Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 76

Thread: Susitna River Dam proposal and pics of Devils Canyon

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    wasilla
    Posts
    697

    Default Susitna River Dam proposal and pics of Devils Canyon

    I came across this article which has a few cool pics of the Devils Canyon, which looks a bit different than the Susitna that most of us know.

    http://www.canoekayak.com/whitewater...na/#2917e43135

  2. #2
    New member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Eagle River
    Posts
    2,022

    Default

    Wow, the video had my adrenaline flowing just watching the kayakers run that canyon ! I have always thought that big whitewater kayaking must be one of the greatest adrenaline rushes in sports.

  3. #3
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default

    What you are watching, was documented deaths of those who attempted. Some of that footage, was the last moments of their lives before they died of a combination of relentless pounding into rocks, powerful hydraulics and asphyxiation.

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    wasilla
    Posts
    697

    Default footage

    No Mainer they all lived, and as far as I know Barney still lives, Blackadar died on the Payette

  5. #5
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default

    That's nice to hear, thanks for the correction. I thought those guys died. Must have been a different group of folks. Very few folks are born with that adrenaline craving gene.......to that irrational/extreme extent.

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    wasilla
    Posts
    697

    Default 2012 run

    Jeff Shelton posted his recent run of Devils Canyon on vimeo, it is on Tim Johnson's facebook, if you can find it watch it. It is huge water, even through the lens of a helmet cam.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    wasilla
    Posts
    697

    Default 2012 clip

    Here's the video


  8. #8

    Default

    What a great video of the canyon on Vimeo ... thanks for posting that. I have been enjoying alaskas rivers for many years and Devils Canyon really is sacred ground and you brought it to my front door!

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Eagle River, Alaska
    Posts
    102

    Default

    Now that's a wild ride!

  10. #10
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Delta Junction
    Posts
    4,078

    Default

    If you track the population of Anchorage, it's only grown by about 2500 people from 2010 to 2011. There is supposed to be a projected decrease for 2012.

    The Anchorage vicinity doesn't need the dam. Do they think we're stupid? I wonder where those massive power lines are going to run to?

  11. #11
    Member H20Dogg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    North Pole, Alaska, United States
    Posts
    265

    Default

    We could use some mega lines in fairbanks, we burn diesel and coal for our power, its spensive.


    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    If you track the population of Anchorage, it's only grown by about 2500 people from 2010 to 2011. There is supposed to be a projected decrease for 2012.

    The Anchorage vicinity doesn't need the dam. Do they think we're stupid? I wonder where those massive power lines are going to run to?

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    6,031

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by H20Dogg View Post
    We could use some mega lines in fairbanks, we burn diesel and coal for our power, its spensive.
    So, do you want to buy our dam project or not?

  13. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    If you track the population of Anchorage, it's only grown by about 2500 people from 2010 to 2011. There is supposed to be a projected decrease for 2012.

    The Anchorage vicinity doesn't need the dam. Do they think we're stupid? I wonder where those massive power lines are going to run to?
    First, a single year's population growth isn't statistically significant. That's why we conduct a census nationwide every decade. In 1960 Anchorage's population was 75,000, in 1970 it was 125,000, in 1980 it was 175,000, in 1990 it was 225,000, in 2000 it was 260,000, and in 2010 it was 290,000. This represents a population increase every decade for the past half century of 11% to a staggering 65%.

    Secondly, Alaska's population is expected to rise anywhere from 7% (low estimate) to as much as 60% (high estimate) by 2035, which is only 23 years away:

    http://labor.alaska.gov/research/pop/popproj.htm

    Thirdly, while Anchorage has represented approximately half of Alaska's population over that half century, Alaska is more than Anchorage, even if Anchorage's population likes to think otherwise. More, since Anchorage is now effectively hemmed in by state park and national forest, mountains, ocean, and military lands, and it has little open land left to fill in, it's population growth has already been stymied. Indeed, over 30% of Alaska's population growth in the past decade has been in the Mat-Su Borough, and that trend is going to accelerate.

    Fourthly, an electric intertie is already in place from Homer to Fairbanks. What is needed is utility service along the Yukon, including both electric and natural gas (even if just in the form of propane).

    That is, of course, only if you wish those in Alaska's Third World to reap the benefits of civilization.

    I'm not sure who "they" are, nor if they think "we're" stupid or not (I don't include myself in that "we"), but I'm rather happy that the proper considerations are being pondered by those "in power" so that we don't run out of power in the future.

  14. #14
    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Tanana Valley AK
    Posts
    7,217

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brain View Post
    First, a single year's population growth isn't statistically significant. That's why we conduct a census nationwide every decade. In 1960 Anchorage's population was 75,000, in 1970 it was 125,000, in 1980 it was 175,000, in 1990 it was 225,000, in 2000 it was 260,000, and in 2010 it was 290,000. This represents a population increase every decade for the past half century of 11% to a staggering 65%.

