Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 70

Thread: Non-Resident Big Game Guides-- Why?

  1. #1
    Member 907pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Palmer
    Posts
    488

    Default Non-Resident Big Game Guides-- Why?

    I am not trying to get in a fight here, but can somebody please explain why there are so many non resident big game guides in Alaska? This has recently came up on some other threads but in an attempt to not hijack those threads I wanted to start a new one.

    I would like to hear opinions on non resident game guides verses resident game guides. One person mentioned to me that the only reason master guides hire non residents is because they will work for half the price that any alaskan will. Is this true? Is this the only reason?

    I don't know all of the guiding rules. Is it just as easy for an out of stater to be an guide and assistant guide as is is for a resident? What are the requirements differences for res/non-res?

    Can a non-resident just come up here and guide? To hunt they have to wait a year in Alaska, but I hear that they can come up here and just start guiding as an assistant guide without any waiting period. Is this true?

    Your comments, knowledge and opinions are appreciated.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Juneau
    Posts
    1,098

    Default

    Nobody is required to wait a year to hunt when coming to Alaska. But the non-res license and tag fee prove to be cost prohibitive for most. Also, non-res guide fees are higher than resident guide fees.

    I would guess that for many non-res that come up to work a season as an assistant guide it's the same reason that non-res folks come up to hunt in AK. If your dream is to see the Alaskan wilderness and hunt Alaska's wildlife you have limited choices. Move to AK, pay a lot for a trip as a non-res (for those than can afford this trip it's typically a once in a lifetime hunt), or get a job as an assistant guide. If you're cash strapped and want to hunt in AK but don't care about the trophy for yourself, get a job as an assistant guide. See beautiful country, hunt trophy game, get paid.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

  3. #3
    Member 907pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Palmer
    Posts
    488

    Default

    Akboater, Thanks for the info. How much is the difference between resident and non-resident guide fees?

  4. #4
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Wrangell
    Posts
    7,600

    Default

    Its like a barber living in Florida having a Alaska barbers license for summer time and also hold a license in Florida for winter. I don't like it but thats the way it is.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

  5. #5
    Member bushrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Now residing in Fairbanks from the bush
    Posts
    4,363

    Default Commerce Clause

    This issue has come up many times in the past on the management forum. The gist of it is that the constitution forbids individual states from banning residents of another state to work there. So, whether a doctor, lawyer, pipefitter, barber, or a guide who is a non-Alaskan, Alaska cannot ban those workers from working here. What they can legally do, however, is charge higher licensing fees for non-residents, and they can have their own state licensing standards.

    A nonresident still must go through the same licensing requirements as a resident. There is no difference there. So for example, in the case of wanting to be an assistant guide, the requirements are that one must be 18 or older, has legally hunted big game in the state of Alaska during two calendar years, possess a valid first aid card, have a written recommendation from a registered guide outfitter who intends to employ you, and meet the eligibility provisions in AK statute (like no criminal history etc). The licensing fee for a resident is $350, for a nonresident it is $600.

    As far as the other questions the OP had, individual guides pay differing wages, and I don't think that non-resident assistants necessarily will work for half the wages a resident would. Though sure that could happen.

    This issue is a tough one because of our unique Alaskan laws (and lack of!) that mandate a nonresident must hire a guide for goat, sheep, and brown/grizzly bear...so we have nonres guides out there guiding for those species while that same nonres guide him or herself cannot hunt those same species without being under the purview of another guide (even a nonres guide! <grin>). And that we have absolutely no limits on the overall # of guides who can operate in the state.

    Believe it or not, even with higher nonres licensing fees, cost of air travel or driving back and forth to Alaska each season, it's usually (but not always) a lot cheaper to be a nonres guide. Cost of living in the lower 48 is much cheaper. So this, along with there being no limits on overall guides, and the built in business for goat, sheep, and brown/grizzly bear, places quite an impact on resident guides who are trying to stay afloat. And that sucks. But it is what it is and until the system is changed it's going to continue.

