would have it all covered if when flying the engine quit,or when boating hit somthing in the water and sunk the boat. There are stupid mistakes in all walks of life and in all activites but even when you think that you have everything covered there could be a time and place that you would need help.So never think that you would not ask for help.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Bend View Post
    I can see that there is people that go through life doing every thing perfectly and no bad luck ever happens to this type of person. This type of person would have it all covered if when flying the engine quit,or when boating hit somthing in the water and sunk the boat. There are stupid mistakes in all walks of life and in all activites but even when you think that you have everything covered there could be a time and place that you would need help.So never think that you would not ask for help.
    As a Commercial Pilot and professional PA-18-150 driver I have disabled more than a few Stupid Cubs in the bush. It just seems like a different mindset today. But it may appear otherwise BUT I am just trying to save lives.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by AGL4now View Post
    Ifwe are going to have Alaskans putting full faith and trust in "CellPhones" & Personal Locator Beacons, Satellight phones, and otherequipment for tracking and communicating their time Off-Hwy. Maybe we need a "BasicWilderness Survival License" to leave the safety of towns and roadsystems.

    And if you need to be rescued and "DON"T have the basic survival lic.then you loose five years of your Alaska Permenent Fund Dividend to AlaskaSearch & Rescue.

    Times have changed.......maybe we need a useful mandatory course in Jr. &High Schools that teach survival. If you need to pass a course to hunt with aBow & Arrow, or operate your boat, or operate aircraft, why shouldSnowmachines be exempt.

    Was a time that a man would crawl out of the wilderness rather than ask forhelp, was a time NO One would be caught without everything they needed tosurvive in the wilderness, both skills and equipment.

    Clearly something needs to change........What passes for an Alaskan OutdoorsMan today is not what it was 50 years ago, today we rely on battery poweredgadgets to compensate for lack of skills and common sense.

    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Alaskans are have shiftedresponsability from themself to others for their rescue.
    I totally agree on getting a wilderness license. Here are a few of therequirements I think they should have to weed out a few of people who shouldn't have the license and have no business in the wilderness.
    1.) You may have never wrecked a plane, because clearly people who have wrecked a plane are at high risk of demanding help from Search and Rescue personal (S&R).
    2.) Be less than 55 years of age. Clearly anybody over the age of 55 is too old to be out in the wilderness. These people have an increased risk of heart attack and just might lose their mind which will demand S&R. It's not fair to the S&R guys to have to take that risk.




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    Member sayak's Avatar
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    I don't know about a license to be out in the wilderness. Folks should be a little more conscious of the fact that they put other people's lives on the line when they need to be rescued. Perhaps this story could be used to drive this point home.
    There doesn't seem any real shame in calling in the cavalry anymore. At one point people were embarrassed by the prospect of having to be rescued.
    Some years ago, I and a couple other guys didn't show up from a hunting trip on time. A storm had come up, and my wife got worried, so she called local air services to keep an eye out for us. Probably not a bad idea in retrospect, but so embarrassing because we were OK, just sitting it out on a beach with all the gear we needed. We had words when I got home because in those days people would tease you hard about having to be looked for or rescued.
    Search folks know what they sign up for. People who go out into circumstances where there is an element of danger should know what they are up against also. People put too much stock in technology and not enough in common sense and preparation.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Russp17 View Post


    I totally agree on getting a wilderness license. Here are a few of therequirements I think they should have to weed out a few of people who shouldn't have the license and have no business in the wilderness.
    1.) You may have never wrecked a plane, because clearly people who have wrecked a plane are at high risk of demanding help from Search and Rescue personal (S&R).
    2.) Be less than 55 years of age. Clearly anybody over the age of 55 is too old to be out in the wilderness. These people have an increased risk of heart attack and just might lose their mind which will demand S&R. It's not fair to the S&R guys to have to take that risk.




