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Thread: 358 Winchester Load Data 200 grain Accubond and 200 grain TTSX

  1. #1
    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    Default 358 Winchester Load Data 200 grain Accubond and 200 grain TTSX

    The last time (some of you may recall) I attempted to work up a 200 grain TTSX load, it was with the new Mr-2000 powder and it was too slow.

    I received the new 200 grain Accubonds a few days ago and finally got around to loading them with the new Reloader 10x powder.

    Beartooth claimed he got "just under 1" groups and 2629 fps with 52 grains of Tac powder (22" barrel). He used pressure equipment which put him at a mild 52,000 psi......promising. The reloader 10x is slightly faster burning than Tac, and here's what I could fit in the little case:

    200 gr. Accubond,
    CCI Bench Rest Primer,
    new .358 Winchester brass
    2.820" COAL/Crimped:
    45 grains (starting load)
    46 grains
    47 grains
    48 grains
    49 grains
    49.5 grains (slightly compressed)
    50 grains (compressed)

    200 gr. Tipped Triple Shock,
    CCI Bench Rest Primer,
    new .358 Winchester brass,
    2.810" Coal/Crimped. I had to go to a slightly shorter COAL because of the placement of the rings on these Barnes bullets:
    46 grains (starting load)
    47 grains
    48 grains (slightly compressed)
    48.5 grains (compressed)

    I'll fill in the blanks when I get to the range. Chronograph readings will be from a 20" barrel with a 3-groove 1:12" bore.

    I always put a 250 grain Speer Hot-Cor in the mix for perspective:

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    Beartooth claimed he got "just under 1" groups and 2629 fps with 52 grains of Tac powder (22" barrel). He used pressure equipment which put him at a mild 52,000 psi......promising. The reloader 10x is slightly faster burning than Tac, and here's what I could fit in the little case:
    This will be interesting. But my charge was not 52grains for 52,000cup, in fact 52grains was way over max.
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    Reaching 2629fps was reached under 51grs much less 52grs. As I said, it will be interesting seeing your results.
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    Member bigswede358's Avatar
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    Mainer i'm very interested to see your results. That bullet might be a good candidate out of my 350 rem mag as well, although it would be hard to beat the performance that I get from 225 Sierra's.
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    I just found this post and have done some loading with the new 10x powder, though not in the 358 Win but recently the 338 Federal. The 338 federal is the same case as the 358 Win (the 308 Win) and would respond similarly to this propellant.
    Max loads with the 338 Federal and 200 grain bullet was 38.6 grains giving 2450 fps. With the 225 grain bullet and 37.0 grains I got just over 2300 fps.

    It looks to me that your load data is little strong. My calculations and extrapolations give a max charge of 10X and the 200 grain bullet at about 45-46 grains for the 358. If this is your first venture with this combo check velocity. If you exceed 2600 fps with this combo you are likely at max pressure. Thats about the limit of the cartridge.
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    Those 338 Federal loads were anemic to say the least and I feel that reloader 10x may have been too fast of a powder for that particular 338 Fed rifle. I appreciate the theoretical warnings.

    All my load development is done with a chronograph, a hand lense and calipers.

    This particular rifle on one occasion, exhibited sticky extraction with Federal ammo (when it was originally a 308).

    Another thing I've observed, is that my original loads shoot about 100-130 Fps. faster in this rifle, as opposed to my prior .358 with identical barrel lengths. I attribute this to the 3-groove bore which according to some professional shooters, gives less pressure and more velocity than other rifling configurations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    Those 338 Federal loads were anemic to say the least and I feel that reloader 10x may have been too fast of a powder for that particular 338 Fed rifle. I appreciate the theoretical warnings.

    All my load development is done with a chronograph, a hand lense and calipers.

    This particular rifle on one occasion, exhibited sticky extraction with Federal ammo (when it was originally a 308).

    Another thing I've observed, is that my original loads shoot about 100-130 Fps. faster in this rifle, as opposed to my prior .358 with identical barrel lengths. I attribute this to the 3-groove bore which according to some professional shooters, gives less pressure and more velocity than other rifling configurations.
    What powder are you going to try out next? I think that accubond and the 358 winnie will be an awesome combo.
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    Member GD Yankee's Avatar
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    For all you 358 guys, Midway has blemished bullets on sale and there are a few 358 choices:

    http://www.midwayusa.com/find?promot...tNum=100355990

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    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    200 gr. Accubond,
    CCI Bench Rest Primer,
    new .358 Winchester brass
    2.820" COAL/Crimped:

    45 grains (starting load) 2594 fps, 2624 fps

    46 grains 2619 fps, 2624 fps

    47 grains 2660 fps, 2653 fps


    48 grains 2672 fps, 2661 fps

    49 grains 2721 fps, 2728 fps One hole group at 25 yds.

    49.5 grains (slightly compressed) not tested

    50 grains (compressed) not tested


    I feel going beyond 49 grains in this rifle isn't necessary, and at 49 grains, the primers were faintly cratered, but extraction was smooth. Much less cratering than I've experience with some factory loads. Mark my words: This powder is ideal for the .358 Winchester. Very little deviation, and completely fills the case with great velocity. I will load up again and test for accuracy at 48, 48.5, and 49 grains. I know it was only at 25 yds, but that one hole group looked promising for an old lever action.

    I only tested one Barnes 200 grain starting load. 46 grains put me right at 2609 fps. I'll test them when the bore is clean.

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    I bet you can get an easy 2900 f.p.s with that 358.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 323 View Post
    I bet you can get an easy 2900 f.p.s with that 358.
    No way n heck.....even if a I got bold and wore that "High Speed" under armor fleece you gave me.....still wouldn't do it. My old rifle was made around 67. Maybe in new rifle using resized Lapua 308 brass, but I aint going there......I'm satisfied.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    No way n heck.....even if a I got bold and wore that "High Speed" under armor fleece you gave me.....still wouldn't do it. My old rifle was made around 67. Maybe in new rifle using resized Lapua 308 brass, but I aint going there......I'm satisfied.
    You only live once oh well...

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    At 400 yds, this load would drop 27" with a 200 yd. zero, at this yardage, the bullet would drift somewhere around 17" with a 10 mph crosswind and it would be traveling 1,820 fps with 1471 ft. lbs of energy.

    In the right hands, the .358 Winchester would do sheep n goat work up here in Alaska no problem. Any clown should know yah need to compensate for wind anyhow. At the muzzle, this load has an energy of 3,287 ft. lbs.

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    Good work Mainer, that load data makes me want a 358 winnie even more. Thanks a lot.
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  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    No way n heck.....even if a I got bold and wore that "High Speed" under armor fleece you gave me.....still wouldn't do it. My old rifle was made around 67. Maybe in new rifle using resized Lapua 308 brass, but I aint going there......I'm satisfied.
    Very well said, no way 2900fps and I am glad things worked out for you. I will be looking for groups at 100yds, will be interested in that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by beartooth View Post
    Very well said, no way 2900fps and I am glad things worked out for you. I will be looking for groups at 100yds, will be interested in that.
    Thanks,
    That was 323 sarcasm, he gets crazy when he starts drinking his Zimas. Anyhow, I've got to put about 300-500 rds. through the new bore to break it in. I really feel yah gotta break in a bore if it isn't a shiny lapped bore. One more trip to the range with those swaged 286 grain woodleigh round nose, and I'll be done with load development. I'm hoping for 2,300 fps. Since I didn't have to compress the load, I may switch to match grade 308 Lapua brass, resized. I'm really impressed with the bench-rest primers, I believe they were partly responsible for such minuscule deviation.

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    Cool, sounds like you are just about there and ready to go. Bench-rest primers or match grade primers when I wrote Federal are the first run on the newly tooled up presses. They have the same stuff in them as the standard primers, the only difference is that they are suppose to be tighter tolerances coming off the newly tooled presses. I am getting with standard 210 Fed primers 9 extreme spread and 3 deviation, so it could and more than likely is the combination of powder and charge used, along with brass trim length, bullet and bullet depth along with primer in combination as all these components of the load chain respond to the chamber of your rifle.
    A GUN WRITER NEEDS:
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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    Thanks,
    That was 323 sarcasm, he gets crazy when he starts drinking his Zimas. Anyhow, I've got to put about 300-500 rds. through the new bore to break it in. I really feel yah gotta break in a bore if it isn't a shiny lapped bore. One more trip to the range with those swaged 286 grain woodleigh round nose, and I'll be done with load development. I'm hoping for 2,300 fps. Since I didn't have to compress the load, I may switch to match grade 308 Lapua brass, resized. I'm really impressed with the bench-rest primers, I believe they were partly responsible for such minuscule deviation.
    Zimas so good... You are more of a PBR type guy and probably have fridge full of TAB as well... Some advice when working around fiberglass wear a mask....

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