  6. #6
    Member 907pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Palmer
    Posts
    488

    Default

    Bushrat, Thanks allot for your write up. It is interesting to me that to be an assistant guide you had to have hunted big game in Alaska for two calendar years. Do allot of these guides hire them as packers for two years to fill that requirement? Would being a packer for a guide even qualify as time spent hunting?

  7. #7
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Wrangell
    Posts
    7,600

    Default

    Yep packing and general camp help will work as time served. There is a test before the license is issued though.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,919

    Default

    I think what a lot of you forget by simply reading what the state requires is that any respectable guide is in no way going to put his rep on the line to hire some out of stater who don't know squat... I worked with an out of state guide during sheep season and he was a better alaska sheep hunter then most and a great guy to represent and promote Alaska hunting...

  9. #9
    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Palmer, AK
    Posts
    11,415

    Default

    It is far more lucrative for an out of state guide to work in AK than a resident to work up here full time. It's more than just cost of living, the fact is that a guide who lives down south can guide elk, mule deer, whitetail, antelope etc all the way through Jan and in some areas add exotics or hogs even later than that. They can do that while living at home with a family then hit AK for spring bear camp before going back south to work on deer leases all summer at home. Hit fall bear/sheep/moose/caribou in AK then back home to start elk/muleys/antelope/whitetail etc all over again. We simply don't have a long trophy big game season in Alaska. Plenty of hunting yes, but the long seasons are generally non-trophy focused like antler-less hunts that bring no guided hunter interest.

  10. #10
    Member muskeg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Hollis
    Posts
    963

    Default

    Non- Alaska residents work in most Alaskan industry. Some years back when logging was going big most loggers were non-AK-res. Even the bosses and contractors. Take a look now .. commercial fishing, cannery workers, oil, mining, and even sport fishing guiding. Many if not the majority of those industries work force is non-AK-residents.

    http://www.dced.state.ak.us/occ/pub/BGCSStatutes.pdf

    You can go to this link and review all the requirements and fees and other law pertaining to hunting Guides.

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Soldotna
    Posts
    1,131

    Default

    Its not about competence. A talented guide from Florida having equal access to fish and game that is in Alaska just isnt right. We have no income tax and neither does Florida. That guide is paying all his money and property taxes in Florida using our fish and game. We live here in Alaska and miss out on hunting opportunities due to out of state residents and the profits go to out of state guides. We need to quadruple out of state license and tag fees like every other state does.
    “I come home with an honestly earned feeling that something good has taken place. It makes no difference whether I got anything, it has to do with how the day was spent. “ Fred Bear

  12. #12

    Default

    How do you think the hawaii locals feel when we come by the hoards to lay around on their beaches or the californians feel when we pay the same price at Disnyland. Or those florida guys who have some alaskan resident that guides fish charters all winter. Every state's resident hunters complain about non-residents from my experience. Keep in mind you as an Alaska resident have the longest seasons, can hunt the most game, and have the lowest tags fees of any state i'm aware of. We should be thankful for that! And quadrupling the tag fees wont stop all the hunters just allow the rich guys like I cater to, a edge over then ones who can't afford it. But I hear ya and its a bummer. Its America land of the free so feel free to go warm up on their beaches and catch their fish too!

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Juneau
    Posts
    1,098

    Default

    If you really wanna stick it to'em go fish saltwater. Any east coast state I've fished did not require a fishing license for saltwater.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

  14. #14
    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Beaver Fork
    Posts
    3,853

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hunttolive View Post
    How do you think the hawaii locals feel when we come by the hoards to lay around on their beaches or the californians feel when we pay the same price at Disnyland.
    Or those florida guys who have some alaskan resident that guides fish charters all winter. Every state's resident hunters complain about non-residents from my experience. Keep in mind you as an Alaska resident have the longest seasons, can hunt the most game, and have the lowest tags fees of any state i'm aware of. We should be thankful for that! And quadrupling the tag fees wont stop all the hunters just allow the rich guys like I cater to, a edge over then ones who can't afford it. But I hear ya and its a bummer. Its America land of the free so feel free to go warm up on their beaches and catch their fish too!