    I can live well with those rules.............I am retired from driving "Stupid Cubs". And I have no interest in being found in the wilderness at my age. I would much prefer to be bear scat, or wolf poop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Russp17 View Post


    I totally agree on getting a wilderness license. Here are a few of therequirements I think they should have to weed out a few of people who shouldn't have the license and have no business in the wilderness.
    1.) You may have never wrecked a plane, because clearly people who have wrecked a plane are at high risk of demanding help from Search and Rescue personal (S&R).
    2.) Be less than 55 years of age. Clearly anybody over the age of 55 is too old to be out in the wilderness. These people have an increased risk of heart attack and just might lose their mind which will demand S&R. It's not fair to the S&R guys to have to take that risk.



    Heck, the best requirement in my mind would be to send anyone who wished a wilderness license, out in to the wilderness for a week, those who return unaided get a license, those who do not return or require SAR do not get-or need- a license .

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    Quote Originally Posted by AGL4now View Post
    If we are going to have Alaskans putting full faith and trust in "Cell Phones" & Personal Locator Beacons, Satellight phones, and other equipment for tracking and communicating their time Off-Hwy. Maybe we need a "Basic Wilderness Survival License" to leave the safety of towns and road systems.

    And if you need to be rescued and "DON"T have the basic survival lic. then you loose five years of your Alaska Permenent Fund Dividend to Alaska Search & Rescue.

    Times have changed.......maybe we need a useful mandatory course in Jr. & High Schools that teach survival. If you need to pass a course to hunt with a Bow & Arrow, or operate your boat, or operate aircraft, why should Snowmachines be exempt.

    Was a time that a man would crawl out of the wilderness rather than ask for help, was a time NO One would be caught without everything they needed to survive in the wilderness, both skills and equipment.

    Clearly something needs to change........What passes for an Alaskan Outdoors Man today is not what it was 50 years ago, today we rely on battery powered gadgets to compensate for lack of skills and common sense.

    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Americans living in Alaska rely on others for their rescue.
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  18. #18

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    You know, I can't let this go without stirring the pot.....

    If you are "for" "qualifying" someone to be by themselves on public land....then I presume you have no problem with background checks on people to ensure their mental capacity to own a firearm, Yes?

  19. #19
    Moderator bkmail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AGL4now View Post
    If we are going to have Alaskans putting full faith and trust in "Cell Phones" & Personal Locator Beacons, Satellight phones, and other equipment for tracking and communicating their time Off-Hwy. Maybe we need a "Basic Wilderness Survival License" to leave the safety of towns and road systems.

    And if you need to be rescued and "DON"T have the basic survival lic. then you loose five years of your Alaska Permenent Fund Dividend to Alaska Search & Rescue.

    Times have changed.......maybe we need a useful mandatory course in Jr. & High Schools that teach survival. If you need to pass a course to hunt with a Bow & Arrow, or operate your boat, or operate aircraft, why should Snowmachines be exempt.

    Was a time that a man would crawl out of the wilderness rather than ask for help, was a time NO One would be caught without everything they needed to survive in the wilderness, both skills and equipment.

    Clearly something needs to change........What passes for an Alaskan Outdoors Man today is not what it was 50 years ago, today we rely on battery powered gadgets to compensate for lack of skills and common sense.

    Start flaming me.........But you can't deny that Alaskans are have shifted responsability from themself to others for their rescue.
    Guess you hang out with the wrong crowd.....I have been unfortunate and made it home w/out assistance. I think your reading too many internet stories instead of being out in woods living your life and minding your own business.
    Please don't go around asking for more regulations and rules......
    My .02 cents.
    BK

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by bkmail View Post
    Guess you hang out with the wrong crowd.....I have been unfortunate and made it home w/out assistance. I think your reading too many internet stories instead of being out in woods living your life and minding your own business.
    Please don't go around asking for more regulations and rules......
    My .02 cents.
    BK

    You are correct.........I should be out in the woods MORE.......Thank you for pointing that out, I will start today.

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