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Thread: Would this have been a justifiable DLP situation?

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    Question Would this have been a justifiable DLP situation?

    So I had a situation with a bear in my yard yesterday that left me with some questions. I have a small shop and during the summer I store my trash can in the shop. Yesterday I needed to use my table saw, as I said it's a small shop, to get make room to roll my saw out for use I needed to move the trash can to the car port. Mayby 8 ft from the door of my shop. I rolled the can out and got the saw in place, as I was adjusting the angle of my saw blade I heard a noise. I looked up and there was a bear trying to get into my can 8ft away from me. The only thing I had available was two short pieces of 2x4 so I yelled and banged the wood together. The bear looked at me and walked about 15 ft away and stopped. I yelled some more and he started to walk back towards the can. At that point a lady jogged past my driveway with two dogs and the bear ran around the other side of my house.

    I went into the house to see if he was just in the back yard and didn't see any sign of him so I shrugged and went back out to the shop to work. I got outside and the bear had run around the house and was back by the trash can. I yelled at him again and he went about 20 yrds and sat down like a dog on the front porch of my back shed and wouldn't move.

    At this point I was trying to decide what to do. My first reaction was to grab a gun, but laziness took hold of me and I realized I had a lot to do yesterday and didn't want to deal with a dead bear. So I grabbed the bear spray and went back out. He was still sitting on the porch like dog. I readied the bear spray and started to walk towards him. He circled around the shed and stopped in my side yard so I walked towards him again. After playing cat and mouse for a few minutes I was able to force him away from my property. I feel that because of his persistent nature (he was never aggressive just persistent and unafraid) I would have been justified in shooting him. But the trash can thing makes me wonder what LE would have interpretted it as. The can wasn't secured in a bear proof place (my shop) but it was closely attended (me running power tools less than 10 ft away). What do you guys think?


    As as side note, SSS is not an option.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

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    Member TWB's Avatar
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    Default Would this have been a justifiable DLP situation?

    Scare it off. Sure you were startled, just as much as the bear.

    Would be different if the bear clawing its way into the shop to get to the trash. Only issue is now the bear knows he can sometimes find a trash can at your place.
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

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    His immediate attraction to the trash can tells me my neighbors are less secure with their trash than I am. From the time I pulled the can out of my shop to seeing the bear clawing at the can was less than 5 minutes. he was probably in the yard and I didn't even notice. That bear didn't look too scared, more like he was sad to get caught.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

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    Was it a black bear or a grizzly bear? There should never be a reason to have to DLP a black bear since there is no closed season for them in 90% of the state keep a current black bear tag and if you do HAVE to shoot one you can keep it.

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    Good post. I certianly don't think you could defend a DLP shooting simply because the bear was hanging around and showing interest in your garbage can. True it's possible this bear will eventually become a problem to be dealt with, but that's not a forgone conclusion, and is irrelevent to the point of your question. Sure, his behavior was cause for concern, but he simply by virtue of his presence was not threatening life nor property.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsj425 View Post
    Was it a black bear or a grizzly bear? There should never be a reason to have to DLP a black bear since there is no closed season for them in 90% of the state keep a current black bear tag and if you do HAVE to shoot one you can keep it.
    Black bear, season is closed for a couple more weeks here.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

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    Pose this to the "Ask a Trooper forum ", and see what their response is.

    I think between the OP and the other responses, the answers are at hand.

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    I am temporarily living in Juneau at the moment and had a bear last night around 10 pm work pretty hard at getting to my trash can also.
    What's strange is there should be enough fish in the streams, but I guess they are too lazy to walk to the streams. **** welfare dependents
    As to your question, I would think you could make a case for being concerned for your safety while being outside, but not for simply having a bear go through your trash can and sit on the porch. I think he could fine you for having trash outside on a non-pickup day, but at the end you would have shot the bear in defence of your life, which should be legal.

    From what i've been told, both F&W and JPD want you to call them if there is a problem bear, or a bear that does not leave the area. I think most of them deep down inside want to shoot problem bears, just hate the paperwork.

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    I happened to run into a friend that works for ADF&G keeping track on problem bears in Juneau after this happened so I filled her in. She gets tasked with trapping and euthanizing these guys.
    I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

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    Member Bullelkklr's Avatar
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    hey vadim - There really is too many of those obamabears lazing around..........

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    The laws regarding bears, and blaming bear problems on garbage, has made things more difficult than they oughta be.

    Logically, you would be justified in shooting it, and everyone would be safer and better off for it. BUT, legally, you could be in Hot Water, so I understand why you hesitated. I probably would not have shot it either. Unless the season was open, and I could have done it safely.

    Any bear, hanging around, especially a Blackie, is a threat, "by their very presence". The fact that it wasn't very afraid, is great cause for concern.

    You could argue that this particular bear was interested in garbage, but if you encounter such behavior out in the wilds, be certain, he's interested in YOU, for the same reason he'd be interested in garbage.

    Food is food, to a bear, and you're on the same level as garbage to them, no matter where you're at.

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    So did you try the spray at all on it? I think most biologists would have applauded doing so and conditioning the bear to the cost associated with human interaction. You would have gotten into trouble had you shot it, but I don't think you should since bears are just not ever going to be compatible with a residential neighborhood. Keep an eye open as it may be back and condition it heavy and hard next time it comes by and wont move on.
    Science has a rich history of proving itself wrong.

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    I'm sorry....8' away is too da*n close...!!!
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    I feel that because of his persistent nature (he was never aggressive just persistent and unafraid) I would have been justified in shooting him. But the trash can thing makes me wonder what LE would have interpreted it as. The can wasn't secured in a bear proof place (my shop) but it was closely attended (me running power tools less than 10 ft away). What do you guys think?
    couple points here... i read this as a blackie not a grizz...

    in town i would have walked up and smacked him with the 2x4 when his head went in the trash... you forced him off and displayed aggressive behavior... and became the dominant animal.. so he left.. 7 years in Valdez taught us this...

    HOWEVER.. the behaviour you describe.. in the WILD.. is the scary one.. it has been these times and behaviors that black bears attack. they are the most unpredictable when no other food source is there... because they are looking at YOU as the food.. in the woods with this kind of behavior i would have shot and filled in the paperwork... later. no questions no hesitation.. i have on two occasions dwelt with blackies in this mode.. both ended up skinned, once he was after me, and another he was after a hunter in the next camp when i came up on them.

    its always a good thing to use other then lethal means in housing areas.. people just don't like it.. neither does the LEO. if he becomes and issue.. let the Dept deal with it.

    It has been my experience Grizz DO NOT act in the non-shalaunt way as they blackies do.. they run or they defend, even if a bluff to test you.. blackies will circle and come in behind you, right over your roof if your not watching.. as was found out by a couple in glenallen in the early 80's... a bear spent all day stalking a husband and wife.. and finally got her ON the roof of the cabin where she was taking shelter.

    there are a dozen folks here on the forum that have been put back into campers by a steady eyed non-shalaunt bear walking up onto them.. and then jumping when feet away...


    the difference here is he was looking for the good thing in the trash and not willing to work real hard for it.. thats why we can walk up on them in bait sites and have them sit 30 feet away while we finish filling the bait. there is food enough there.. and like all animals.. have a pecking order to follow... and the big dog always eats first.


    BTW when i say I WOULD have.. i mean ... I ...

    i don't recommend it for just anyone. did watch a neighbor use a cast iron skillet once.. thats a little short for my taste.
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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    I think once its in the trash its right close to public property and for sure when it hits the curb so you are not really protecting anything.Also not a threat to you as you were chasing it and could of went into the house and called 911. On the flip side there is illegal feeding of wildlife and harassment of game that and officer looking to score points could bring against you.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    If the Anch PD can shoot humans carrying sticks or BB guns...............you should be able to shoot a bear looking cross eyed at you over the trash. But I think you made the better decision.
    Besides, if you had shot the bear...............Nick Jans would have written about you in Alaska Magazine!! Haha!
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
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    Great summery Vince, nicely said.

    Sums some of the differences of being in town and out of town. Here in Los Anchorage, we are expected to let the PoPo deal with this stuff or we get in some hot water. Things may be different the further out of town you get and especially in the woods.

    It is kinda creepy when wildlife does not play by the rules. Town bears and moose are like that, they are way more unpredictable than out in the wild.


    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    couple points here... i read this as a blackie not a grizz...

    in town i would have walked up and smacked him with the 2x4 when his head went in the trash... you forced him off and displayed aggressive behavior... and became the dominant animal.. so he left.. 7 years in Valdez taught us this...

    HOWEVER.. the behaviour you describe.. in the WILD.. is the scary one.. it has been these times and behaviors that black bears attack. they are the most unpredictable when no other food source is there... because they are looking at YOU as the food.. in the woods with this kind of behavior i would have shot and filled in the paperwork... later. no questions no hesitation.. i have on two occasions dwelt with blackies in this mode.. both ended up skinned, once he was after me, and another he was after a hunter in the next camp when i came up on them.

    its always a good thing to use other then lethal means in housing areas.. people just don't like it.. neither does the LEO. if he becomes and issue.. let the Dept deal with it.

    It has been my experience Grizz DO NOT act in the non-shalaunt way as they blackies do.. they run or they defend, even if a bluff to test you.. blackies will circle and come in behind you, right over your roof if your not watching.. as was found out by a couple in glenallen in the early 80's... a bear spent all day stalking a husband and wife.. and finally got her ON the roof of the cabin where she was taking shelter.

    there are a dozen folks here on the forum that have been put back into campers by a steady eyed non-shalaunt bear walking up onto them.. and then jumping when feet away...


    the difference here is he was looking for the good thing in the trash and not willing to work real hard for it.. thats why we can walk up on them in bait sites and have them sit 30 feet away while we finish filling the bait. there is food enough there.. and like all animals.. have a pecking order to follow... and the big dog always eats first.


    BTW when i say I WOULD have.. i mean ... I ...

    i don't recommend it for just anyone. did watch a neighbor use a cast iron skillet once.. thats a little short for my taste.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullelkklr View Post
    hey vadim - There really is too many of those obamabears lazing around..........
    I like the way you put that!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    as was found out by a couple in glenallen in the early 80's... a bear spent all day stalking a husband and wife.. and finally got her ON the roof of the cabin where she was taking shelter.
    I remember this.....didn't the guy go for help and the bear ended up killing his wife...???
    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    I think it was 89 or 90 it happened
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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