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Thread: Better Motor & Jet Drive Combination

  1. #1

    Default Better Motor & Jet Drive Combination

    I am contemplating the purchase of a 19 or 20 foot sled and am not sure which would make a better inboard combination: (1) 320 hp or 350 hp AT SD 309, or (2) 200 hp Sport Jet, or (3) 320 hp / 350 hp Hamilton 212. Assuming everything is equal: deadrise, boat weight, etc. are there opinions about what would make a better inboard combination, considering reliability, maintenance and performance?

  2. #2
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    It really depends on the "Sled" in my opinion. Are you from the Northwest, Portland area by chance? It seems folks call a Jet Boat a Sled down there just like the snow machine vs snow mobile thing.

    A fine debate to be had for sure. To clarify. The 320/350 HP motor would be a chevy inboard 305.

    What, no diesel?????

    Let us know what you will be using the boat for. Load hauling, speed, shallow water, salt and river combo etc... and you will have questionable opinions aplenty I am sure.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outaways View Post
    I am contemplating the purchase of a 19 or 20 foot sled and am not sure which would make a better inboard combination: (1) 320 hp or 350 hp AT SD 309, or (2) 200 hp Sport Jet, or (3) 320 hp / 350 hp Hamilton 212. Assuming everything is equal: deadrise, boat weight, etc. are there opinions about what would make a better inboard combination, considering reliability, maintenance and performance?
    The Hamilton 212 is by far the best pump of the three jets your considering.

  4. #4

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    From what I read I am inclined to agree. But my concern is boat balance. A V8 with either an SD309 or a 212 could be considered somewhat heavy unless one was planning on running near WOT which is near impossible in 2' to 3' chop or long 6' rollers. As a result, should I be looking at the SJ200 or am I off base here?

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    Member tjm's Avatar
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    if you're planning to run in 2' or 3' chop very often you don't want a sport jet...

    if you're worried about too much weght in the rear go wider or move some stuff forward a bit in the boat, gear or helm, either will work
    ------------------------------------------------
    pull my finger....

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    A lot of your choice of pump engine decision should be based on your geographic location you are going to run. In Alaska in a 19 to 20 foot boat where silt in the river combined with trash in the spring I would run a three stage. You can tailor a three stage with different nozzles from a 92mm to 106 and the impellers from a 19-degree to a 27. The 212 just have different impeller choices. The 3 stage will hold better in white water and less cavitation than a 212. This is due to the total combined blade length. I have run 3 stage pumps for 35 years and have never come off plane due to trash in the pump. I ran my first engine over three thousand hour in front of a 3 stage. I think the longevity is due to the fact of very little cavitations. With the right impeller and nozzle combinations the 3 stage has as much push as 212. The price and being American made makes the 3 stage a clear choice.

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    I had no idea what the American Turbine jets were all about so I cruised their web sight. It looks like they are about 1/2 the price of a Hamilton 212. Not sure what the price difference is from the 773 and clones though. Also, I would love to know what the performance differences are from the 212.

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    The 212 is expensive and it is designed to push heavy loads. With the correct impellor it handles white water as well as a 3 stage. If it didn't all the big boat names in the Pacific Northwest would still be running 3 stage jets. You can get different size nozzles for it as well as a trimable nozzle.

    The American Turbine jets are made for speed and do not have a good track record digesting common river debris or pushing a lot of weight.

    The 3 stage is a tried and true jet unit that can be setup with a variety of impellor and nozzle options like rivercj brought up. The key is finding the correct combination for your boat and use, which can take a lot of trial and error and more than a fee bucks in parts.

  9. #9

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    If I were looking today I would be looking strongly at the American Turbine SD231 Jet.

    You can read more about it here:
    http://meanchicken.net/webmain/forum...?f=102&t=10350

    Sounds like a nice US replacement for the Hamilton 212, cost less as well.

  10. #10

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    Thanks to all of you for your input. I will run the boat in the Great Lakes from a marina with 18” to 24” inches of water over a sand-silt bottom to an outpost 5 miles away. No rivers, on occasion long 6’ rollers or a 3’ chop, but most often 1’ to 2’ chop and may encounter the occasional sandbar with as little as 6” of water, but most likely 12” to 16” over it. Hole shot would be over the 18” to 24” sand-silt bottom. Payload would be 6 plus supplies for 3 to 4 days. Will encounter the odd small floating weed mass after a serious blow and may cruise over weed beds 12 inches below the surface. Top end speed is unimportant and would like to cruise at about 3000 to 3500 rpm - 25 mph or thereabouts and not get too beaten up by the chop. Suspect the 14 degree dead rise and 72” bottom would be best. There seem to be many engine and drive combinations available and despite the number of SJ 200's being offered in the 19’ to 20’ range, I am not convinced that they are ideal for what I believe I need. Have heard that the 212 may vacuum the bottom in the marina and on takeoff. As for 3-stage pumps, who makes and what engine combination might work? Suggestions, advice & experiences would be of interest. Thanks.