    Secondly, Alaska's population is expected to rise anywhere from 7% (low estimate) to as much as 60% (high estimate) by 2035, which is only 23 years away:

    ....but I'm rather happy that the proper considerations are being pondered by those "in power" so that we don't run out of power in the future.
    Perhaps our effort would be better spent focusing on population control and more efficient use of our resources. Attempting to keep up with the demand of an exponentially increasing population comprizing the most grossly wasteful consumers on the face of the earth is not sustainable.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
    #Resist

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Alexander Creek
    Posts
    1,192

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    Perhaps our effort would be better spent focusing on population control and more efficient use of our resources. Attempting to keep up with the demand of an exponentially increasing population comprizing the most grossly wasteful consumers on the face of the earth is not sustainable.

    I agree with this statement 100% !

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    AK
    Posts
    4,034

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    If you track the population of Anchorage, it's only grown by about 2500 people from 2010 to 2011. There is supposed to be a projected decrease for 2012.

    The Anchorage vicinity doesn't need the dam. Do they think we're stupid? I wonder where those massive power lines are going to run to?
    Keep in mind the electric utilities of the rail belt are fighting tooth and nail to get enough gas to keep the current and replacement (South Anchorage / Soldotna) generation sites producing power. The Susitna project is a means of diversifying the power supply of the railbelt, not expanding capacity for growth.

    Hydro projects are also much more friendly partners with renewables like tidal and wind since their efficiency is relatively stable across all levels of output, unlike gas/diesel units which have efficiencies over a wide range depending on output. For instance many older gas turbines use nearly as much gas at its minimum allowable operating output as at full load. The mechanical and thermal stresses of using gas/diesel based units to follow wind can cut the life of the units severely (1/3 or more).

    Something like 95% of the generation on the railbelt is natural gas. That lack of diversity could be very problematic should gas production again decrease in Cook Inlet. Current rates of new gass are something like 10 times lower than what's required to SUSTAIN current use, I shouldn't say current, that was the case a couple years ago, haven't got the numbers lately.

    Lastly, the cost of power from a hydro project is stable over a 50 year period versus the constant fluctuating cost we get with hydro carbon based units.

    Hope this is helpfull info.

  17. #17

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    Perhaps our effort would be better spent focusing on population control and more efficient use of our resources. Attempting to keep up with the demand of an exponentially increasing population comprizing the most grossly wasteful consumers on the face of the earth is not sustainable.
    This is a very remarkable reply. What effective population control measure do you think could work in a state with no income taxes except a negative tax, which results in that state paying all residents to reside there? And that's in addition to no property taxes in the unorganized areas of the state. More importantly, what effective population control measure do you think might survive a court challenge? Such a desire at a time when national borders are so politically leaky is amazing. We can't even seem to prosecute illegal aliens at the federal level, and the states are being aggressively leashed by the federal government regarding illegal immigration.

  18. #18
    Member Grayling Slayer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK
    Posts
    728

    Default Re: Susitna River Dam proposal and pics of Devils Canyon

    You do know that there are people who live outside Anchorage?

    My electric bill went up 6% in Fairbanks on September 1st. From GVEA, "Lack of available lower priced natural gas power from Anchorage is the number one reason for the increase." 80% of our power is now coal and diesel with rates going over .25 kwh with the latest increase. The state costs for low income energy assistance increased over $100 million in the last year alone. We can either make an investment in our future or watch our economy follow the path of the rest of the country.

    How do you suppose 330,000 workers in Alaska could pay for a $20 billion dollar state government when oil revenue drops off in the future? It's only going to cost us $60,000 each.
    "I'd rather be fishing!"

  19. #19
    Member Vince's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Fairbanks most the time, Ancorage some of the time,& on the road Kicking Anti's all the time
    Posts
    8,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Grayling Slayer View Post
    You do know that there are people who live outside Anchorage?

    My electric bill went up 6% in Fairbanks on September 1st. From GVEA, "Lack of available lower priced natural gas power from Anchorage is the number one reason for the increase." 80% of our power is now coal and diesel with rates going over .25 kwh with the latest increase. The state costs for low income energy assistance increased over $100 million in the last year alone. We can either make an investment in our future or watch our economy follow the path of the rest of the country.

    How do you suppose 330,000 workers in Alaska could pay for a $20 billion dollar state government when oil revenue drops off in the future? It's only going to cost us $60,000 each.
    while Anchorage gas is not taxed as is our heating fuel. Fairbanks has no subsidies for heat, and none planned in the future.
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

    meet on face book here

  20. #20
    Member Vince's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Fairbanks most the time, Ancorage some of the time,& on the road Kicking Anti's all the time
    Posts
    8,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    .

    The Anchorage vicinity doesn't need the dam. Do they think we're stupid? I wonder where those massive power lines are going to run to?
    today you may be correct... but Anchorage is suffering a lack of natural gas, and is working rather hard to ensure any bullet lines serve them first and foremost. There is a lot of work going into exploration of new gas fields in the SC regions, when the gas runs out of cook inlet? then what? i am sure they will let you all install wood stoves.
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

    meet on face book here

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •