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Thread: Best auto pocket pistol?

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Default Best auto pocket pistol?

    The news of the horror in Colorado got the wife and I talking about protection and specifically our responsibility to be ready and able to protect our family from the unlikely event that we be confronted by an individual hell bent on hurting us. We currently have a full size XD for me and a Kimber ultra-carry 1911 for her. We do carry them when we feel there is an elevated risk but frankly they are big which takes planning to conceal and limits our clothing choices. We are considering a smaller more concealable package that will just fit with pretty much any clothing choice. The big thing we both agree on is no revolvers and we prefer some sort of a "real" safety though if not available would make do with carrying on an empty chamber.

    Cheap to shoot would be a big plus with easy to get ammo would be a big plus so that we can afford to practice with them a great deal.

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    Member akdodger's Avatar
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    I really love the G-29 compact 10mm for something with considerable punch, large capacity, and ease of concealment. Another favorite of mine is the HK USP in .45 auto or .40 cal. My .02 cents

    dodger

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    Why no revolver? You;ve already got the 45 Autos covered. I have a Ruger P345 and a Colt Det Spc, 38. Depending on the time of year and occasion determines what I carry. Someday I'd like to get my hands on a snubbie that Taurus made a few years back in 45 Colt. They made a stainless and a Titanium model.
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    Pends on budget. Kahr or Rohrburgh(Sp??) come to mind - my choice would be the Kahr P380, just on the fence about buying one right now. Obviously many, many are very happy with Ruger LCP and Keltec P3AT. The thing to consider is that they are a handful to shoot and 32 may be a better choice for a 'belly gun'.
    Now if you look at the 'Batman massacre', Columbine, Virginia Tech etc, then a pocket 380 would not have had the desired effect (pocket guns notoriously hard to shoot accurately past the magic 21 ft) and you would have wished you were carrying the XD.
    I have a service XD9 that I have grip chopped to take subby mags. This carries great in a Crossbread Supertuck even in just jeans and a t-shirt.
    Hence why I am on the fence about dropping the $$ on a pocket gun - may end up carrying too small a gun. Dunno!

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    Take a look at CDNN online, they have a bunch of pocket guns on good prices at the moment. Also none of the pocket semis are cheap to shoot any more.

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    I am going to look at the little Keltec and Ruger LCP for sure. Honestly it is the same deal as bear protection, the gun you have sure beats the gun at home or in the truck. Honestly if I was in that theater making wishes then I would skip right to my AR15 or Mossberg 12ga.

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    Don’t know if it’s the best but I like my LC9 quite a lot, I pack LC9 in summer because it’s very easy to hide and a little pocket 357 Smith in winter to get through winter clothing. Had I been in the Colorado deal I don’t know a snubby 9mm/357 would have been much use on a body armored nut job but I have no trouble holding 6” @ 20 yards when the target isn’t shooting back.

    I suspect if anyone had shoot back at that guy at all he would have gone the other way at least. He picked place very unlikely that anyone would be armed and dressed in all that armor plus the fact that he let the cops take him alive makes me think he had no intent of getting himself heart. So I bet he wouldn’t stay where anyone was shooting back at him.
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    You might want to include the Kahr CW9 on your list. I've found it accurate to shoot, just big enough to handle well, and very easy to conceal. It's my favorite carry gun now.

    A good friend recommended it to me, and while in Anchorage a couple years ago I handled one while browsing in S.W. Loved the feel of it, and with my friend's recommendation as a knowlegable gun guy with LE experience, I made the buy. Super happy I did. Allows me to carry pretty much anytime I want in a belt holster, pocket holster, fanny pack, backpack, etc, which sounds like what you are wanting to do.

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    I have been pondering this myself and was looking hard at a Walther PPS then a Kahr PM or MK, then I looked at S&W MP shield which apperently has a striker fired trigger, maybe similar to a Glock? I dont just learing up on semi autos......... Anyway, the guy behind the counter at Sentry showed me the diffrence between the trigger pull and travel between DAO and striker, and am now considering the Smith.
    What say you guys? Is there any advantage over DAO worth considering?
    “Nothing worth doing is easy”
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    I'm a big fan of the Sig P232 and it's predecessor P230.

    Small, easy to shoot (for a pocket sized piece anyway, most of notoriously hard to shoot), very well made, well engineered and mine are dead nuts reliable. If you MUST have a manual safety the quite similar (but inferior IMHO) Walther PPK has one. A little heavy compared to newer polymer designs but some things are worth a few ounces to tote something that feels like a real gun.

    .380s are on the small side ballistically but most BGs aren't in the mood for incoming fire. Heck, if I know theres's gonna be a gunfight I'd stay home and send the SWAT team.

    The idea of an body armor wearing, M4 toting psycho in a packed theater is pretty dramatic and just hard to prepare for without looking like Robocop for a night on the town. Of course shooting it out with that psycho with a .380 isn't high in my list of stuff to do but I'd rather go out boots on and barrel smoking than cowering and hiding behind the popcorn bucket. More mundane (and infinitely more common) scenarios are generally solved with "had a gun" rather than uber magnums...

    my .02.
    "I do not deal in hypotheticals. The world, as it is, is vexing enough..." Col. Stonehill, True Grit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akgramps View Post
    I have been pondering this myself and was looking hard at a Walther PPS then a Kahr PM or MK, then I looked at S&W MP shield which apperently has a striker fired trigger, maybe similar to a Glock? I dont just learing up on semi autos......... Anyway, the guy behind the counter at Sentry showed me the diffrence between the trigger pull and travel between DAO and striker, and am now considering the Smith.
    What say you guys? Is there any advantage over DAO worth considering?
    Firstly I'd go back to the store and inform the guy that the Shield is a DAO pistol which just happens to be striker fired!! Same as an XD and many ppoly semis!!! Just a fact that some DAO triggers are better than other. Benefit on a carry gun is that you have no 'manual' safties and all you have to do is pull the trigger.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nbh40 View Post
    Firstly I'd go back to the store and inform the guy that the Shield is a DAO pistol which just happens to be striker fired!! Same as an XD and many ppoly semis!!! Just a fact that some DAO triggers are better than other. Benefit on a carry gun is that you have no 'manual' safties and all you have to do is pull the trigger.
    A bit of mis information. XD is not DAO I meant to quote LC9, Taurus Slim and similar ultra compact poly guns.
    Most full sized poly semis are SAO, notable exceptions being Glock and Sig.

    The shield confuses because it also has a thumb safety which makes many think it is a SA gun. But this id for the same reason the Taurus Slim has a thumb saftey; the DAO trigger is that good that an additional safety is deamed necessary to prevent accidental discharge. But in a carry gun all you want is to have to pull the trigger and not be fiddling with a thumb safety.

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    I've been so pleased with my little 8 shot Taurus 22 mag, that sometime in the future, I'm going to get the 2 in. ultralight version with adjustable sights. With speer gold dots, you'd see 1200 fps from a 2" barrel. I'm seeing 1400 fps from a 4" barrel. There's been about 1,500 rds fired through mine so far, not one malfunction. Misfires occasionally with CCI though.

    http://www.taurususa.com/product-det...adcrumbseries=

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    Quote Originally Posted by nbh40 View Post
    Firstly I'd go back to the store and inform the guy that the Shield is a DAO pistol which just happens to be striker fired!! Same as an XD and many ppoly semis!!! Just a fact that some DAO triggers are better than other. Benefit on a carry gun is that you have no 'manual' safties and all you have to do is pull the trigger.
    I may have confused the issue as I try to learn the different triggers on these semis, I realize the Shield is DAO, what was brought to my attention more than anything was the length of the trigger pull. The Shield was much shorter than the Kahr............are they both striker fired.........?
    “Nothing worth doing is easy”
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuJon View Post
    The news of the horror in Colorado got the wife and I talking about protection and specifically our responsibility to be ready and able to protect our family from the unlikely event that we be confronted by an individual hell bent on hurting us. We currently have a full size XD for me and a Kimber ultra-carry 1911 for her. We do carry them when we feel there is an elevated risk but frankly they are big which takes planning to conceal and limits our clothing choices. We are considering a smaller more concealable package that will just fit with pretty much any clothing choice. The big thing we both agree on is no revolvers and we prefer some sort of a "real" safety though if not available would make do with carrying on an empty chamber.

    Cheap to shoot would be a big plus with easy to get ammo would be a big plus so that we can afford to practice with them a great deal.
    When I "needed" a pocket pistol I carried a Seecamp 32 Auto and I carried it everyday, everywhere. I looked at a number of options and couldn't find anything close. I sold the Seecamp several years ago, but if I were in the market I'd go with Seecamp again, only this time it would be in .380. In the years since, the competition has closed the gap with Seecamp and other pocket pistols are more popular. Still there are none smaller, more reliable or more concealable, if you eschew a holster, than the LWS.
    Foolishness is a moral category, not an intellectual one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akgramps View Post
    I may have confused the issue as I try to learn the different triggers on these semis, I realize the Shield is DAO, what was brought to my attention more than anything was the length of the trigger pull. The Shield was much shorter than the Kahr............are they both striker fired.........?
    Yes they are as I understand it.

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    OK posting late on Saturday night is never a good idea and my recent ramblings are proof of that. So now for a more objective viewpoint. To set the groundwork, I love semi autos, just cos of lack of time with wheel guns. I own plenty of full size and also a Taurus Slim 709 (single stack ultra-compact 9mm). I LOVE the looks and feel of the new XDs (single stack ultra compact 45).

    BUT. I now realize that I can carry (in the right holster) a full size XD just as easily as my Taurus Slim. The Slim offers me no advantages in clothing types, only gives me 8 rounds and lives in the safe mostly. Reliabilty of it has been great BUT, I should have bought a snubby 38. They conceal as well and offer the reliability of a wheel gun.
    IMO as a semi lover and owner of a Taurus Slim - these guns are a fad that offer no real advantage over a full sized in terms of concealability. Kinda like when cellphones went all tiny until we realised that we could not see the screens and they got all big again.

    BUT, the pocket 380s (and even 32, 25, 22 etc) offer a huge advantage over the Slim, LC9, Shield etc................you can just put em in your pocket. So they will go with you far more often.

    So IMHO, if you are looking at the Slim, LC9, Shield then go buy a snubbie 38 for the same concealability and increased reliability.

    If'n ya really want a SD gun that you WILL take everywhere, then one of the pocket 'mouseguns' is the only way to go. Caliber is your choice, but an easily shootable 22 that you can easily achieve headshots (or very rapid, accuracte COM follow ups) is (again IMHO) just as effective as a 380 that is a handful and you only achieve mediocre COM shots - your choice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    I've been so pleased with my little 8 shot Taurus 22 mag, that sometime in the future, I'm going to get the 2 in. ultralight version with adjustable sights. With speer gold dots, you'd see 1200 fps from a 2" barrel. I'm seeing 1400 fps from a 4" barrel. There's been about 1,500 rds fired through mine so far, not one malfunction. Misfires occasionally with CCI though.

    http://www.taurususa.com/product-det...adcrumbseries=
    Mainer, you now have me shopping. Many people knock Taurus, I personally have great success with them. 8 Shot 22 Mag makes a whole host of sense. Jeeze out of a 2" barrel the flash and blast alone would send most BGs running!!

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    Here's a good bit of of objective stuff I dug up. The details are from some FBI report or other back in early 2000s.

    In real world shootings, the 32acp and the 380acp are virtually equal in effectiveness. In comparing both cartridges in real world shootings where only one round was fired and a solid torso hit was recorded, the best 32 round (a 60gr JHP) stopped the attack 63% of the time with 83 actual shootings studied. The best 380 round (90gr JHP) managed to stop the attack 69%-70% of the time out of 78 actual shootings studied. Worst rounds in both the 32 and the 380 were both FMJ rounds and the percentages were 50% and 51%, respectively. Just for comparison the best round out of a 2" 38spl managed 67% (LHP+P) and the worst managed 49% (LRN).

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    My favorite carry gun is a 1911, but there are times I prefer to carry smaller. I found the LCP just too small for my hand to shoot well at all so I sold it. I LOVE my shield and in fact got a second one for my left hand. They are very comfortable, accurate, and just a very nice gun at a great price. If you get to shoot one you will like it! I have no intention of using the safety as it is very small to be inobtrusive which I believe in a high stress situation would lead to not knocking it down- so I just carry it as most DA handguns. Finger off the trigger until ready to fire!

    There are many great smaller guns to be carried by owners who are looking for smaller ones for some situations- don't stress about which one is perfect because there isn't a perfect one. Just get one you like and practice with it...then actually carry it.

    I hope none of us are ever in a situation to need one but I would rather carry and not need it, than to need it and not have it!

    BEE

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