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    That is not what I was expecting you were going to use the boat for. I don't know what I was expecting really, but that was not it.

    So, you are looking for a shallow running lake boat to haul a serious load. 6 people that is 1200#, and gear another 600#. Plus gas and what ever else you are bringing to do what ever you are doing. So maybe 2500-3000 pounds? And you want a relatively shallow hole shot of 18 inches. You are looking for two contradictory things. The ability to go in shallow water with a heavy load and cut waves in the lake. Which one is more important to you? Shallow running or comfort. Any jet boat worth it's salt will run in 6" of water on silt, it is the hole shot you are asking a lot of.

    Hole shot boats: 9 deg or less deadrise type boats like the Sea Arc, Alaskan XL, SJX, the new XP, Phantom, extreme shallow. They haul a load and don't submarine like the deeper V boats on take off. They do well with the sport jets.

    Big water boats: Literally hundreds to choose from with 12-16 deg dead rise and an inboard. You will have a lot more used boats to sift through and may be able to save some money that way. You will still need 22' or more boat to haul 6 people and gear with any authority. The big boys often have a big block. Careful of the 460, parts are getting hard to find, especially manifolds. If this is your route, then it comes down to money and how new you want your boat and power plant.

    I am not sure of the 773, 212, AT debate and the ability to digest trash. If you get a used boat, then the decision is often made for you.

    Good luck.

    What are you doing anyways? Just curious

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outaways View Post
    Thanks to all of you for your input. I will run the boat in the Great Lakes from a marina with 18” to 24” inches of water over a sand-silt bottom to an outpost 5 miles away. No rivers, on occasion long 6’ rollers or a 3’ chop, but most often 1’ to 2’ chop and may encounter the occasional sandbar with as little as 6” of water, but most likely 12” to 16” over it. Hole shot would be over the 18” to 24” sand-silt bottom. Payload would be 6 plus supplies for 3 to 4 days. Will encounter the odd small floating weed mass after a serious blow and may cruise over weed beds 12 inches below the surface. Top end speed is unimportant and would like to cruise at about 3000 to 3500 rpm - 25 mph or thereabouts and not get too beaten up by the chop. Suspect the 14 degree dead rise and 72” bottom would be best. There seem to be many engine and drive combinations available and despite the number of SJ 200's being offered in the 19’ to 20’ range, I am not convinced that they are ideal for what I believe I need. Have heard that the 212 may vacuum the bottom in the marina and on takeoff. As for 3-stage pumps, who makes and what engine combination might work? Suggestions, advice & experiences would be of interest. Thanks.
    Depending on the occasional sand bar, Sounds like you need a prop and a lift........
    “Nothing worth doing is easy”
    TR

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outaways View Post
    Thanks to all of you for your input. I will run the boat in the Great Lakes from a marina with 18” to 24” inches of water over a sand-silt bottom to an outpost 5 miles away. No rivers, on occasion long 6’ rollers or a 3’ chop, but most often 1’ to 2’ chop and may encounter the occasional sandbar with as little as 6” of water, but most likely 12” to 16” over it. Hole shot would be over the 18” to 24” sand-silt bottom. Payload would be 6 plus supplies for 3 to 4 days. Will encounter the odd small floating weed mass after a serious blow and may cruise over weed beds 12 inches below the surface. Top end speed is unimportant and would like to cruise at about 3000 to 3500 rpm - 25 mph or thereabouts and not get too beaten up by the chop. Suspect the 14 degree dead rise and 72” bottom would be best. There seem to be many engine and drive combinations available and despite the number of SJ 200's being offered in the 19’ to 20’ range, I am not convinced that they are ideal for what I believe I need. Have heard that the 212 may vacuum the bottom in the marina and on takeoff. As for 3-stage pumps, who makes and what engine combination might work? Suggestions, advice & experiences would be of interest. Thanks.
    Based on what your wanting I'd suggest the 212 with a 6.0L or diesel capable of pushing the T3.4kw impeller. The hamilton is much better suited for pushing the loads, quieter, less expensive to rebuild the impeller if needed, and a phenomenal reverse. I'd also look at the North River Seahawk inboard for your application with the 18 degree deadrise. It would handle the chop well on the lakes.

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