    Being called an Alaskan Guide, when in fact one is NOT an Alaskan, is not only disingenuous, it is, to many Alaskans, an insult.

    But I'm sure you have all locals on your staff, correct?
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

  15. #15
    Premium Member kasilofchrisn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Central Kenai Peninsula
    Posts
    4,886

    Default

    Personally I would like to see non-resident guides pay a higher fee just like I would like the non-resident slope workers,comm fishermen,etc. pay a small tax.
    I would also like them to have to state that they are non-residents on their websites and brochures etc.
    At least if it was there for the public to see they could decide for themselves who to hire resident or not.
    "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

    "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

  16. #16
    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Beaver Fork
    Posts
    3,853

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kasilofchrisn View Post
    Personally I would like to see non-resident guides pay a higher fee just like I would like the non-resident slope workers,comm fishermen,etc. pay a small tax.
    I would also like them to have to state that they are non-residents on their websites and brochures etc.
    At least if it was there for the public to see they could decide for themselves who to hire resident or not.

    Precisely.
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

  17. #17
    Member 4merguide's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kenai Peninsula, Alaska
    Posts
    9,748

    Default

    What is this "training course approved by the board"...??? Years ago all I had to do was take a written test. I thought they did away with that and all you needed now was a guide recommendation. But I guess you have to take, and pass this course? Has anyone here taken it? I'm just curious as to what it's all about....
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

  18. #18
    Member scott_rn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    power commuting twixt the valley and anchorage
    Posts
    803

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hunttolive View Post
    How do you think the hawaii locals feel when we come by the hoards to lay around on their beaches or the californians feel when we pay the same price at Disnyland. Or those florida guys who have some alaskan resident that guides fish charters all winter. Every state's resident hunters complain about non-residents from my experience. Keep in mind you as an Alaska resident have the longest seasons, can hunt the most game, and have the lowest tags fees of any state i'm aware of. We should be thankful for that! And quadrupling the tag fees wont stop all the hunters just allow the rich guys like I cater to, a edge over then ones who can't afford it. But I hear ya and its a bummer. Its America land of the free so feel free to go warm up on their beaches and catch their fish too!
    Actually, Californians do pay less for Disneyland.

    I am torn on this subject, how many of you folks who live here in Alaska year round want to be guides - or commercial fishermen? I only get two weeks off each summer, I am not particularly interested in spending my summer vacation time finding and packing big game animals for strangers - or picking reds out of nets. The descriptions AGL4NOW gives of guiding sound miserable. So if not enough of us Alaska residents want to/can guide (or fish or narrate the train rides), what is wrong with nonresidents filling that market? Is it because the money doesn't stay here? Because it takes away from the subsistence meat you provide for your household?
    My only gear sponsor is the salvation army - Dick Griffith

  19. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,919

    Default

    Ive been somewhat on both sides of this(no never been a non res guide)..many years ago I was offered a heck of a job for a well known out of state guide and simply turned it down as not to get a rep(rep and who your work or worked for is everything in the buisness) of working for an out of state guide... Then as the years went buy I have seen some of the better guides out there were out of staters just tryin to make a living.. Very few make a living in the guide buisness with out supplemental income.. No different then some of the Alaskan guides headin out of state for work.. I honestly dont think many hunters really care where you are from just as long as you are experienced.. I have NEVER had a hunter ask me if I was a resident but everyone I can think of has asked me what my experience was..just sayin

  20. #20
    Member martentrapper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Fairbanks, Ak.
    Posts
    4,191

    Default

    I think there is enough angst against guides in general on this forum that we should have a new "I Hate Guides" forum. Probably help a bunch of members get a load off their chest!!
    Mr. Strahan?
    Oh, Bushrat could be the Moderator!
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
    I have less friends now!!

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •